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crash bang
Joined: 11 Jul 2007
Location: gwangju
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 Posted: Tue Sep 23, 2008 12:13 pm Post subject: Hagwon vs public school |
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i used the search function and got the big blank white screen of death for my trouble, so please save the "GTFO N00B! THER AR OTHUR THREDZ ABOWT THIS TOPIC" responses for yo mama
anyways, i worked the hagwon circuit last year and have no complaints. im planning on coming back for a second round after christmas, and was considering the public school route
so, those of you who have done public school, would you recommend or not recommend it? why or why not?
if youve done hagwon and public school, how do they compare, in general? |
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Gamecock
Joined: 26 Nov 2003
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| Posted: Tue Sep 23, 2008 4:18 pm Post subject: |
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I was going to do a search and give you a list of links of the billions of threads on this subject...but i got the white screen as well. Therefore, I'll try to help you out a bit as most posters are weary of this topic...
I spent 3 years in hogwans and have now done 2 in public schools. There are great hogwans and great public schools and terrible hogwans and terrible public schools. It's always a bit of a risk, no matter how much research you do (a great hogwan can change overnight with a new manager, as can a PS change with a new principal, co-teacher etc. There is no guarantee).
I think the choice depends on what YOU want the most out of your job. I'm completely sold on the PS choice, because I'm weary of the hogwan games with money (in general) and feeling like a commodity to be sold at the whim of crazy mothers. Generally, you don't have to worry about money and benefit problems at a PS (although, again, there are exceptions). The teaching hours are generally alot less at a public school, although you will probably be stuck there from 9-5. The primary reason I would not go back to a hogwan is the vacation time. As someone who is going to be in Korea for a few years, it's important for me to be able to go home and spend 3-4 weeks (paid) a year with my family. This isn't generally an option at a hogwan. More and more rural public schools are offering quite alot of vacatin nowadays if you are willing to live outside the city. Public schools also have ALOT of random days off that don't count as vacation (school birthdays, an extra day or two for chuseok, etc.) There are also many activity days where you will be at school, but not teaching (sports days, picnics, field trips, fire prevention day, contests, etc.). Public schools don't have the "grind" of hogwans, IMO.
The upside to hogwans is smaller classes with higher level students. As far as teaching goes, this is a definite plus. Teaching at a public school is at a much more basic level, and you have to work a little harder to make the classes interesting for YOURSELF as well as for the students. If you don't supplement the classes with your own ideas and activities, I think teaching at a public school could become mind-numbing very fast. I do miss teaching my high-level hogwan students!
As well, many hogwans offer fewer hours onsite. A good hogwan will only have you at the school for 6 hours a day with minimal prep time (although most of the more financially secure, big-name hogwan chains expect a full 8 hour day of you, same as the public school). Are you a night owl? A morning person? I know alot of people who worked in hogwans who love working evenings, going out late, and sleeping in. I prefer having my evenings free, but generally I don't go out late at all during the week. It depends on your personality.
Hogwans also often have a built-in foreign community. In a public school you will probably be the only foreigner there. It can be a bit isolating if you don't want to throw yourself into the Korean culture whole-hog. Some people think this is great, some people hate it. I feel I have experienced more of Korean life by working in the public school and have made good friends among my co-teachers.
My experience in the public schools has been great and I'd highly recommend giving a public school a shot if you are a pretty independent person. I'm sure you will run into people who have had just the opposite experience as me. There are always extremes and exceptions, but I hope what I've shared helps in a general way. |
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mnhnhyouh
Joined: 21 Nov 2006
Location: The Middle Kingdom
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| Posted: Tue Sep 23, 2008 6:00 pm Post subject: |
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While I have only worked for one year in a good hagwon and am getting through my second in a high school, I feel like I would have written exactly what he^ said !!!
h |
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VanIslander
Joined: 18 Aug 2003
Location: Geoje, Hadong, Tongyeong,... now in a small coastal island town outside Gyeongsangnamdo!
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| Posted: Tue Sep 23, 2008 6:18 pm Post subject: |
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| Gamecock wrote: |
I spent 3 years in hogwans and have now done 2 in public schools. There are great hogwans and great public schools and terrible hogwans and terrible public schools. It's always a bit of a risk, no matter how much research you do (a great hogwan can change overnight with a new manager, as can a PS change with a new principal, co-teacher etc. There is no guarantee).
