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What's your college degree worth?
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recessiontime



Joined: 21 Jun 2010
Location: Got avatar privileges nyahahaha

PostPosted: Thu Jul 01, 2010 8:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

pkang0202 wrote:
Anyone who says a Bachelor's degree means nothing are the same people who wouldn't be caught dead omitting that they graduated from college on a job application.


red herring.

The main argument the article makes is that the college degree is a bubble. It's just not worth what we thought it was and the cost isn't justifiable.

thanks for playing. Wink
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pangaea



Joined: 20 Dec 2007

PostPosted: Thu Jul 01, 2010 8:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

pkang0202 wrote:

Quote:
Anyone who says a Bachelor's degree means nothing are the same people who wouldn't be caught dead omitting that they graduated from college on a job application.


I don't think you understand the point of the article or the discussion.
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Mr. Pink



Joined: 21 Oct 2003
Location: China

PostPosted: Thu Jul 01, 2010 1:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Most BA degrees need additional education to be worth something. For instance, there are plenty of post-graduate diplomas that can lead to decent job streams.

I wouldn't count on getting a "good" job with a basic BA degree unless you graduated from an ivy league school (and even there you aren't guaranteed).
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Druzyek



Joined: 02 Feb 2010

PostPosted: Thu Jul 01, 2010 7:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My degree got me the job I have now. The owner of my Hagwon ran a business to get Korean students into American universities. She told me that she hired me because she had sent a lot of her clients to the university I graduated from. She thought I might be a good choice because I had probably gotten to know some Koreans already. She was right, the majority of the people I went to church with in college (and as a result hung out with) are Korean. So, my degree isn't worth nearly what the people back home let me think it would be before I went off to college but it did get me the job I have now.
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pkang0202



Joined: 09 Mar 2007

PostPosted: Thu Jul 01, 2010 7:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

recessiontime wrote:
pkang0202 wrote:
Anyone who says a Bachelor's degree means nothing are the same people who wouldn't be caught dead omitting that they graduated from college on a job application.


red herring.

The main argument the article makes is that the college degree is a bubble. It's just not worth what we thought it was and the cost isn't justifiable.

thanks for playing. Wink


If the cost isn't justifiable then by that logic, its not worth it to get a college degree.

If college degree is a bubble then don't get a college degree.
If real estate is a bubble don't buy real estate.


The point of the article says that college degrees don't give as much Return as previously thought. That is a flawed argument to begin with.

Quote:
Schools that performed poorly in the PayScale analysis took issue with the methodology. Among the complaints: PayScale based the study on a small, self-selecting sample of alumni from each school�on average, about 1,000�and failed to consider financial aid, which would have reduced total college costs and improved ROI for all schools. One school that argued in favor of incorporating financial aid in the calculations was Philadelphia University, which had a 30-year net return on investment of $218,000. Using the school's average financial aid award and more recent graduation rate, the 30-year net ROI would be $276,000.

Other schools said the methodology also failed to account for the intangible benefits of a college education, including the benefits to society. "If monetary Return on Investment (ROI) were the main purpose of education, most of us would make different career decisions," wrote Pat Pike, interim provost and vice-provost for education at Biola University in LaMirada, Calif., in an e-mail. "Biola's education is not primarily about money. If you calculated the ROI [to] society of a Biola education, compared with the average, it would be huge. "

While private schools dominated the top of the list, public schools proved to be far better value overall, at least for in-state students. Because of the lower costs paid by in-state students�$82,301 compared with $126,933 for out-of-state students at public institutions and $170,219 for students at private schools�they enjoyed the best net annualized ROI: 9.7 percent. The worst deal: paying out-of-state tuition at a public university. Doing so results in an average annualized net ROI of 8.4 percent. Private schools yielded a net annualized return of 9.1 percent.



Does the study use instate tuition or out of state?


The point is, Bachelor's degree IS worth it. You just gotta be smart about where you go to school and what your major is. Articles like this only encourage people NOT to go to college.
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Fox



Joined: 04 Mar 2009

PostPosted: Thu Jul 01, 2010 8:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Other schools said the methodology also failed to account for the intangible benefits of a college education, including the benefits to society.


I do think this is a somewhat good point. Looking at things from a purely economic perspective is all well and good, but there really is more to life than that. The humanities especially aren't necessarily going to provide you with a huge economic return, but can give you something entirely different. Whether or not you value that is your choice, but to just dismiss it out of hand is questionable.
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Draz



Joined: 27 Jun 2007
Location: Land of Morning Clam

PostPosted: Thu Jul 01, 2010 10:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DorkothyParker wrote:
$40,000. At least that's what I PAID for mine. Why? Suppose I could have found it discounted elsewhere? Wink


Mine was a steal at < $13,000 CAD. Oh, this article says it's not actually worth 1 million dollars?? Shame.
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recessiontime



Joined: 21 Jun 2010
Location: Got avatar privileges nyahahaha

PostPosted: Fri Jul 02, 2010 12:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fox wrote:
Quote:
Other schools said the methodology also failed to account for the intangible benefits of a college education, including the benefits to society.


