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chaz47
Joined: 11 Sep 2003
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 Posted: Mon Jan 25, 2010 8:23 am Post subject: Hagwon in Seoul post uni gig in Busan... |
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I'm on the very tail end of my university contract in Busan and haven't gotten any offers to speak of so far from another university. It seems the hiring crunch and competition has taken it's toll, at least for me. Initially I had said to myself I would never do hagwon work again. But now looking at the other markets outside of Korea I'm thinking maybe a new city with a more cosmopolitan outlook than Busan might not be soooooo bad.
Do you think this will damage my resume, going from a university to hagwon? Also, how marketable will my near 5 years of experience and 120 hour TESOL certificate really be in Seoul these days?
I'll have a couple weeks on this visa to go up and job hunt in person but would appreciate advice on where to look for work and what areas are good to live in. I've had it pretty good in Busan the past few years apartment wise but think I could handle going back to ye olde shoebox if it meant living in a "cool" neighborhood. |
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bigtexas
Joined: 30 Nov 2009
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| Posted: Mon Jan 25, 2010 11:55 pm Post subject: Re: Hagwon in Seoul post uni gig in Busan... |
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| chaz47 wrote: |
I'm on the very tail end of my university contract in Busan and haven't gotten any offers to speak of so far from another university. It seems the hiring crunch and competition has taken it's toll, at least for me. Initially I had said to myself I would never do hagwon work again. But now looking at the other markets outside of Korea I'm thinking maybe a new city with a more cosmopolitan outlook than Busan might not be soooooo bad.
Do you think this will damage my resume, going from a university to hagwon? Also, how marketable will my near 5 years of experience and 120 hour TESOL certificate really be in Seoul these days?
I'll have a couple weeks on this visa to go up and job hunt in person but would appreciate advice on where to look for work and what areas are good to live in. I've had it pretty good in Busan the past few years apartment wise but think I could handle going back to ye olde shoebox if it meant living in a "cool" neighborhood. |
Well, I got to say that really sucks man. But I am a little confused. Did you work at a uni for 5 years? If so, how on earth can you not find a uni job? Even if you only worked there for one year, there is no reason why your should be demoting yourself back to the hogwon. I mean, I am not trying to belittle you, but once you break into the unis, you should do your best to stay there during your time in Korea.
Questions for ya...
1. Did your market yourself well?
2. Did you connect with any other foreigner / koreans at other unis?
3. Did you make friends with the korean admin?
4. Did you have good student evals?
5. Where you aware that they were not going to resign you?
6. Did you update and make your resume tailored to the jobs you applied for?
7. Did you email your apps or sent a formal package (packages do wonders)
I am not trying to belittle you, but you have to take your next job seriously if you want to come back to the unis. They will not like the fact that you went back to the hogwon. I can tell you right now that they will ask about that if you get an interview at a uni in the future. Koreans can easily think that your teaching skills were not good enough for the uni industry and might not consider you. I am just being serious. Koreans unis want to se professional work, not basic hogwon names on your resume.
I am telling you this because I know. I have been at my uni for 3 years, and decided that working 25 hours, 4 days a week was too much. So I started looking early ( begining of November) and got a higher paying job with only 12 hours a week. And I dont have a TEFL OR A MASTERS. I just know how to teach students well, and realize how to make the korean students and uni happy. Thats just as important, if not more, than having a masters degree.
Now, my advice is to get on the horse right now and find the most professional job you can. There are city hall jobs, publishing companies, lg, samsung, trade companies, and even airline companies that hire. That would be an ideal job for a year, and then jump back to the uni. Also working for the Korean Army or Marines is not too back. Great benefits from what I hear, and pimp apartments. You want to go to a place where they value your experience. Hogwons might turn you teaching ability, if it is good, into mush!