I think the choice depends on what YOU want the most out of your job. I'm completely sold on the PS choice, because I'm weary of the hogwan games with money (in general) and feeling like a commodity to be sold at the whim of crazy mothers. Generally, you don't have to worry about money and benefit problems at a PS (although, again, there are exceptions). The teaching hours are generally alot less at a public school, although you will probably be stuck there from 9-5. The primary reason I would not go back to a hogwan is the vacation time. As someone who is going to be in Korea for a few years, it's important for me to be able to go home and spend 3-4 weeks (paid) a year with my family. This isn't generally an option at a hogwan. More and more rural public schools are offering quite alot of vacatin nowadays if you are willing to live outside the city. Public schools also have ALOT of random days off that don't count as vacation (school birthdays, an extra day or two for chuseok, etc.) There are also many activity days where you will be at school, but not teaching (sports days, picnics, field trips, fire prevention day, contests, etc.). Public schools don't have the "grind" of hogwans, IMO.
The upside to hogwans is smaller classes with higher level students. As far as teaching goes, this is a definite plus. Teaching at a public school is at a much more basic level, and you have to work a little harder to make the classes interesting for YOURSELF as well as for the students. If you don't supplement the classes with your own ideas and activities, I think teaching at a public school could become mind-numbing very fast. I do miss teaching my high-level hogwan students!
As well, many hogwans offer fewer hours onsite. A good hogwan will only have you at the school for 6 hours a day with minimal prep time (although most of the more financially secure, big-name hogwan chains expect a full 8 hour day of you, same as the public school). Are you a night owl? A morning person? I know alot of people who worked in hogwans who love working evenings, going out late, and sleeping in. I prefer having my evenings free, but generally I don't go out late at all during the week. It depends on your personality.
Hogwans also often have a built-in foreign community. In a public school you will probably be the only foreigner there. It can be a bit isolating if you don't want to throw yourself into the Korean culture whole-hog. Some people think this is great, some people hate it. |
Thumbs up! One of the all-time best summarizes of the relative merits of hagwons versus public school. |
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frankhenry
Joined: 13 Mar 2007
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| Posted: Tue Sep 23, 2008 7:10 pm Post subject: |
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| Gamecock wrote: |
I was going to do a search and give you a list of links of the billions of threads on this subject...but i got the white screen as well. Therefore, I'll try to help you out a bit as most posters are weary of this topic...
I spent 3 years in hogwans and have now done 2 in public schools. There are great hogwans and great public schools and terrible hogwans and terrible public schools. It's always a bit of a risk, no matter how much research you do (a great hogwan can change overnight with a new manager, as can a PS change with a new principal, co-teacher etc. There is no guarantee).
I think the choice depends on what YOU want the most out of your job. I'm completely sold on the PS choice, because I'm weary of the hogwan games with money (in general) and feeling like a commodity to be sold at the whim of crazy mothers. Generally, you don't have to worry about money and benefit problems at a PS (although, again, there are exceptions). The teaching hours are generally alot less at a public school, although you will probably be stuck there from 9-5. The primary reason I would not go back to a hogwan is the vacation time. As someone who is going to be in Korea for a few years, it's important for me to be able to go home and spend 3-4 weeks (paid) a year with my family. This isn't generally an option at a hogwan. More and more rural public schools are offering quite alot of vacatin nowadays if you are willing to live outside the city. Public schools also have ALOT of random days off that don't count as vacation (school birthdays, an extra day or two for chuseok, etc.) There are also many activity days where you will be at school, but not teaching (sports days, picnics, field trips, fire prevention day, contests, etc.). Public schools don't have the "grind" of hogwans, IMO.
The upside to hogwans is smaller classes with higher level students. As far as teaching goes, this is a definite plus. Teaching at a public school is at a much more basic level, and you have to work a little harder to make the classes interesting for YOURSELF as well as for the students. If you don't supplement the classes with your own ideas and activities, I think teaching at a public school could become mind-numbing very fast. I do miss teaching my high-level hogwan students!
As well, many hogwans offer fewer hours onsite. A good hogwan will only have you at the school for 6 hours a day with minimal prep time (although most of the more financially secure, big-name hogwan chains expect a full 8 hour day of you, same as the public school). Are you a night owl? A morning person? I know alot of people who worked in hogwans who love working evenings, going out late, and sleeping in. I prefer having my evenings free, but generally I don't go out late at all during the week. It depends on your personality.
Hogwans also often have a built-in foreign community. In a public school you will probably be the only foreigner there. It can be a bit isolating if you don't want to throw yourself into the Korean culture whole-hog. Some people think this is great, some people hate it. I feel I have experienced more of Korean life by working in the public school and have made good friends among my co-teachers.
My experience in the public schools has been great and I'd highly recommend giving a public school a shot if you are a pretty independent person. I'm sure you will run into people who have had just the opposite experience as me. There are always extremes and exceptions, but I hope what I've shared helps in a general way. |
This sums-it-up well!
