Korean Job Discussion Forums

[Squid]

SB. You're really James Brown aren't you?... come on admit it, y'are aren't ya?... 'cause your post reads like one of his rants.

Back at ya preacher man.

Squid the unholy

[Shincheon_Blues]

Squid,

Nope. I'm just a realist. My comments also apply to employment anywhere. If an individual with a college degree can't deal with a situation they placed themselves in, they will sink or swim. Perhaps it is a bit too Darwinian, but such is life.

To be honest, your comment about Americans irked me a bit, but you have a right to your opinions.

Speaking for myself, I have a family to feed, as well as financial responsibilities. My loyalty lies with my established friends and family. I don't believe in some middle school code of honor that dictates I should coddle a new arrival to Korea based upon that individual's nationality or inexperience. It is their responsibility (not mine) to adapt. I'll empathize, but that's about it.

Life is NOT a big bowl of cherries!

[crazylemongirl]

I put together a 3 or 4 page document for the new person in my position. I figure with my lying cheating cow of an ex employer as a boss she's going to need all the help she can get as she is the only waygook in a sea of koreans who don't speak english.

I think it's a nice thing to do to help out newbies. I assume rapier your the sort of person that would laugh at the 1st years struggling to find the lecture halls rather than point them in the right direction.

[rapier]

lemongirl: i would laugh first, and then point them in the right direction. And i'd suggest that they accept all that extra unscheduled OT, rather than having it directed at me. having climbed to the top of the tree by myself, I'm not about to give a newbie a free hand up.

[Squid]

There are people who help people and people who don't, I like to help people just to feel good.
If I didn't have a degree I'd still do it, and be gleefully ignorant in my low and unwashed life.
May I burn in a fire hot as a thousand suns for my slight against the great US.

Bluey... pick another profession

[jambo]

What advice then, as a k vet, would you give a newb teacher in korea in regards to handling a korean director that might (will) take advantage of a green teacher?
What are the key things to do/avoid when negotiating with the boss?
Enquiring minds need to know.

P.S. there is no need to play william wallace for them , give advice without holding their hands, carving a place for youself is part of the experience.

[batman]

When I first came to Korea, no-one gave me a hand nor was I really expecting one.
I arrived on a Friday, was shown my apartment, my class and the books.
Started on the Monday and took it from there.
As I settled into my job and worked my way up the monkey tree, I took it upon myself to help those who followed me.
The help I gave covered tips on classroom management, where to find what in the hood, writing notes in Korean, etc.
Some of the people I gave the hand to were appreciative.
And some were not.
A year ago I had to fight off two of the most miserable back-stabbing s.o.b's I have ever met.
Took months for the knife wounds to heal.
Their behaviour really made me wonder why I even bothered.
If I could live the time over again, though, I still would have helped them out.
Why?
It has nothing to do with race.
I have helped out teachers who were white, black and yellow.
It has nothing to do with money.
I never received a dime (or a won).
Like it has been said, it feels good to do good.
If we can do something to ward off misery in the life of another, why would we not do it.
What harm is there in sharing our knowledge.
We are teachers.
The role of a teacher is to help in the education of others.
Whether the other is a student or a co-worker does not matter.

[Son Deureo!]

OK, here's my quick and dirty guide to dealing with hogwon sharks *ahem*, I mean owners....

When you're green to the hogwon scene, you should make yourself appear as independent as possible as quickly as possible. Don't ask your director a lot of questions about how to teach, how to get around town, to discipline your students for you, or for any other favors. Most importantly, don't EVER ask him to loan you money. Asking these things makes you look helpless. Hogwon owners can smell helpless foreign teachers like sharks can smell blood in the water. Furthermore, you WILL pay your boss back tenfold for every favor he ever does for you. It's not a game you can win.

Figure things out for yourself, ask other foreigners or English speaking Koreans for help, use Lonely Planet or Dave's for info, or learn to do without, but don't ask your boss for anything you wouldn't ask your boss for back home.

Know your rights. There's a wealth of information available on this board and at www.efl-law.com about the rights and legal options you have available to you as a foreign teacher. Not everything gets done by the book here, but that doesn't mean there is no book.

Learn to nod and smile, then go back to doing what you were already doing in the first place. Hogwon directors talk a lot of contradictory nonsense about what to do in the classroom because they usually don't know what they're doing. Whether you know what you're doing or not is beside the point (although you probably already know more about teaching than your boss does). Your boss' suggestions will rarely be worth listening to, much less discussing. Show your boss the paperwork he wants to see, keep the kids occupied and busy, and do the best you can to get them learning English. If you do these things, in that order, you have some chance of keeping your idiot boss off your back. Whatever you do, don't try to actually discuss teaching ideas with your boss. Pretend to listen to his ideas, nod, smile, and do whatever you think is best. Got an idea about what to do in the classroom? Great, do it. Discussing it with your boss will be about as useful as discussing it with the ajumma on the corner selling boiled silkworm larvae. Both usually have equally useful advice about teaching English to children.

