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ManintheMiddle
Joined: 20 Oct 2008
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 Posted: Sun Dec 28, 2008 11:55 pm Post subject: |
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NoExplode wrote:
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| Pretty surgical too, out of 225 bodies so far, only 15 have been women or children. Mighty efficient combatant to civilian ratio! |
I've heard this too, although not with specific numbers. What's your source? The BBC staff is just eating up the propaganda being spewed on Al-Jazeera about this situation (I've been viewing all the major networks the past few days, so this isn't just idle talk).
sharkey plotted:
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| doing exactly what israel wants, divide them up |
Man, you really give Mossad a lot more credit than I would. Didn't know they were that good at manipulating public opinion among the Palestinians. 
Anyway, Israel wants to engage Abbas and the West Bank Palestinians, not alienate them. Next thing you'll be saying that financier Bernard Madoff was at their beck and call too. |
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Jeff's Cigarettes
Joined: 27 Mar 2007
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| Posted: Mon Dec 29, 2008 1:51 am Post subject: |
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| The jooos are high tech well tooled modernists that mean business and pack a punch....Hooray for Israel! |
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Jandar
Joined: 11 Jun 2008
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| Posted: Mon Dec 29, 2008 2:55 am Post subject: |
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Would Abbas betray Hamas in Exchange for Jerusalem?
In a heartbeat. |
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agentX
Joined: 12 Oct 2007
Location: Jeolla province
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| Posted: Tue Dec 30, 2008 7:48 am Post subject: |
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http://english.aljazeera.net/news/middleeast/2008/12/200812306307620900.html
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But Israel said there would be no let up until the threat of Palestinian rockets attacks from the Gaza Strip had been removed.
"There is no room for a ceasefire," Meir Sheetrit, Israel's interior minister, said.
"The government is determined to remove the threat of [rocket] fire on the south.
"Therefore the Israeli army must not stop the operation before breaking the will of Palestinians, of Hamas, to continue to fire at Israel." |
Problem is that tough talk and tough action don't always net results. They're talking tough but everybody knows that if they don't completely eliminate Hamas they are screwed and will have another Intifatah on their hands. Remember the Second Lebanon War? How'd that work out? Hezbollah is still there. Unless Israel is prepared to go all the way, they'll be faced with a similar situation.
In the meantime, Hamas is ready and willing for a ground war against Israel. Is Israel walking into a well-placed trap? Were the militant rockets merely bait?
http://haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1051024.html
Every so often some people talk about moving the Jews from the Middle East to bring peace to the region. Why not move the Palestinians? |
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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| Posted: Fri Jan 02, 2009 4:26 am Post subject: |
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| agentX wrote: |
http://english.aljazeera.net/news/middleeast/2008/12/200812306307620900.html
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But Israel said there would be no let up until the threat of Palestinian rockets attacks from the Gaza Strip had been removed.
"There is no room for a ceasefire," Meir Sheetrit, Israel's interior minister, said.
"The government is determined to remove the threat of [rocket] fire on the south.
"Therefore the Israeli army must not stop the operation before breaking the will of Palestinians, of Hamas, to continue to fire at Israel." |
Problem is that tough talk and tough action don't always net results. They're talking tough but everybody knows that if they don't completely eliminate Hamas they are screwed and will have another Intifatah on their hands. Remember the Second Lebanon War? How'd that work out? Hezbollah is still there. Unless Israel is prepared to go all the way, they'll be faced with a similar situation.
In the meantime, Hamas is ready and willing for a ground war against Israel. Is Israel walking into a well-placed trap? Were the militant rockets merely bait?
http://haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1051024.html
Every so often some people talk about moving the Jews from the Middle East to bring peace to the region. Why not move the Palestinians? |
Hamas is nowhere as tough and as disciplined as Hezbollah. The Economist had a good article on this, which concluded that Israel had a better chance at making a go of this as opposed to Lebanon |
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Jandar
Joined: 11 Jun 2008
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| Posted: Fri Jan 02, 2009 7:40 am Post subject: |
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| agentX wrote: |
http://english.aljazeera.net/news/middleeast/2008/12/200812306307620900.html
| Quote: |
But Israel said there would be no let up until the threat of Palestinian rockets attacks from the Gaza Strip had been removed.
"There is no room for a ceasefire," Meir Sheetrit, Israel's interior minister, said.
"The government is determined to remove the threat of [rocket] fire on the south.
"Therefore the Israeli army must not stop the operation before breaking the will of Palestinians, of Hamas, to continue to fire at Israel." |
Problem is that tough talk and tough action don't always net results. They're talking tough but everybody knows that if they don't completely eliminate Hamas they are screwed and will have another Intifatah on their hands. Remember the Second Lebanon War? How'd that work out? Hezbollah is still there. Unless Israel is prepared to go all the way, they'll be faced with a similar situation.