I prefer a good hogwan. But, you don't want to be rolling the dice and hoping you will luckily fall into a good hoggy. Good hoggys are 1/10, 1/20, hmmmm...you get the picture... It's best if you know someone already in Korea who can help you get into a good school, public or hogwan. |
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ttompatz
Joined: 05 Sep 2005
Location: Kwangju, South Korea
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| Posted: Tue Sep 23, 2008 7:21 pm Post subject: |
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I concur with the above with the addition:
The chances of getting a bad hakwon are about 75%. (that drops to about 50% if you are here and know what to look for)
The chances of having problems with pay and/or benefits at a hakwon are close to 90%. (that drops to about 50% if you are here and know what to look for)
The chances of getting a bad PS are about 25%
The chances of having problems with pay and/or benefits at a PS are about 15% (and there is a procedure to remedy said problems).
It is a crapshoot either way but the odds are in your favor at a PS and they definitely favor the house at a hakwon.
. |
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Yu_Bum_suk
Joined: 25 Dec 2004
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| Posted: Tue Sep 23, 2008 8:09 pm Post subject: |
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| Gamecock wrote: |
I was going to do a search and give you a list of links of the billions of threads on this subject...but i got the white screen as well. Therefore, I'll try to help you out a bit as most posters are weary of this topic...
I spent 3 years in hogwans and have now done 2 in public schools. There are great hogwans and great public schools and terrible hogwans and terrible public schools. It's always a bit of a risk, no matter how much research you do (a great hogwan can change overnight with a new manager, as can a PS change with a new principal, co-teacher etc. There is no guarantee).
I think the choice depends on what YOU want the most out of your job. I'm completely sold on the PS choice, because I'm weary of the hogwan games with money (in general) and feeling like a commodity to be sold at the whim of crazy mothers. Generally, you don't have to worry about money and benefit problems at a PS (although, again, there are exceptions). The teaching hours are generally alot less at a public school, although you will probably be stuck there from 9-5. The primary reason I would not go back to a hogwan is the vacation time. As someone who is going to be in Korea for a few years, it's important for me to be able to go home and spend 3-4 weeks (paid) a year with my family. This isn't generally an option at a hogwan. More and more rural public schools are offering quite alot of vacatin nowadays if you are willing to live outside the city. Public schools also have ALOT of random days off that don't count as vacation (school birthdays, an extra day or two for chuseok, etc.) There are also many activity days where you will be at school, but not teaching (sports days, picnics, field trips, fire prevention day, contests, etc.). Public schools don't have the "grind" of hogwans, IMO.
The upside to hogwans is smaller classes with higher level students. As far as teaching goes, this is a definite plus. Teaching at a public school is at a much more basic level, and you have to work a little harder to make the classes interesting for YOURSELF as well as for the students. If you don't supplement the classes with your own ideas and activities, I think teaching at a public school could become mind-numbing very fast. I do miss teaching my high-level hogwan students!
As well, many hogwans offer fewer hours onsite. A good hogwan will only have you at the school for 6 hours a day with minimal prep time (although most of the more financially secure, big-name hogwan chains expect a full 8 hour day of you, same as the public school). Are you a night owl? A morning person? I know alot of people who worked in hogwans who love working evenings, going out late, and sleeping in. I prefer having my evenings free, but generally I don't go out late at all during the week. It depends on your personality.
Hogwans also often have a built-in foreign community. In a public school you will probably be the only foreigner there. It can be a bit isolating if you don't want to throw yourself into the Korean culture whole-hog. Some people think this is great, some people hate it. I feel I have experienced more of Korean life by working in the public school and have made good friends among my co-teachers.
My experience in the public schools has been great and I'd highly recommend giving a public school a shot if you are a pretty independent person. I'm sure you will run into people who have had just the opposite experience as me. There are always extremes and exceptions, but I hope what I've shared helps in a general way. |
Mods, this should be a sticky. It's the best, most succinct summary I've seen on this matter. |
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Dances With Wolves
Joined: 06 May 2008
Location: A galaxy far, far away!
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| Posted: Tue Sep 23, 2008 9:30 pm Post subject: |
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| I love my public school gig. Everything is great! Go for a public school. |
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thatwhitegirl
Joined: 31 Jan 2007
Location: ROK
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| Posted: Tue Sep 23, 2008 9:43 pm Post subject: |
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Such a crap shoot! It really depends if you get a good howan/good public school.
In our town, my husband and I have the best public school gig. We went through a recruiter rather than EPIK, and got a MUCH better deal than we would have. We don't have to stay if we don't have class, and after 20 hours of winter/summer camps, the rest is our holiday.
But my friend is over at the girl's high school, and she got the short end. She has to sit in the office all day, every day, and they won't let her leave during lunch. She has to teach evening classes, and they loan her out to other schools to do extra elementary classes and to the community center for adult classes. They have jerked her around with holidays and sick days, her apartment is a dump, and they just don't help her out at all. She also gets a measly sum of money.