Be careful what job you choose next, the uni jobs that you apply for in the future will depend on it. |
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chaz47
Joined: 11 Sep 2003
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| Posted: Tue Jan 26, 2010 10:38 am Post subject: Re: Hagwon in Seoul post uni gig in Busan... |
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| bigtexas wrote: |
| chaz47 wrote: |
I'm on the very tail end of my university contract in Busan and haven't gotten any offers to speak of so far from another university. It seems the hiring crunch and competition has taken it's toll, at least for me. Initially I had said to myself I would never do hagwon work again. But now looking at the other markets outside of Korea I'm thinking maybe a new city with a more cosmopolitan outlook than Busan might not be soooooo bad.
Do you think this will damage my resume, going from a university to hagwon? Also, how marketable will my near 5 years of experience and 120 hour TESOL certificate really be in Seoul these days?
I'll have a couple weeks on this visa to go up and job hunt in person but would appreciate advice on where to look for work and what areas are good to live in. I've had it pretty good in Busan the past few years apartment wise but think I could handle going back to ye olde shoebox if it meant living in a "cool" neighborhood. |
Well, I got to say that really sucks man. But I am a little confused. Did you work at a uni for 5 years? If so, how on earth can you not find a uni job? Even if you only worked there for one year, there is no reason why your should be demoting yourself back to the hogwon. I mean, I am not trying to belittle you, but once you break into the unis, you should do your best to stay there during your time in Korea.
Questions for ya...
1. Did your market yourself well?
2. Did you connect with any other foreigner / koreans at other unis?
3. Did you make friends with the korean admin?
4. Did you have good student evals?
5. Where you aware that they were not going to resign you?
6. Did you update and make your resume tailored to the jobs you applied for?
7. Did you email your apps or sent a formal package (packages do wonders)
I am not trying to belittle you, but you have to take your next job seriously if you want to come back to the unis. They will not like the fact that you went back to the hogwon. I can tell you right now that they will ask about that if you get an interview at a uni in the future. Koreans can easily think that your teaching skills were not good enough for the uni industry and might not consider you. I am just being serious. Koreans unis want to se professional work, not basic hogwon names on your resume.
I am telling you this because I know. I have been at my uni for 3 years, and decided that working 25 hours, 4 days a week was too much. So I started looking early ( begining of November) and got a higher paying job with only 12 hours a week. And I dont have a TEFL OR A MASTERS. I just know how to teach students well, and realize how to make the korean students and uni happy. Thats just as important, if not more, than having a masters degree.
Now, my advice is to get on the horse right now and find the most professional job you can. There are city hall jobs, publishing companies, lg, samsung, trade companies, and even airline companies that hire. That would be an ideal job for a year, and then jump back to the uni. Also working for the Korean Army or Marines is not too back. Great benefits from what I hear, and pimp apartments. You want to go to a place where they value your experience. Hogwons might turn you teaching ability, if it is good, into mush!
Be careful what job you choose next, the uni jobs that you apply for in the future will depend on it. |
Well, thanks for that advice. Just to clarify a bit though. I was at the university for two years and they cleaned house. They fired (opted not to renew) the entire department. Some of these teachers had been there for 12+ years. Rightly so I was a bit miffed. It was a long, drudge semester because one of our department jumped ship when he got wind of the axe about to fall and secured a position at another uni. The rest of us picked up the slack. We were well compensated but it was one of those semesters with a lot of dog and pony because of grants for engineering students and whatnot.
Anyway, I was feeling a bit burnt by the whole situation so I half-heartedly applied to a number of universities. I received several replies saying that they were seeking someone with more educaton and/or experience. To date I've only actually gotten one interview. After that one, which went rather well, they informed me they were going with someone who had more experience.
This no longer a teacher's market. It seems most of the university jobs got gobbled up by recent MAs or veterans that are more vet than me.
In the back of my mind I was thinking that if no new uni gig happened for me it was time to leave Korea any damn way. But, since I've been on vacation I've been applying like mad in and out of Korea and the jobs aren't what they were 5 years ago that's for sure.
Again, with the economic downturn globally and the fall of NOVA in Japan not so long ago, this is definitely not a teacher's market. IMHO. |
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bigtexas
Joined: 30 Nov 2009
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| Posted: Tue Jan 26, 2010 3:31 pm Post subject: |
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Well lets see here....
