Korean Job Discussion Forums

VanIslander

Is America a third world country?

Do they really give a damn about democracy?

I cannot fathom how hi-tech machines could be used without at least the mandated backup plan of paper and pencil on hand in case of machine malfunction.

mises · Joined: 05 Nov 2007 Location: retired

We have a few threads on this already. Rant there, eh.

Tiger Beer · Joined: 07 Feb 2003

It's a huge country.

I worked for the Elections Department in San Francisco one voting season.

They plan and plan and plan, but election night itself is a complete mess. Most of it is because election workers aren't generally all doing this all the time. It is temporary work, so you basically have to be between jobs to get the job working for the elections department.

Then election night, you have multitudes of workers running all around the city, many unsure where all the precincts are at, and running around trying to find them. It is a madhouse. The mass majority of people on election night itself are volunteers, opening up their house as a polling station, working at the booths, etc.

The election I worked, on election night itself, I had a van and a partner, and we had to run around to various precincts restocking everything in case of emergency. Every kind of failure you can imagine to happen, does happen! Each precinct is different. Every range of possibility happens that you wouldn't expect.

I think if you wanted election night to be a well-oiled machine, you would have to have the election workers practice the event everyday for 4 years, as well as all of the many people who open up their homes, and all of the volunteers who manage each polling station, and on and on. In short, having it run absolutely smoothly, just won't happen.

JBomb · Joined: 16 Oct 2008

With all the worries about hacking electronic voter booths, have you ever read about the wonderful vote box stuffing that has occurred even in Canada?

Gopher · Joined: 04 Jun 2005

What are you, VanIslander, antimodern and mistrustful of technology?

VanIslander · Posted: Tue Nov 04, 2008 7:23 pm Post subject:

i was a chief election officer in Toronto in 1997 and i ensured we had plenty of extra paper ballots and a procedure for getting more if necessary

it's mickey mouse management to rely on technology WITH A TRACK RECORD OF FAILURE including very recent known problems WITHOUT A BACKUP PLAN!

imagine if lotteries were run like elections in America Laughing

checks and balances isn't rocket science

Gopher · Joined: 04 Jun 2005

ReeseDog · Joined: 05 Apr 2008 Location: Classified

VanIslander · Posted: Tue Nov 04, 2008 7:39 pm Post subject:

Tiger Beer · Joined: 07 Feb 2003

I wouldn't be able to answer for that specific precinct that ran out of paper. But one city will have 1000s and 1000s of precincts.

Weird things happen...the machine doens't work, and then ALL OF THE BALLOTS are paper until someone gets out there.

Where I worked, people had backup vans among the precincts and were on call to deliver supplies ASAP.

Difficult to say about OP's case specifically, but I would find it hard to imagine that ALL precincts across the entire nation would run perfectly with NO problems whatsoever.

You are talking about election workers, many volunteers, and Election Day, as much as you can prepare for it for full-time workers, it is still like 'the first day on the job' for a significantly high percentage of the people involved in the process.

bacasper · Joined: 26 Mar 2007

Of course there should be paper backups.

I worked a few elections in NYC back in the day. Between the primaries and school board elections, workers could be called to work up to 3 or even 4 elections per year. In fact, I was working the special election on Sept. 11, 2001 which was either a pre-primary or a run-off, I forget which. (It was rescheduled.)

A lot of the workers you'd see regularly. And you were supposed to attend training, too, to earn your $130 for the day. Sure, for the newbies it could be confusing, but those who were there year after year knew pretty much what to do. I thought it was enough to run relatively smoothly.

Ya-ta Boy · Joined: 16 Jan 2003 Location: Established in 1994

Over the decades there has been a growing mistrust of government and one aspect of it is the concern about stolen elections and voter fraud. Since elections are the very essence of democracy, it is just common sense to do whatever is necessary to reassure the public that elections are as safe and honest as it is humanly possible to make them. If that means returning to paper and a pencil, so be it.

khyber · Joined: 16 Jan 2003 Location: Compunction Junction

They have the those multiple choice test scanners. Why couldn't they work?

ulsanchris · Joined: 19 Jun 2003 Location: take a wild guess

Personally I think the US has a messed up voting system. They should have a separate ballot for the presidential candidates and put an X next to the name you want to vote for. IF it is not an X it doesn't count. The counting of the ballots can then be monitored by representatives of different parties. That way everybody knows that no fraud has occurred. It is a rather simple plan and one that is rather hard to mess up.