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afsjesse
Joined: 23 Sep 2007
Location: Kickin' it in 'Kato town.
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 Posted: Tue Mar 03, 2009 12:06 am Post subject: Different PS Startt time everyday |
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So my school told me that I will be teaching 4 hours of afterschool classes this semester. My initial reaction was "cool, overtime!"... or so I thought.
I am only teaching 18/22 class hours this term! They said that due to lack of funding they cannot pay me overtime. Because of this they are changing my starting time for work everyday except for Thursday. Normally I work 8:30-4:30. They now want to change it to the following.
Monday: 10-6
Tuesday: 9-5
Wednesday: 10-6
Thursday: Same
Friday: 9-5
I don't have a big problem with these changes but this is the thing I want to solve. I don't want to work until 6. So I suggested letting me teach 7th hour from 3:40-4:30 and I leave as usual. They have an issue with this because they claim some students would be able to leave earlier than others..... They want to argue equality in a country that is all about social statues etc.....
I don't teach past 3:40 and sit at my desk twidling my thumbs.... so I want to utilize my time.
Any thoughts? |
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TBirdMG
Joined: 09 Dec 2006
Location: SF, CA, USA
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| Posted: Tue Mar 03, 2009 9:08 am Post subject: |
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| Your contract should stipulate the standard hours of work for teaching purposes, and for most PSs, it's 8-4, 8-5, or something like that. I have never seen a PS contract whose hours extended past 5:00. Of course, there is a clause that says you must work after hours on special occasions, but that is meant to be the exception to the rule, and NOT the rule itself. Go look at the contract. If the 22 teaching hours don't occur during the regular school schedule....then it's OT pay, or you can confidently refuse. Just hold up the contract and let the other teachers/principal figure out how to reconfigure your schedule. That's 80% of what PS teachers do, anyways: just juggle the daily schedule. |
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D.D.
Joined: 29 May 2008
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| Posted: Tue Mar 03, 2009 1:33 pm Post subject: |
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Never allow after school classes and regular classes to be mixed. Believe me they are making money on those after school classes and you deserve your share.
After school classes are an option? Say no and they will soon offer you cash . School has set hours and they can't change or manipulate that for their own benefit.
Remember they are getting extra money for those classes and they don't want to share with you. |
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teachergirltoo
Joined: 28 Oct 2006
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| Posted: Tue Mar 03, 2009 2:55 pm Post subject: |
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| This scenario sounds very similiar to one a friend of mine experienced at her public elementary school recently. She did what the above posters advised - told them her contract stipulates her day starts at 8:30 and ends at 4:30, and also told them all the after school classes would have to be paid as overtime (the schools are paid by the parents for these classes). As the above posters said, they quickly figured out how to make it work according to her contract, and come up with the money for overtime. |
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afsjesse
Joined: 23 Sep 2007
Location: Kickin' it in 'Kato town.
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| Posted: Tue Mar 03, 2009 3:28 pm Post subject: |
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This is what my contract says
Article 8, Section 2
"The work hours of employee may follow normal work schedule of civil servants of the Korean Government, howerver, such work hours may be adjusted by employer as he/she deems appropriate."
So it seems I"m screwed either way. Contractually speaking they can do whatever they want. I can refuse but I don't want to cause a stink. And they said they have no money for overtime..... I can't really go up to them and say "Yes you do and you know it" can I? |
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sobriquet
Joined: 16 Feb 2007
Location: Nakatomi Plaza
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| Posted: Tue Mar 03, 2009 3:39 pm Post subject: |
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| afsjesse wrote: |
This is what my contract says
Article 8, Section 2
"The work hours of employee may follow normal work schedule of civil servants of the Korean Government, howerver, such work hours may be adjusted by employer as he/she deems appropriate."
So it seems I"m screwed either way. Contractually speaking they can do whatever they want. I can refuse but I don't want to cause a stink. And they said they have no money for overtime..... I can't really go up to them and say "Yes you do and you know it" can I? |
And you signed that? More fool you. |
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afsjesse
Joined: 23 Sep 2007
Location: Kickin' it in 'Kato town.