In the meantime, Hamas is ready and willing for a ground war against Israel. Is Israel walking into a well-placed trap? Were the militant rockets merely bait?
http://haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1051024.html
Every so often some people talk about moving the Jews from the Middle East to bring peace to the region. Why not move the Palestinians? |
Your Question: Why not move the Palestinians?
Has been answered before, It's been tried in both Jordan
and Lebanon in both cases they started a civil war. |
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agentX
Joined: 12 Oct 2007
Location: Jeolla province
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| Posted: Sat Jan 03, 2009 8:38 am Post subject: |
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| Then stick 'em somewhere else then. |
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Hater Depot
Joined: 29 Mar 2005
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| Posted: Sat Jan 03, 2009 8:56 am Post subject: |
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| Steve wrote: |
| Anyway, Israel wants to engage Abbas and the West Bank Palestinians, not alienate them. |
Toppling Fatah didn't work out so great for Israel. I'm not sure what makes them think toppling Hamas will have better results. |
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JMO
Joined: 18 Jul 2006
Location: Daegu
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| Posted: Sat Jan 03, 2009 11:09 am Post subject: |
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delete.
Last edited by JMO on Sat Jan 03, 2009 6:22 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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RJjr
Joined: 17 Aug 2006
Location: Turning on a Lamp
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| Posted: Sat Jan 03, 2009 2:01 pm Post subject: |
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| The biggest irony of this war is that it's fought in the Holy Land by creationists who, by their actions, prove that we human beings are mere animals. Actually, the dogs in Israel and Gaza probably act more domesticated than the humans. |
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RJjr
Joined: 17 Aug 2006
Location: Turning on a Lamp
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| Posted: Sat Jan 03, 2009 4:25 pm Post subject: |
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| JMO wrote: |
I'm not advocating this but..
if you are hamas you have take this from a different angle. No rockets. Bombs in highly dense civilian areas in Israel and the US(jewish targets) would break them given enough time and with enough repetition. Terrorism works, time to use it against superior technology.
Of course this course of action would result in alot more bloodshed but it would level the playing field. |
But Benjanjamin Netanyahu says that Islamic terror attacks on innocent Americans are "good for Israel."
http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/975574.html
Hopefully Hamas will just leave us alone and maybe someday AIPAC will leave us alone too. |
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JMO
Joined: 18 Jul 2006
Location: Daegu
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| Posted: Sat Jan 03, 2009 4:53 pm Post subject: |
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delete
Last edited by JMO on Sat Jan 03, 2009 6:30 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Gopher
Joined: 04 Jun 2005
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| Posted: Sat Jan 03, 2009 4:56 pm Post subject: |
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| agentX wrote: |
| Is Israel walking into a well-placed trap? Were the militant rockets merely bait? |
Yes on both counts.
Hamas has deliberately incited and lured the Israelis in and has consequently and intentionally placed the Palestinian people in the line of fire. Hezbollah did the same thing two-and-a-half years ago. In any case, they follow classic guerrilla hearts-and-minds tactics: once the Israelis attack, the Palestinians can decry their victimhood and maneuver to gain world sympathy against Israel, they hope.
That is the name of the game here, and it has played out many times before, and in many other contexts. This is not a military war inasmuch as a propagandistic struggle for the moral high ground.
The Israeli govt appears to simply intend to cut through all of that on a limited mission to secure its territory from further attacks. It probably intends to disable Hamas's military capabilities.
We must wait and see what happens over the next few weeks or months. This will be no in-and-out operation. Tel Aviv has moved in on the ground and is activating reservists. It has also moved forces to the Lebanese border in case Hezbollah moves there. Look for a brutal, protracted urban war here. Decry it all you like; Hamas has systematically asked for it.
________
JMO: if you desire to advise the other side on strategy and tactics, including escalating terrorist attacks, then by all means, go ahead and walk the walk. Talk is cheap. And should you go, I wish you the best of luck. You will find no caves to flee to and hide in over there when we come after you for what you will have done. |
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JMO
Joined: 18 Jul 2006
Location: Daegu
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| Posted: Sat Jan 03, 2009 5:44 pm Post subject: |
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delete.
Last edited by JMO on Sat Jan 03, 2009 6:22 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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Gopher
Joined: 04 Jun 2005
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| Posted: Sat Jan 03, 2009 5:53 pm Post subject: |
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"I'm not advocating this...but I am. Terrorism works; it levels the playing field." It also triggers increasingly severe responses, JMO. If Hamas attacked densely-populated Israeli cities, do you honestly believe, knowing what you know about Israel, that Tel Aviv would cave? This would likely represent the end of Palestinian autonomy for all time, if not the end of the Palestinians themselves. And the Israelis would be right to do it.
In any case, disclaimers are always pathetic. And this one that you employ here is even more pathetic than most. |
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