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ropebreezy

Joined: 27 Aug 2009

Posted: Thu Sep 24, 2009 2:11 am Post subject:

Fox wrote:

the ethical inclination to take care of fellow members of your society -- the inclination most deeply linked to Liberal Philosophy

Fox wrote:

Conservativism is also in line with something quite natural: our desire for independence, our self-interest, and our desire for material things.

Hey Fox, you should start a comic book. It'll be called "Superliberal vs. The Conservative Menace." Millions of children across the world will love it. Key word though: children.

Samurai Blur

Joined: 20 Aug 2009

Posted: Thu Sep 24, 2009 2:36 pm Post subject:

No_hite_pls wrote:

Glenn Beck is funny but I am not sure that he is trying to be.

Glenn Beck is not funny... Even my far right wing father is easily annoying with his pathetic attempts at jokes while watching his show. You should get out more often.

Fox

Joined: 04 Mar 2009

Posted: Thu Sep 24, 2009 4:53 pm Post subject:

ropebreezy wrote:

Fox wrote:

the ethical inclination to take care of fellow members of your society -- the inclination most deeply linked to Liberal Philosophy

Fox wrote:

Conservativism is also in line with something quite natural: our desire for independence, our self-interest, and our desire for material things.

Hey Fox, you should start a comic book. It'll be called "Superliberal vs. The Conservative Menace." Millions of children across the world will love it. Key word though: children.

So you feel desire for independence, self-interest, and a desire for material things are menacing attributes?

Fox

Joined: 04 Mar 2009

Posted: Thu Sep 24, 2009 4:54 pm Post subject:

Samurai Blur wrote:

No_hite_pls wrote:

Glenn Beck is funny but I am not sure that he is trying to be.

Glenn Beck is not funny... Even my far right wing father is easily annoying with his pathetic attempts at jokes while watching his show. You should get out more often.

I don't think it's Glen Beck's attempts at jokes that No_hite_pls was describing as funny.

Samurai Blur

Joined: 20 Aug 2009

Posted: Thu Sep 24, 2009 5:49 pm Post subject:

Fox wrote:

Samurai Blur wrote:

No_hite_pls wrote:

Glenn Beck is funny but I am not sure that he is trying to be.

Glenn Beck is not funny... Even my far right wing father is easily annoying with his pathetic attempts at jokes while watching his show. You should get out more often.

I don't think it's Glen Beck's attempts at jokes that No_hite_pls was describing as funny.

Haha, I see. Maybe I should get out more often.

ropebreezy

Joined: 27 Aug 2009

Posted: Thu Sep 24, 2009 6:04 pm Post subject:

Fox wrote:

ropebreezy wrote:

Fox wrote:

the ethical inclination to take care of fellow members of your society -- the inclination most deeply linked to Liberal Philosophy

Fox wrote:

Conservativism is also in line with something quite natural: our desire for independence, our self-interest, and our desire for material things.

Hey Fox, you should start a comic book. It'll be called "Superliberal vs. The Conservative Menace." Millions of children across the world will love it. Key word though: children.

So you feel desire for independence, self-interest, and a desire for material things are menacing attributes?

You compare "self interest" and "desire for material things" to "caring for fellow members of your society," as if these things are what composes the two respective political idealologies. When you compare them as such, which one seems more noble? (obvious rhetorical question)

The fact that you try to pass liberalism and conservatism as these things makes your viewpoints seem comic-book in nature. It must be nice to live in such a simple world.

mateomiguel

Joined: 16 May 2005

Posted: Thu Sep 24, 2009 6:19 pm Post subject:

Fox wrote:

Ethical ideas we are naturally inclined to experience, obviously. The world over, certain ethics are essentially universal.

That's a nice viewpoint, which I used to hold when I was a kid and thought most people around the world agreed with me, and only a few unnatural deviants screwed things up for the majority of freethinking Christians. Then I realized that there are BILLIONS, yes BILLIONS of people who didn't get raised in the way I was raised and had lots of different ideas from me. Then I realized this thing that I said already:

mateomiguel wrote:

That's probably my real point. What is called "natural" tends to be whatever the speaker agrees with ...

Fox wrote:

Okay. So, you feel the ethical inclination to take care of fellow members of your society -- the inclination most deeply linked to Liberal Philosophy -- is unnatural.

Whether or not this is the most deeply linked thing to Liberal Philosophy or not is neither here nor there (personally I thought it was guilt, for everything everywhere), but I'm going to have to stick a big "yes" in your craw there. Yes, I do think the ethical inclination to take care of fellow members of your society is unnatural. Why? Because its ethics, a social and cultural construct. There are many kinds of ethics, and most contradict with each other. Each group or subgroup of people in the world seems to have their own special code of ethics, and may or may not agree with their neighbors code of ethics. Wars have been fought over such disagreements. And they're not natural, or they would be the same everywhere you find people. They're always different, so always artificially created by some thinker or leader. There are natural things as a part of human nature, but they are much simpler than a code of ethics.

Fox wrote:

Which is it?

You are asking me to make a choice here but I only see one option. What's my other option again?

Look dude, your "natural" is defined by you. Its not my "natural". Its not Korea's "natural" either. I would think a world traveller such as someone who posts on a Korean ESL job forum would understand that the world is full of many different things. Stick to your guns as a liberal, I don't mind. But don't claim it as closer to the natural order of things, or you'll start to sound like a member of the KKK.

Fox

Joined: 04 Mar 2009

Posted: Thu Sep 24, 2009 6:41 pm Post subject:

ropebreezy wrote:

Fox wrote:

ropebreezy wrote:

Fox wrote:

the ethical inclination to take care of fellow members of your society -- the inclination most deeply linked to Liberal Philosophy

Fox wrote:

Conservativism is also in line with something quite natural: our desire for independence, our self-interest, and our desire for material things.

Hey Fox, you should start a comic book. It'll be called "Superliberal vs. The Conservative Menace." Millions of children across the world will love it. Key word though: children.

So you feel desire for independence, self-interest, and a desire for material things are menacing attributes?

I included desire for independence in that list for a reason. Many people consider a desire for independence to be a positive trait.

Why didn't you include my mention of this trait in your response?

Fox

Joined: 04 Mar 2009

Posted: Thu Sep 24, 2009 6:51 pm Post subject: