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3MB
Joined: 26 Mar 2009
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 Posted: Mon Mar 30, 2009 8:15 pm Post subject: |
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How is it rape? How was she coerced.
Rape means the use of force against an unwilling person. Was she unwilling? Was she held down and forcefully raped? She knew the reality of the business. She would have to have been stupid not to. Was she coerced? Perhaps she was. She must have known that to become a star she would have to do things that she wouldnt like, but was she forced to do them? Did anyone put a gun to her head? Calling this rape is offensive to women to actually have been raped. This is a case of a girl going along with things because she wanted to be the next starlet, and then having doubts and feelings of shame for having done those things. |
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antoniothegreat
Joined: 28 Aug 2005
Location: Yangpyeong
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| Posted: Mon Mar 30, 2009 8:39 pm Post subject: |
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| 3MB wrote: |
How is it rape? How was she coerced.
Rape means the use of force against an unwilling person. Was she unwilling? Was she held down and forcefully raped? She knew the reality of the business. She would have to have been stupid not to. Was she coerced? Perhaps she was. She must have known that to become a star she would have to do things that she wouldnt like, but was she forced to do them? Did anyone put a gun to her head? Calling this rape is offensive to women to actually have been raped. This is a case of a girl going along with things because she wanted to be the next starlet, and then having doubts and feelings of shame for having done those things. |
this isn't what i wanted to talk about, but let's give it a go...
to me, you are saying that rape only occurs with the use of force. so by that definition, then if a college professor tells a students she will fail if she doesn't sleep with him it is okay? does that mean that a father that tells a daughter he will kick her out of the house is not rape? does that mean that an x-boyfriend that says he will kill himself is not rape?
and then what about rape drugs? if i slip something into some girls drink and she is not "unwilling" and i use no force, this is okay?
to me, rape, is anytime a person in a position of power (through a knife, gun, brute force, drug, or authority position) forces someone to have sex. there doesnt need to be physical force. (i know i just used that verb, but oh well)
going on that "she knew the business" doesnt make it okay. does that mean that any girl that gets in a taxi late at night and gets raped is excused because she knew there was a chance? or anytime a girl meets a guy at a club rape is okay because she knew he might slip something in her drink?
does that mean if i walk down the slums and get robbed and killed, it is my fault because i know how the game is played?
i agree, she might have been able to avoid it, and she could have ran away, but what other things are there to consider? how does a young korean girl with no education stop the only job she has? or how does she, after being taken to thailand (who knows how this was sold to her, i doubt he said "let's go on a trip so i can do you") with no money possibly and no ticket then say no? and what if she did? to my knowledge there was some beatings going on. so for all we know, she did say know and gut BEATEN and RAPED anyways.
the way i see it, no matter what happened, what he did was absolutely wrong, and now she is dead because of it. |
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3MB
Joined: 26 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Mon Mar 30, 2009 9:06 pm Post subject: |
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| Those are ridiculous comparisons. But I will be blunt in that neither of those 2 first examples are rape. If the prof or father forced sex by physical means, then yes. Otherwise it isnt rape, it something else. Now, if you slip a drug into a girl's drink she is no longer able to make decisions. Was she drugged? If she was drugged then yes, it would be rape as she is unable to give consent in that state. Back to this case, unless she was forced to have sex then its not rape. Being denied the chance to be famous isnt a use of force. |
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Beej
Joined: 05 Mar 2005
Location: Eungam Loop
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| Posted: Mon Mar 30, 2009 9:27 pm Post subject: |
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| Teeling a woman you cant be on my tv show is not the same as telling her I will kill you or I will fail you in this course. |
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antoniothegreat
Joined: 28 Aug 2005
Location: Yangpyeong
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| Posted: Mon Mar 30, 2009 9:33 pm Post subject: |
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well, i guess we just have different morals...
no biggy.
then i am just curious (ending that and opening this) if she was your daughter, would you feel that her old manager should be punished at all? |
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3MB
Joined: 26 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Mon Mar 30, 2009 10:13 pm Post subject: |
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right, its ridiculous because it can be taken to any extent...
Tell me, Antonio, would a woman be considered raped if she was told by a husband she couldn't have the weekend with the girls unless she gave him some play?
In the end what was this girl being denied unless she played along? Comparing access to education with access to fame is ridiculous. Its a slap in the face to women, and especially women who have been raped. |
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3MB
Joined: 26 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Mon Mar 30, 2009 10:14 pm Post subject: |
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| antoniothegreat wrote: |
well, i guess we just have different morals...
no biggy.
then i am just curious (ending that and opening this) if she was your daughter, would you feel that her old manager should be punished at all? |
He should be punished because he did break the law. He didn't however rape her.
If she was my daughter, she wouldn't have been in that situation in the first place. |
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antoniothegreat
Joined: 28 Aug 2005
Location: Yangpyeong
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| Posted: Mon Mar 30, 2009 10:27 pm Post subject: |
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| 3MB wrote: |
right, its ridiculous because it can be taken to any extent...
Tell me, Antonio, would a woman be considered raped if she was told by a husband she couldn't have the weekend with the girls unless she gave him some play?
In the end what was this girl being denied unless she played along? Comparing access to education with access to fame is ridiculous. Its a slap in the face to women, and especially women who have been raped. |
yeah, i see what you are saying. i think i have the worst image in my mind, where he is a lying scoundrel and abused and beat her, tricked her, and she was naive...
perhaps you have the opposite in mind, she knew what she was doing, he made no lies about it...
i guess then i would have to know exactly how it happened. it could have been horrible, or she just made a bad choice... |
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3MB
Joined: 26 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Tue Mar 31, 2009 12:22 am Post subject: |
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| He probably did abuse her and probably did trick her but its a dangerous, slippery slope to call it rape. Coercion? Sure, most likely she was coerced to have sex in return for a promise of fame. But OTOH she should have known the deal. Its pretty obvious to anyone that these starlets trade certain favors to get a certain level of fame. The whole industry is basically about selling sex to the public. Not much distinguishes it from prostitution anyway. But its not even close to a professor denying somebody a right to education or even more basically a father denying a child a right to a safe home. What she would have been denied had she said no isnt a right. |
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