I do think this is a somewhat good point. Looking at things from a purely economic perspective is all well and good, but there really is more to life than that. The humanities especially aren't necessarily going to provide you with a huge economic return, but can give you something entirely different. Whether or not you value that is your choice, but to just dismiss it out of hand is questionable.



I'm not sure what you are talking about.
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Triban



Joined: 14 Jul 2009
Location: Suwon Station

PostPosted: Fri Jul 02, 2010 1:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Eyyyy yo I got cake like I married Betty Crockerrrrr.
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Fox



Joined: 04 Mar 2009

PostPosted: Fri Jul 02, 2010 1:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

recessiontime wrote:
Fox wrote:
Quote:
Other schools said the methodology also failed to account for the intangible benefits of a college education, including the benefits to society.


I do think this is a somewhat good point. Looking at things from a purely economic perspective is all well and good, but there really is more to life than that. The humanities especially aren't necessarily going to provide you with a huge economic return, but can give you something entirely different. Whether or not you value that is your choice, but to just dismiss it out of hand is questionable.



I'm not sure what you are talking about.


That's a shame.
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Moldy Rutabaga



Joined: 01 Jul 2003
Location: Ansan, Korea

PostPosted: Fri Jul 02, 2010 5:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's important to count not only the actual costs of tuition, books, and living expenses when attending university, but also the opportunity costs. While you spent six years in university, you were not making money working and gaining job skills.

An interesting aspect the article mentions is that a university degree benefits the country you live in, generally and in the long run, outside of any immediate benefit to you. Better educated people may be more productive or less likely to be problem citizens.

If I look purely at the numbers, I was foolish to spend so many years in university, all to train for a field in which the majority make a pittance, and where very many don't find work at all. At other times I remind myself that, yes, life is more than money, and I could have a well-paying job that I loathe getting up for.

I also try to give myself a break. Our world is changing in a way it hasn't changed since the printing press or the industrial revolution. There are not many safe jobs to train for nowadays, inside or outside of university. I won't make much money doing what I do, but that doesn't mean not going to university pays off well either. I could have saved all that tuition and just been a store clerk for forty years too, making peanuts. Some gambles are worth taking.
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chellovek



Joined: 29 Feb 2008

PostPosted: Fri Jul 02, 2010 9:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fox wrote:
recessiontime wrote:
Fox wrote:
Quote:
Other schools said the methodology also failed to account for the intangible benefits of a college education, including the benefits to society.


I do think this is a somewhat good point. Looking at things from a purely economic perspective is all well and good, but there really is more to life than that. The humanities especially aren't necessarily going to provide you with a huge economic return, but can give you something entirely different. Whether or not you value that is your choice, but to just dismiss it out of hand is questionable.



I'm not sure what you are talking about.


That's a shame.


"That's a shame" +10.

I guess some people know the cost of everything but the value of nothing.
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NYC_Gal



Joined: 08 Dec 2009

PostPosted: Sat Jul 03, 2010 5:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

A BA today is like a high school diploma from 40 years ago. You need it, but it doesn't go as far as is used to. That's why many of us go on to get post graduate certs and degrees.

In NYC, one can hardly get a receptionist job without a BA. Most students there have to intern just to get a foot in the door.
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chellovek



Joined: 29 Feb 2008

PostPosted: Sat Jul 03, 2010 8:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

NYC_Gal wrote:

In NYC


*pat pat*
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recessiontime



Joined: 21 Jun 2010
Location: Got avatar privileges nyahahaha

PostPosted: Sat Jul 03, 2010 8:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

NYC_Gal wrote:
A BA today is like a high school diploma from 40 years ago. You need it, but it doesn't go as far as is used to. That's why many of us go on to get post graduate certs and degrees.

In NYC, one can hardly get a receptionist job without a BA. Most students there have to intern just to get a foot in the door.


So I guess you are saying we should incur the massive cost of college tuition so we can get the same low paying jobs high school graduates did back then. It just sounds like you are simply complicit in the devaluation of the BA. You also fail to take into account the 25% default rate for people that attend 4-yr colleges many of which have very pricey tuition.

Now read the stories from the people that say they their student loans have crushed their hopes and dreams.

http://studentloanjustice.org/California.htm

(that's just ONE State)
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