Don't get angry at your boss. I'm kinda bad at this one, I don't suffer fools easily. Most hogwon directors are already irritable enough about the amount of money they pay for their foreign teachers, and even more irritable about how dependent they are on these (*gasp*) foreigners. Making matters worse by flouting centuries of Confucian wisdom by telling your boss when he's an idiot, a fraud, or a cheat will only make things worse. Need to tell your boss you're about to walk? Plan to stop working until he pays you? Gotta tell him you're gonna call the Labor Board? Fine, but do it calmly, politely and quietly, and as though it were a natural consequence of his actions which he may not have previously realized. He may still get mad at you, but showing anger to your superior is considered unforgivable. Trust me, it ain't worth it.

Let your boss know you're checking his homework as well as your students'. A lot of bosses like to skim off the top for taxes and pension, or just plain pocket it. Make sure your boss knows that you will be checking with the Tax Office about any taxes he needs to deduct from your pay. This is, of course, a natural thing since you will need to report the taxes you have paid in Korea to your home country, right? Reminding my boss of this fact saved me over W700,000 in taxes this year that she was never planning on giving the government.

That's all I can think of right now. If you're not here yet, just remember, Koreans are wonderful people. Until they decide to buy kiddie hogwons.

[waterbaby]

I'm quite happy to help newbies out ... but only to a certain extent. Most of my experiences helping people out has been positive with those people finding their feet & making their own friends, doing their own things and not solely relying on me for their source of entertainment (I'm not that exciting )

I just don't go for clingy newbies ... those that have no wings of their own, have trouble branching out on their own & demand help for every little things... "WHAT? THE *&^%ING POST OFFICE ... AGAIN!!! ARGH!!! I'VE TAKEN YOU THERE THREE TIMES ALREADY YOU BIG BABY!!!"

Mind you, it's been a while.

[/rant]

[Squid]

Thanks Batman, Son Deuro and Waterbaby... I'll still smile and nod at ya in the subway!

Squid, Poor but happy.

[Wishmaster]

No way would I go out of my way to help a newbie. Hey, I assume that they are over 18...they have to deal with their own situations. Why should I help them? I mean, back home, would any of them have helped me? No. Never got help and I've never asked for it. I've been so damn independent for so long that I've learned from the streets and I know how to fight my own battles. The thing that I've learned is that you look out for number 1. Take care of yourself and let other people deal with their own quagmires or whatever. I care about me and I'm not afraid to offend all of the politically correct people out there. If you come to Korea, you should have to pay your dues just like the rest of us.

[the_beaver]

I look after newbies and generally help out whenever I can, but in the situation that Rapier outlined above, I probably wouldn't.

[zazaboo]

I deeply appreciate all the time and consideration my fellow co-workers gave me when I first arrived in Korea and in other countries and I'm trying to pay that back to the power of ten. However, over the years, how I help has changed. I don't fight other people's management battles unless I'm the head teacher. Advice over a coffee is more useful anyway.

I don't loan out my favorite books unless the newbie has proven trustworthy, or arrange privates, but if they need an emergency loan, immediate translator, help with the medical system, shopping, clothing, or internet banking information, I help as much as I can.

The only difference I've noticed between Americans and Canadians is that Canadians are aghast at the cost of the medical system without insurance and Americans are pleasantly surprised, and that Americans expect more from their embassy but receive little help, support, or cultural events while Canadians don't expect much, but seem to have a great embassy here.

Sorry you've had such a bad experience with Americans, Squid.

[Squid]

Zazaboo, sorry if you got that impression. I've had the time of my life tooling around with Yank bud for the past year... a noteworthy exception...and he'd nuke my ass if he read that other post... ok bud, you can put down the gun now

By the way, I quit today.

[lawyertood]

I don't mind helping new teachers out to a certain extent. Posting replies on this board is one way. If, however, I notice the teacher is not doing anything on their own and relying on me 100% to do things for them I draw the line. It doesn't help them in the long run and doesn't do much for our relationship. Nobody likes a lazy teacher. I am sure many of us have run into the teacher who wanted to use our materials and ideas yet never contributed anything in return and seldom a thank you. It makes the idea of helping the next teacher less desirable.

On the other hand, being a true helper to someone new and green, getting them off on the right foot so they can walk on their own in Korea without carrying them the distance never hurt anyone. We were all new once and if we received friendly advice it has helped us to adjust.

Sure, to a certain degree, I think others need to pay their dues like many of us did and it irks me when someone new to teaching, new to Korea, and with a BA in Basketweaving feels like they are entitled to the highest pay and/or a uni gig. I've met a few. That is why I generally try to avoid letting someone know about openings at my school unless they have given me a strong indication that they are qualified through educational background and experience. But, I digress...

I don't believe it should automatically be an us v. them situation-- teachers v. director--but it also shouldn't be a veteran v. newbie situation either. Instead new teachers should be given the benefit of the doubt about their sincerity and professionalism until proven otherwise. It is a personal choice to help others, whether to help or how much help to give. The goal in the end is to make the workplace as comfortable a place to be for all concerned as it can be without sacrificing yourself and your goals

Thanks for putting up with my babble......