You say that its not a teacher's market. I completely disagree. As I told you before, I dont have a certificate or a masters, and I got 2 of the 3 positions I applied for, both at unis. What I am hearing from you is that you wanted to get a job without working as hard as you can to get it. Well, when I prepared for applying to unis I did this...
1. sent harcopies & emails containing all my application info to all the places. Hardcopies went to the places I WANTED.
2. got powerful people at my old uni to write me fantastic letters of rec
3. went in person, to one, and hand delivered it to the uni I was applying to...I mean straight to the boss's hands!
4. Made follow up emails and calls, making sure that all my packages and emails arrived.
5. MADE A PORFOLIO AND A PRESENTATION. Eventhough the uni may not have asked me to formally make a presentation, I did one anyway Koreans love that! Do more than the next guy!
5. I smiled and do as much Korean culture as possible. Dont fake it, just act submissive and listen to them when they are talking. ALWAYS SMILE!
6. Bring as much materials as possible to be able to explain you teaching methods and curiculum. But not too much, too much looks disorganized.
Thats what I did, and I got 2 out of 3....
What I reccomend is, again, head towards a professional school where you can vault back to a uni. Dont submit yourself and take a back track.
just fyi |
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bigtexas
Joined: 30 Nov 2009
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| Posted: Tue Jan 26, 2010 3:36 pm Post subject: |
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also, dressing very well and being good looking goes a long way in Korea. Its sad that people judge you just by how you look, but its true. Korean uni students dont want an ugly teacher, from my experience. The bosses love when tall, handsome meegook walks in the interview. They put that up there along with all the other things they are looking for.
Remember that many unis use their foreigners on the covers of their school magazine/ newspapers, and they always want good looking people to rep their school.
You dont have to be the best looking, bc an outgoing personality also is loved by Koreans. They want an interactive foreign teacher, not one who sits, is boring, and reminds everyone that "I have a masters". |
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air76
Joined: 13 Nov 2007
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| Posted: Tue Jan 26, 2010 4:48 pm Post subject: |
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I'm sorry, but I have to agree. If you have 2 years of university experience and couldn't find another university job then you have nowhere to look but in the mirror. There are tons of universities hiring teachers with bachelor's degrees and no university experience, it is a misnomer that you need an MA to get a uni job. While some schools require one and every school of course "prefers" one, the vast majority of university professors only have a BA.
Your job search must have been very limited.
It is still a teacher's market in Korea...while economic issues have brought more applicants to the table, I think that this rise is grossly miscalculated. There is still a limited number of people who are willing to leave home to look for work, even in a tough economy. Once you're in Korea you are still part of a work force that has less supply than demand.
I bet you'd be surprised that there will still be a lot of universities hiring in February as candidates drop out of jobs that the schools assumed their candidates would take. You won't necessarily get a great uni gig in the city of your choice, but you can still find one, and that would be leaps and bounds better than working at a hagwon again. |
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bigtexas
Joined: 30 Nov 2009
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| Posted: Tue Jan 26, 2010 7:41 pm Post subject: |
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| air76 wrote: |
I'm sorry, but I have to agree. If you have 2 years of university experience and couldn't find another university job then you have nowhere to look but in the mirror. There are tons of universities hiring teachers with bachelor's degrees and no university experience, it is a misnomer that you need an MA to get a uni job. While some schools require one and every school of course "prefers" one, the vast majority of university professors only have a BA.
Your job search must have been very limited.
It is still a teacher's market in Korea...while economic issues have brought more applicants to the table, I think that this rise is grossly miscalculated. There is still a limited number of people who are willing to leave home to look for work, even in a tough economy. Once you're in Korea you are still part of a work force that has less supply than demand.
I bet you'd be surprised that there will still be a lot of universities hiring in February as candidates drop out of jobs that the schools assumed their candidates would take. You won't necessarily get a great uni gig in the city of your choice, but you can still find one, and that would be leaps and bounds better than working at a hagwon again. |
yes, yes, and yes
If you would have worked your asre off for a short time, you would have gotten some uni job somewhere. The market is great, and if it was not, I would be heading out of Korea with my family. This country is a cash cow and you got to know how to master it. |
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