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Old Gil
Joined: 26 Sep 2009
Location: Got out! olleh!
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 Posted: Wed Nov 18, 2009 6:17 pm Post subject: |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
| CentralCali wrote: |
| So, PG, what do you think the reaction would be in the United States if a national leader of the Klu Klux Klan were to attend a government policy meeting? I think the politician's career would be over the very next day. |
You mean like Robert Byrd, Strom Thurmond , Trent Lott, Georege "Macaca" Allen or David Duke?
How about The Minutemen Project and other anti-immigration groups? Supporters of them include Sean Hannity and Rush Limbaugh (Two people who wield zero influence in the Republican Party, which is of course a fringe group).
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When have these people met with the Cabinet heads to discuss policy?
The closest you can come is Ken Lay with Enron, not racial.
The Minute Men are against ILLEGAL immigration, they don't demonize legal workers with the appropriate visas who pay taxes.
Always apples to oranges with you. |
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pkang0202
Joined: 09 Mar 2007
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| Posted: Wed Nov 18, 2009 8:18 pm Post subject: |
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| Old Gil wrote: |
The Minute Men are against ILLEGAL immigration, they don't demonize legal workers with the appropriate visas who pay taxes.
Always apples to oranges with you. |
I support the Minutemen. Get the illegals out of the US. I find it pretty messed up that people I know in Korea have to wait YEARS, go through multiple interviews, and properly go through all the red tape for a CHANCE to immigrate to Korea, when people in Mexico can just walk across a dirt field and get in.
All the illegals in the US should get out of the country and wait in line like other people around the world. |
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CentralCali
Joined: 17 May 2007
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| Posted: Wed Nov 18, 2009 8:21 pm Post subject: |
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| ardis wrote: |
| Korea has been for Koreans in its entire history and it's just now starting to become less homogeneous. |
Actually, that's not the case at all. |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Wed Nov 18, 2009 9:07 pm Post subject: |
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| Old Gil wrote: |
| Steelrails wrote: |
| CentralCali wrote: |
| So, PG, what do you think the reaction would be in the United States if a national leader of the Klu Klux Klan were to attend a government policy meeting? I think the politician's career would be over the very next day. |
You mean like Robert Byrd, Strom Thurmond , Trent Lott, Georege "Macaca" Allen or David Duke?
How about The Minutemen Project and other anti-immigration groups? Supporters of them include Sean Hannity and Rush Limbaugh (Two people who wield zero influence in the Republican Party, which is of course a fringe group).
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When have these people met with the Cabinet heads to discuss policy?
The closest you can come is Ken Lay with Enron, not racial.
The Minute Men are against ILLEGAL immigration, they don't demonize legal workers with the appropriate visas who pay taxes.
Always apples to oranges with you. |
Yeah, Trent Lott, Robert Byrd, and Strom Thurmond were nobodies. Rush Limbaugh and Hannity and Glenn Beck carry zero influence.
Never can admit to the blindingly obvious can you? We're talking about two different countries- it ain't apples to oranges, more like Granny Smiths to Red Deliciouses. Even with Apples and Oranges we're still comparing fruits in a basket.
As for the minutemen, they do focus on one kind of illegal immigrant though- Mexican.
Just like the AES doesn't focus on all AIDS immigrants, just English Teachers with AIDS. |
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ardis
Joined: 20 Apr 2006
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Wed Nov 18, 2009 9:16 pm Post subject: |
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| CentralCali wrote: |
| ardis wrote: |
| Korea has been for Koreans in its entire history and it's just now starting to become less homogeneous. |
Actually, that's not the case at all. |
Really. There are millions of people from other countries living here--as in are actual citizens and not just migrant workers? I must have completely missed that. |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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asylum seeker
Joined: 22 Jul 2007
Location: On your computer screen.
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| Posted: Wed Nov 18, 2009 11:19 pm Post subject: |
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| TheUrbanMyth wrote: |
| Steelrails wrote: |
I'
As for rounding up its leadership and bringing them to court, again, the same issues apply- Sure we get them, but are we next?
] |
This is a very good point. There is stuff written on these very forums that could easily be used to make an identical case that English teachers are spreading hatred.
Case in point
http://forums.eslcafe.com/korea/viewtopic.php?t=70070&postdays=0&postorder-asc&start=18
And that's one of the more mild ones.
And WE'RE complaining about hate speech, when people write stuff like that here and are not called on it? |
This is it. I've seen people on Dave's calling Koreans 'chinks', 'yellow' and all sorts of other derogatory comments. It seems like to some 'hate speech' is only 'hate speech' when it applies to some people.