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| Posted: Tue Mar 03, 2009 3:42 pm Post subject: |
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| It's a first year PS contract, I wasn't exactly in a negotiating position as they could have rejected me and moved on to another applicant. |
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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| Posted: Tue Mar 03, 2009 6:11 pm Post subject: |
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| teachergirltoo wrote: |
| This scenario sounds very similiar to one a friend of mine experienced at her public elementary school recently. She did what the above posters advised - told them her contract stipulates her day starts at 8:30 and ends at 4:30, and also told them all the after school classes would have to be paid as overtime (the schools are paid by the parents for these classes). As the above posters said, they quickly figured out how to make it work according to her contract, and come up with the money for overtime. |
And that is why they now have this clause in GEPIK and EPIK contracts that the hours can be changed at the principal's discretion.
And for all the people that are saying that the hours can't be changed...yes they can that is a standard clause in most P.S contracts.
Some people may be lucky and that clause may have been left out...but they are likely the exception rather than the rule.
As for the OP as long as you are working no more than eight hours a day, there is not much you can do. You could always pitch a fit and maybe they will relent...or maybe fire you. Or you could just suck it up...I'd love to come in at 10, and get my shopping and banking done beforehand, instead of using my lunch hour to do it.
Speaking of which there is a story I have you might benefit by. My school approached me about using my lunch hour (well part of it) for having the students practice conversation with me. This is because I only have 10 classes per week. When I asked why they couldn't do it another time, they said that all other teaching slots were full, whereupon I pulled out the contract which stipulated that I had my lunch hour off.
I eventually agreed to this on the conditions that: (A) I get twenty minutes to eat my lunch first and brush my teeth. (B) That these count as part of my contracted classes(5 per week) (C) That these "classes" last no longer than 30 minutes instead of the typical 45.
Not the best solution (for me) but better than what I might have gotten from stamping my feet and screaming no. And it wasn't like it didn't happen already anyway as the students always wander into the teachers' room after lunch...and then make a beeline for my desk. This just makes it official.
And call me crazy, but I have a strong suspicion that these "lunch classes" will slowly peter out on their own as the novelty of speaking to a foreign teacher wears off...and if it doesn't I can always give it a helping hand. 
This is not to say that you should never refuse certain requests that are unreasonable. On another thread I posted about saying "No" to a request that I come in at 7 AM, unpaid to start a "Reading club". I pointed out that my contract says I work eight hours and that if they want me in at 7AM I will go home at 3 PM. Haven't heard any more about THAT idea.
So what's the point of all this?
It's all about "playing the game" and quickly thinking about what you can do to turn the situation in your favour (see what I said about the "lunch classes". Instead of a blunt refusal I made it sound like I was doing them a favour without giving up more then 1-2 months of part of my lunch hour. And this should make it easier for ME to ask for favours should a situation come up when I need it.
But that's just me. Others will no doubt scream "Apologist" and proudly relate about how they NEVER compromise. As there is of course no way to verify this...all I can say is good luck with that attitude.
Last edited by TheUrbanMyth on Tue Mar 03, 2009 6:38 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Scouse Mouse
Joined: 07 Jan 2007
Location: Cloud #9
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| Posted: Tue Mar 03, 2009 6:37 pm Post subject: |
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I had a similar problem with my public school last year. I told them I was happy to teach whatever classes they wanted, but that I needed to have the same start and finish time every day. If they wanted me to work 10-6, I would be working that time every day. If they want 8--4 (as they did some days), then I would work those hours every day. Just make it clear that they can not treat you as a flexi-time worker. Of course, they will have already told the parents that you will do it, so by challenging them you will cause a loss of face, but they should back down. If they don't, just get your times mixed up a few times a week (arrive at 10 on a few days where you should be starting at  . Make sure you cell is switched off and don't answer your door though  |
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Scouse Mouse
Joined: 07 Jan 2007
Location: Cloud #9
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| Posted: Tue Mar 03, 2009 6:38 pm Post subject: |
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| Oh... as for the clause about hours being changed - they can be changed, but they should still be the same time every day. This was confirmed by the Education Office and they supported me when I said no. |
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fromtheuk
Joined: 31 Mar 2007
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| Posted: Tue Mar 03, 2009 6:40 pm Post subject: |
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| I've never had this problem at my GEPIK elementary school. It's because my Principal is not interested in anything which requires extra effort on his behalf. |
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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| Posted: Tue Mar 03, 2009 6:59 pm Post subject: |
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Yeah well my Principal is an altruistic kind of guy (the lunch hour thing was his idea)...a lot of our students come from broken homes (according to my co-teachers) so they don't get a lot of care. He recently renovated the school so that their classrooms would have heat...of course they keep it cranked hot enough to boil water...  |
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