Korean Job Discussion Forums

[warmachinenkorea]

I am not an Obama hater and I don't post here often so please be gentle. I was a SPED teacher back home so I do know about real teaching and I agree that the U.S should move away from the old agriculture school calender (I'm a country boy from TN so I hear all the stories from my parents and grandparents about how they would get out of school to chop cotton and do farm work) but of all places Obama could use as an example why choose South Korea? Thsi articel is about more than that the end is where he talk about SK.

Any one got any ideas the U.S should change and be more like any other country?




Obama backs teacher merit pay, charter schools
By LIBBY QUAID � 1 hour ago

WASHINGTON (AP) � President Barack Obama called for tying teachers' pay to students' performance and expanding innovative charter schools Tuesday, embracing ideas that have provoked hostility from members of teachers unions.

He also suggested longer school days � and years � to help America's children compete in the world.

In his first big speech on education, Obama said the United States must drastically improve student achievement to regain lost international standing.

"The future belongs to the nation that best educates its citizens," he said. "We have everything we need to be that nation ... and yet, despite resources that are unmatched anywhere in the world, we have let our grades slip, our schools crumble, our teacher quality fall short and other nations outpace us."

His solutions include teacher pay and charter school proposals that have met resistance among members of teachers unions, which constitute an important segment of the Democratic Party.

Obama acknowledged that conflict, saying, "Too many supporters of my party have resisted the idea of rewarding excellence in teaching with extra pay, even though we know it can make a difference in the classroom."

Despite their history on the issues, union leaders publicly welcomed Obama's words, saying it seems clear he wants to include them in his decisions in a way President George W. Bush did not.

"We finally have an education president," said Randi Weingarten, president of the 1.4 million-member American Federation of Teachers. "We really embrace the fact that he's talked about both shared responsibility and making sure there is a voice for teachers, something that was totally lacking in the last eight years."

The president of the 3.2 million-member National Education Association, Dennis van Roekel said, "President Obama always says he will do it with educators, not to them."

"That is a wonderful feeling, for the president of the United States to acknowledge and respect the professional knowledge and skills that those educators bring to every job in the school," van Roekel said.

Van Roekel insisted that Obama's call for teacher performance pay does not necessarily mean raises or bonuses would be tied to student test scores. It could mean more pay for board-certified teachers or for those who work in high-poverty, hard-to-staff schools, he said.

However, administration officials said later they do mean higher pay based on student achievement, among other things.

"What you want to do is really identify the best and brightest by a range of metrics, including student achievement," Education Secretary Arne Duncan told The Associated Press in a brief interview.

White House press secretary Robert Gibbs said certification is part of the mix. "But the president believes that school systems can work with teachers and parents to come up with a system that rewards our best teachers with more pay for their excellence in the classroom."

The union leaders also liked that Obama took on Republicans in his speech, saying the GOP has refused to spend more money on early childhood programs despite evidence they make a difference.

There also has been considerable friction over charter schools, which are publicly funded but operate independently, free from some of the rules that constrain regular schools. Many teachers are concerned that such schools drain money and talent from regular schools.

However, Obama said state limits on numbers of charter schools aren't "good for our children, our economy or our country." He said many of the innovations in education today are happening in charter schools.

Obama addressed the U.S. Hispanic Chamber of Commerce, a setting intended to underscore the need to boost academic performance, especially among Latino and black children who sometimes lag behind their white counterparts.

President George W. Bush's No Child Left Behind law aimed to close that achievement gap, but progress has been slow, and Obama says his administration can do better. None of what he outlined Tuesday was new; his education agenda reflects Obama's campaign platform.

Broadly speaking, Obama wants changes at every level from before kindergarten through college. He is putting special focus on solving the high school dropout crisis and pushing states to adopt more rigorous academic standards.

Some of his promises already are in the works: Public schools will get an unprecedented amount of money � double the education budget under Bush � from the economic stimulus bill over the next two years. To get some of those dollars, Obama and Duncan insist states will have to prove they are making good progress in teacher quality, on data systems to track how students learn and on standards and tests.

After the scheduled event, Obama made a surprise visit with Duncan to a meeting of state school chiefs at a Washington hotel. Duncan said last Friday that states will get the first $44 billion by the end of the month.

Obama also wants kids to spend more time in school, with longer school days, school weeks and school years � a position he admitted will make him less popular with his school-age daughters.

Children in South Korea spend a month longer in school every year than do kids in the U.S., where the antiquated school calendar comes from the days when many people farmed and kids were needed in the fields.

"I know longer school days and school years are not wildly popular ideas, not with Malia and Sasha," Obama said as the crowd laughed. "But the challenges of a new century demand more time in the classroom."

"If they can do that in South Korea, we can do it right here in the United States of America," Obama said.

[michaelambling]

[ernie]

i've been out of elementary/middle/high school for a long time, but i sure as hell don't remember wasting nearly as much time as they do here in korea. almost 2 months off from the end of december to the beginning of march, another month off in the summer, and random weeks after exams devoted to killing time. education in north america isn't the best, but the korean system is definitely not any better. the emphasis should be on using time more efficiently, rather than simply using more time.

