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Grammar: The difference between "what" and "w

 
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bish



Joined: 09 Jun 2007
PostPosted: Mon Jul 27, 2009 11:14 pm    Post subject: Grammar: The difference between "what" and "w Reply with quote
My student just came to me with the following sentence;

"These people were probably hunters from WHAT/WHICH is now northern China"

I know that the answer should be "what" and "which" would only be used if the previous name of the area was given.

I told him this but he still thinks "which" is the correct answer. How would you explain to him that "which" is incorrect?
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I'm no Picasso



Joined: 28 Oct 2008
PostPosted: Mon Jul 27, 2009 11:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
"Which" distinguishes between two or more options. In that sentence there is only one option. If you gave the former name, there are two.

But you could also say "the area which is now northern China". My explanation here is not going to be perfect, but "which" specifies. Its partners-in-crime are "this" and "that". You use "which" to be more specific. "Area" is not specific; to make it more specific, "northern China", you use "which" to lead in. In the example sentence, there is no noun to make more specific.

Hope that helps.
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The evil penguin



Joined: 24 May 2003
Location: Doing something naughty near you.....
PostPosted: Tue Jul 28, 2009 12:09 am    Post subject: Re: Grammar: The difference between "what" and &qu Reply with quote
bish wrote:
My student just came to me with the following sentence;

"These people were probably hunters from WHAT/WHICH is now northern China"

I know that the answer should be "what" and "which" would only be used if the previous name of the area was given.

I told him this but he still thinks "which" is the correct answer. How would you explain to him that "which" is incorrect?



and yet another example of why so many koreans who studied english for much of their school/university life cannot respond with anything more than "I'mfinethankyouandyou?" to the question of "does this bus go to E-mart?"
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I'm no Picasso



Joined: 28 Oct 2008
PostPosted: Tue Jul 28, 2009 12:24 am    Post subject: Re: Grammar: The difference between "what" and &am Reply with quote
The evil penguin wrote:
bish wrote:
My student just came to me with the following sentence;

"These people were probably hunters from WHAT/WHICH is now northern China"

I know that the answer should be "what" and "which" would only be used if the previous name of the area was given.

I told him this but he still thinks "which" is the correct answer. How would you explain to him that "which" is incorrect?



and yet another example of why so many koreans who studied english for much of their school/university life cannot respond with anything more than "I'mfinethankyouandyou?" to the question of "does this bus go to E-mart?"


Why don't you ask in Korean?
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The evil penguin



Joined: 24 May 2003
Location: Doing something naughty near you.....
PostPosted: Tue Jul 28, 2009 12:28 am    Post subject: Re: Grammar: The difference between "what" and &am Reply with quote
I'm no Picasso wrote:
The evil penguin wrote:
bish wrote:
My student just came to me with the following sentence;

"These people were probably hunters from WHAT/WHICH is now northern China"

I know that the answer should be "what" and "which" would only be used if the previous name of the area was given.

I told him this but he still thinks "which" is the correct answer. How would you explain to him that "which" is incorrect?



and yet another example of why so many koreans who studied english for much of their school/university life cannot respond with anything more than "I'mfinethankyouandyou?" to the question of "does this bus go to E-mart?"


Why don't you ask in Korean?


I do. But when i speak to educated koreans (especially teachers or co-workers in universities) who have been studying english for most of their life, I figure that maybe they would be more proficient in my language than i am in theirs. In most cases however, i am wrong.
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I'm no Picasso



Joined: 28 Oct 2008
PostPosted: Tue Jul 28, 2009 12:34 am    Post subject: Re: Grammar: The difference between "what" and &am Reply with quote
The evil penguin wrote:
I'm no Picasso wrote:
The evil penguin wrote:
bish wrote:
My student just came to me with the following sentence;

"These people were probably hunters from WHAT/WHICH is now northern China"

I know that the answer should be "what" and "which" would only be used if the previous name of the area was given.

I told him this but he still thinks "which" is the correct answer. How would you explain to him that "which" is incorrect?



and yet another example of why so many koreans who studied english for much of their school/university life cannot respond with anything more than "I'mfinethankyouandyou?" to the question of "does this bus go to E-mart?"


Why don't you ask in Korean?


I do. But when i speak to educated koreans (especially teachers or co-workers in universities) who have been studying english for most of their life, I figure that maybe they would be more proficient in my language than i am in theirs. In most cases however, i am wrong.


Your educated co-workers in universities can't answer, "Does this bus go to E-mart?" with anything other than, "I'mfinethankyouandyou"? That is a problem.....
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The evil penguin



Joined: 24 May 2003
Location: Doing something naughty near you.....
PostPosted: Tue Jul 28, 2009 12:48 am    Post subject: Re: Grammar: The difference between "what" and &am Reply with quote
I'm no Picasso wrote:
The evil penguin wrote:
I'm no Picasso wrote:
The evil penguin wrote:
bish wrote:
My student just came to me with the following sentence;

"These people were probably hunters from WHAT/WHICH is now northern China"

I know that the answer should be "what" and "which" would only be used if the previous name of the area was given.

I told him this but he still thinks "which" is the correct answer. How would you explain to him that "which" is incorrect?



and yet another example of why so many koreans who studied english for much of their school/university life cannot respond with anything more than "I'mfinethankyouandyou?" to the question of "does this bus go to E-mart?"


Why don't you ask in Korean?


I do. But when i speak to educated koreans (especially teachers or co-workers in universities) who have been studying english for most of their life, I figure that maybe they would be more proficient in my language than i am in theirs. In most cases however, i am wrong.


Your educated co-workers in universities can't answer, "Does this bus go to E-mart?" with anything other than, "I'mfinethankyouandyou"? That is a problem.....


a bit late for this i guess but:

IMPORTANT NOTICE: The evil penguin often likes to speak facitiously and/or in a generalising manner. Therefore, while he makes every effort to retain the element of truthfullness in all he writes, he does not guarantee that his every word can be interpreted as literal fact.

for example: If i happen to say "holy crap! it's raining bloody cats and dogs out there", do not expect to witness a shower of injured pooches and moggies...or in fact holy crap.
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ACT III



Joined: 14 Nov 2006
PostPosted: Tue Jul 28, 2009 1:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
I'm no Picasso wrote:
"Which" distinguishes between two or more options. In that sentence there is only one option. If you gave the former name, there are two.

But you could also say "the area which is now northern China". My explanation here is not going to be perfect, but "which" specifies. Its partners-in-crime are "this" and "that". You use "which" to be more specific. "Area" is not specific; to make it more specific, "northern China", you use "which" to lead in. In the example sentence, there is no noun to make more specific.

Hope that helps.


If that doesn't work you could tell the student to look up "relative clauses" in a grammar book.
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some waygug-in



Joined: 25 Jan 2003
PostPosted: Tue Jul 28, 2009 3:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
These people were probably hunters from what is now Northern China.

Like someone posted before, you can only use "which" if you had put some other noun after the "from".

I don't know what that area was called in the past but let's just say,

Fuzzbekkistan,