Again. I'll make the point: Stormfront.org is hosted in the US (Florida) and is an out-and-out racist website that is just as bad, if not worse, than the AES (e.g. it is sympathetic to Benjamin Nathaniel Smith who carried out a racially-motivated killing spree). The US government could shut down this website but has allowed it to continue operating since the early 1990's. If the US is willing to allow such a website to be hosted inside its borders because of the tenets of free speech then on what grounds are you trying to have the AES banned? |
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caniff
Joined: 03 Feb 2004
Location: All over the map
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| Posted: Wed Nov 18, 2009 11:25 pm Post subject: |
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| ardis wrote: |
| CentralCali wrote: |
| ardis wrote: |
| Korea has been for Koreans in its entire history and it's just now starting to become less homogeneous. |
Actually, that's not the case at all. |
Really. There are millions of people from other countries living here--as in are actual citizens and not just migrant workers? I must have completely missed that. |
He might have been referring to the first part of your statement. |
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CentralCali
Joined: 17 May 2007
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| Posted: Wed Nov 18, 2009 11:26 pm Post subject: |
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| caniff is correct. Korea actually started out as a mulit-cultural society. |
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doggyji
Joined: 21 Feb 2006
Location: Toronto - Hamilton - Vineland - St. Catherines
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| Posted: Thu Nov 19, 2009 2:01 am Post subject: |
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I see some people bring up Stormfront here simply because it's a well-known hate group, but AES can't even remotely be compared to Stormfront. Please show due respect to the blatant viciousness of Stormfront. As far as I can tell, Mr. Lee is well aware of watchdog activities on his group and trying to appear a lot more moderate than the initial days.
His recent article in Weekly Chosun:
http://weekly.chosun.com/site/data/html_dir/2009/08/19/2009081901365.html |
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asylum seeker
Joined: 22 Jul 2007
Location: On your computer screen.
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| Posted: Thu Nov 19, 2009 9:33 pm Post subject: |
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| doggyji wrote: |
I see some people bring up Stormfront here simply because it's a well-known hate group, but AES can't even remotely be compared to Stormfront. Please show due respect to the blatant viciousness of Stormfront. As far as I can tell, Mr. Lee is well aware of watchdog activities on his group and trying to appear a lot more moderate than the initial days.
His recent article in Weekly Chosun:
http://weekly.chosun.com/site/data/html_dir/2009/08/19/2009081901365.html |
I was only bringing it up to show the double standard being applied on here. I also believe Stormfront is much worse than the AES. |
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PatrickGHBusan
Joined: 24 Jun 2008
Location: Busan (1997-2008) Canada 2008 -
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| Posted: Fri Nov 20, 2009 8:15 am Post subject: |
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asylum...what double standard??
Come on..surely you jest my good man...there could not be a double standard here on this issue. Stop speakign such nonsense!!! 
AES = Stormfront....
AES is a policy driver...they control the government...down with your common sense asylum...it has no place here! |
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JohnFlory
Joined: 15 Jun 2009
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| Posted: Fri Nov 20, 2009 3:04 pm Post subject: |
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I love how the defenders of AES are always quick to bring up Stormfront. I'm not American, don't live in the US and the group has nothing do with me. AES does. Is Stormfront worse than AES? I could give a toss. The neo-nazis in Russia are worse than AES, so what?
But I do understand it's a convienent way to deflect what is believed to be crtiticism of Korea. Why some people feel the need to defend the group ie. they're not that bad, they operate on the margins of society, they have a right to free speech, etc, etc is beyond me. Would these same people say things like that about racist hate groups in their home countries? I doubt it. But somehow, people who criticize AES are the hypocrites. Maybe shining a light on AES is bad for people's recruiting business's?
Oh and Pat, nobody here has ever, ever said AES controls the Korean government. If someone has show me the quote. Otherwise you're just being deliberately inflammatory. Didn't you say something about playing games? I do snicker every time I see the same, "You're exactly right .....!" quote from you. Shows me you're nothing more than a cheerleader. |
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Pojogae
Joined: 30 Oct 2008
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| Posted: Fri Nov 20, 2009 4:03 pm Post subject: |
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| ardis wrote: |
| CentralCali wrote: |
| He dropped out years ago. I'm talking about today. |
I know you are. At the same time, is it fair to compare Korea of today to the USA of today? The USA has been battling racism issues for years because we've had so many waves of immigrants. Today, Korea is just starting to experience small waves of immigrants in the same way the USA did decades ago. It would make absolutely no sense for Korea to be on par with the racial social standards of the US, a country that has been forced to confront these issues for over a hundred years. Korea has been for Koreans in its entire history and it's just now starting to become less homogeneous. |
But didn't the US of yesterday change in large part due to the endless moaning and complaints of those who felt victimized? You've got to start somewhere, don't you? |
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crossmr
Joined: 22 Nov 2008
Location: Hwayangdong, Seoul
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| Posted: Fri Nov 20, 2009 4:40 pm Post subject: |
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| Pojogae wrote: |
But didn't the US of yesterday change in large part due to the endless moaning and complaints of those who felt victimized? You've got to start somewhere, don't you? |
Except the people who felt victimized were citizens of the country. There is no correlation between E-series visa holders in Korea and American citizens like African Americans or women fighting for rights.
They're two different classes of people. The closest thing we'd get in Korea might be people on F5s... maybe F2s. The E-series are transient workers. They make contracts on a year to year basis and have no real ties to Korea. They can pick up and go to another country next year with very little effort. As some people have quoted E2s have 50% turnover each year. In terms of making noise, they don't really have that big of a voice. F2s and F5s have a bigger tie to Korea, but there are far fewer of them. When citizenship opens up if a couple thousand westerners got citizenship, and organized they might have sufficient ties and numbers to matter. |
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