[warmachinenkorea]

I agree that they waste too much time here. Even though my HS says it's on break the kids still have supplemental class but they do nothing the teacher waitsuntil the bell rings and waltz into class 5 min. after the bell then just bark at them. More class time is not better nor does more money equal a better education.

What is the Scandinavian model?

[Xuanzang]

I think we spend more than enough time in school. It's just the funding needs to be increased and used better than before. Scandinavia's education system is unique to there. Trying to transplant it has failed before eg. in the UK. We should be improving what we have.

[warmachinenkorea]

I agree that we need to do morewith whatwe have but studies have shown that more money doesn't equal results. I have seen people teaching the test here in Korea and have been told by K teachers that they feel that the students are not taught how to apply their knowledge to real life situations. Adults have told me, from their own school experiences, that they feel that the systems here hinders students from ever becoming self reliant adults. College is apparently a big shock to most Koreans or so I have been told.

[RufusW]

[Yesterday]

[cvmurrieta]

I think Obama may have been misinformed by his speech writers or other staff who did the research.

[Yu_Bum_suk]

You can do a lot of things in SK you can't in the States.

[Wisconsinite]

Too often education in America is compared to education in Asia simply because of test scores. It's a shame because if Obama actually walked into a Korean public school and really spent time there he would realize that we don't want education like Korea. If Obama spent time in an actual American classroom, he would see that the root of the problem isn't the number of days but the lack of resources, lack of prof. develoment, and many times the teacher feeling completely overwhelmed with the task at hand with almost no support. I think Obama has his head in the right place but he's trying to make too much change that may end of derailing the whole thing.

[Doutdes]

Also the performance pay for public school teachers in Korea is a joke,. Each school creates its own criteria to determine whether teachers receive an A, B or C rank. At my gf's school 30% of the rank was determined by seniority and another 10% was based upon whether you had used your vacation days. None of the ranking criteria was based upon student performance or job performance. Needless to say, all the old teachers received an A mark and all the young teachers received a C mark.

[Robot_Teacher]

Interesting, I didn't know the American school year calendar stems from agrarian times, but I like that school year calendar as you get a Spring break, long Summer break, Christmas break, and many 3 and 4 day weekend holidays such as Easter, Memorial Day, Thanksgiving, and Labor Day which are all normally scheduled out to be 3 or 4 day weekends. This is good for everyone as it allows us time to have a life outside of school/work and mentally recharge. Korea needs to go to school more in the Winter, take an April Spring break to appreciate Spring festivals like cherry blossom and then take a long Summer break to enjoy outdoor activities. Korea wastes too much time at school and work to make it worthwhile as people tend to perform better with sprinting rather than long runs. School has been in session for going on 2 weeks now and the curriculum, class schedules, and school calendar are not fully planned out yet. I'm still not teaching a PS class, but I don't mind free time, becuase I know it'll be 18 more weeks with only 1 holiday that falls on a Tuesday in May. 2 weeks have been wasted that could had been used for April Spring break had we started teaching on March 2nd. Last week, many kids were still playing in the streets and not yet all in school with parents bring children in one by one so school really hasn't started, but is fixing to kick into high gear.

Missouri recently enacted a 4 day school week which allows districts to voluntarily go on a 4 day schedule intended to help cash strapped rural schools with families who may benefit from their children doing farm work on Fridays. I think it's a great idea, except in the case where a kid has only 1 single working parent lacking the time to spend with their kid or who have to pay extra day care. This means 32 fewer days of school each year as the school year is 32 weeks. Almost makes me want to go back to Missouri to teach. I feel the agrarian calendar is right for America as it appears America is about to become an agrarian country again as people will be heading back to the farm or family property to live off of natural resources. Possibly going back to the basics.

Can you beat $24,000 (lowest rural pay) to $42,000 (city pay) a year pay for a 4 day work week offering about 20 weeks free time? My 5 day a week job in Korea pays less than $20,000 at $18,500 considering take home pay, pension, and 1 month severance at 1500/won to the dollar. Also the job at home offers like $4000 bonus payment to my student loans per year and will pay to study for a masters degree if signing on for 3 to 5 years. I'm seriously considering becoming a HS science teacher, even if it does mean going up to a 40 week PS school year as Obama would like to see. And Obama is trying to rural teacher pay raised.

This is something for Americans to seriously consider as a career opportunity where you'll be able to fly or drive home for 4 day weekends and do BBQ, fishing, camping, and talking in familiar places. I can see my living abroad is causing me to miss out on being a part of peopel's lives who mean a lot to me. You don't have to be in Korea or Asia to travel, becuase many American teachers do travel during their long breaks while others study or teach Summer school. Many of my teachers, professors, advisors, and principals I had over the years traveled the world.

[berrieh]

Delete... Deleting (mostly) all posts... Mods please delete

[jvalmer]

I think Scandinavian country's low population has a big impact on education and how people view it. Put Sweden's, Norway's, Denmark's and Finland's populations together barely reach 25 million. 4 different countries with 4 different eduction policies that fit their populations.

You need to fix or modify what you have with some borrowing here and there. And either way, you won't know the results until 12 years later.