It really depends! I would recommend the public school route just for the security and stability. HOWEVER....go through a recruiter instead of EPIK/GEPIK, so you'll know where you're going, and can talk to the current FT.
But if you're only coming over here for a year and just want to make money and are not too concerned with holidays...go for the hogwan.
Whatever you do, just do your homework. Most of the people I've talked to who have had bad experiences just didn't do any research and just took the first offer they got. Read the FAQ stickies, and scan the thread subjects in this forum.
Good luck |
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chachee99
Joined: 20 Oct 2004
Location: Seoul Korea
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| Posted: Wed Sep 24, 2008 4:57 am Post subject: |
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| I've never had the honor of working at a hogwan so i can't say much about it personally. However, most of my friends are currently working at hogwans. Some like it, some don't. I work at a public school and think it's great. Yes the class size is bigt and sometimes can be difficult to control, but once you get hang of it, it is quite easy. I have 4 co-teachers and a head teacher to deal with and don't have any problems with any of them. My principal and vice principals have been great too. I work 20 classes a week and each week. I teach grades 3 and 5 one week and 4 and 6 the next week. Basically I repeat the same lesson 8 times. It's be very repetitive so my goal is to make the lesson interesting and enjoyable to escape bordom. It is a little extra work, but it is much better in the long run. |
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bogey666
Joined: 17 Mar 2008
Location: Korea, the ass free zone
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| Posted: Wed Sep 24, 2008 5:16 am Post subject: |
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| thatwhitegirl wrote: |
It really depends! I would recommend the public school route just for the security and stability. HOWEVER....go through a recruiter instead of EPIK/GEPIK, so you'll know where you're going, and can talk to the current FT.
Good luck |
I work at a PS, which I chose over a hogwon after talking to the prior FT. The opportunity to talk to the FT there (we corresponded via e-mail) made me feel a lot more relaxed about what I was getting myself into.
I went thru a recruiter (off an ad on this site btw)
Knowing what I know now I would NEVER EVER place myself at the mercy of Gepik or epik or what have you. Each school is different.. and I want to know what that school is like.. best way to find out is talking to current FT.
(however, as others note.. PS change too... new principal or vp or even new co teachers and things may change). I love my current VP.. but if I get some dickhead down the road, I'm outta here (was told the one before this one was referred to as ___head.) |
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polonius
Joined: 05 Jun 2004
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| Posted: Wed Sep 24, 2008 7:37 am Post subject: |
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| ttompatz wrote: |
I concur with the above with the addition:
The chances of getting a bad hakwon are about 75%. (that drops to about 50% if you are here and know what to look for)
The chances of having problems with pay and/or benefits at a hakwon are close to 90%. (that drops to about 50% if you are here and know what to look for)
The chances of getting a bad PS are about 25%
The chances of having problems with pay and/or benefits at a PS are about 15% (and there is a procedure to remedy said problems).
It is a crapshoot either way but the odds are in your favor at a PS and they definitely favor the house at a hakwon.
. |
I think your numbers are off here. While I agree that there are the shady enterprises out there, I wouldn't say that 75% of them are bad. Furthermore, I highly doubt that 90% are screwing people over on pay/benefits. In my neighborhood there are over 20 English academies, and I have only heard of one of them messing with the pay/benefits.
I agree with Gamecock, although I have never worked at a PS in my 6+ years here. I get to see the growth in my students which I doubt I would see in the PS system. That is the biggest benefit I receive. |
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Juke John
Joined: 20 Nov 2007
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| Posted: Wed Sep 24, 2008 7:50 am Post subject: |
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| Dances With Wolves wrote: |
| I love my public school gig. Everything is great! Go for a public school. |
Wait until you try to renew your contract. |
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Seon-bee
Joined: 24 Jan 2003
Location: ROK
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| Posted: Wed Sep 24, 2008 7:55 am Post subject: |
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A good, reliable hagwon beats a PS any time. The satisfaction of a job well-done, seeing progress being made, and teaching in small classes rates very highly for job satisfaction.
Don't care about the status a PS gig offers. |
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Voyeur
Joined: 19 Jun 2003
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| Posted: Wed Sep 24, 2008 8:50 am Post subject: |
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Gamecock has a good summary but it doesn't really touch on the financial issues.
If you can't get extra classes at your PS and you aren't on an F4 to do privates, 1.8 /mo at SMOe or whatever it is in SEOUL that offers 1.8 to start, well, no matter how much time you have off that might not pay the bills.
OTOH some people get lots of extra classes to teach and make pretty nice change at PS. |
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