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young_clinton
Joined: 09 Sep 2009
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 Posted: Mon Jul 26, 2010 4:44 am Post subject: |
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| Think about how cute the little Korean kids are and how much I want them to learn English from me. |
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SunDevil Dre
Joined: 07 Jun 2010
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| Posted: Mon Jul 26, 2010 2:07 pm Post subject: Re: what do you do to stay positive? |
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| eljuero wrote: |
Not a bad perspective. I happen to like teaching but it's not who I am. Korea's a weird place in many respects. It's a big market with a lot of people but the sheer number of posts with negative feelings in Korea indicates something. |
Perhaps it simply indicates that ESL Cafe is popular for venting? Some folks talk up Japan as if it's more desirable than Korea, but I've seen the same negativity on that forum.
http://forums.eslcafe.com/job/viewtopic.php?t=81596&sid=7bfb74b298673082a43244c74ef299f6 |
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djsmnc
Joined: 20 Jan 2003
Location: Dave's ESL Cafe
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| Posted: Mon Jul 26, 2010 2:19 pm Post subject: Re: what do you do to stay positive? |
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| SunDevil Dre wrote: |
| eljuero wrote: |
Not a bad perspective. I happen to like teaching but it's not who I am. Korea's a weird place in many respects. It's a big market with a lot of people but the sheer number of posts with negative feelings in Korea indicates something. |
Perhaps it simply indicates that ESL Cafe is popular for venting? Some folks talk up Japan as if it's more desirable than Korea, but I've seen the same negativity on that forum.
http://forums.eslcafe.com/job/viewtopic.php?t=81596&sid=7bfb74b298673082a43244c74ef299f6 |
That's just because many ESLers are disappointed that the poor choices they made earlier in life led them to what they feel is an uncertain and unfulfilling career in cultures they are ill fit to adjust to. |
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Pa Jan Jo A Hamnida
Joined: 27 Oct 2006
Location: Not Korea
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| Posted: Mon Jul 26, 2010 9:47 pm Post subject: Re: what do you do to stay positive? |
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Which hackneyed term applies here?
THIS or QFT?
| djsmnc wrote: |
| SunDevil Dre wrote: |
| eljuero wrote: |
Not a bad perspective. I happen to like teaching but it's not who I am. Korea's a weird place in many respects. It's a big market with a lot of people but the sheer number of posts with negative feelings in Korea indicates something. |
Perhaps it simply indicates that ESL Cafe is popular for venting? Some folks talk up Japan as if it's more desirable than Korea, but I've seen the same negativity on that forum.
http://forums.eslcafe.com/job/viewtopic.php?t=81596&sid=7bfb74b298673082a43244c74ef299f6 |
That's just because many ESLers are disappointed that the poor choices they made earlier in life led them to what they feel is an uncertain and unfulfilling career in cultures they are ill fit to adjust to. |
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eljuero
Joined: 11 Aug 2009
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| Posted: Tue Jul 27, 2010 3:18 pm Post subject: Re: what do you do to stay positive? |
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| djsmnc wrote: |
| SunDevil Dre wrote: |
| eljuero wrote: |
Not a bad perspective. I happen to like teaching but it's not who I am. Korea's a weird place in many respects. It's a big market with a lot of people but the sheer number of posts with negative feelings in Korea indicates something. |
Perhaps it simply indicates that ESL Cafe is popular for venting? Some folks talk up Japan as if it's more desirable than Korea, but I've seen the same negativity on that forum.
http://forums.eslcafe.com/job/viewtopic.php?t=81596&sid=7bfb74b298673082a43244c74ef299f6 |
That's just because many ESLers are disappointed that the poor choices they made earlier in life led them to what they feel is an uncertain and unfulfilling career in cultures they are ill fit to adjust to. |
I can only speak for myself (I'm not sure if the above quote is directed at anyone in particular) but I'm not unhappy with my career choices at all nor do I feel teaching is unfulfilling (quite the opposite really).
Having said that, I think working in Korea is quite different from other parts of the world (maybe the least different from Japan?). The experiences and issues people seem to have here are pretty different from what I've seen elsewhere. ESLer's here also seem to have a very different temperament IMHO.
Korea's a country, I think it's safe to say, with what would be described in other countries as a mental health crisis ie. very high suicide rates, depression etc..
It's impossible to quantify but all of this goes into the mix of living here and of course the posts here. Having been on other boards for ESL (daves and elsewhere) the tone of things is remarkably more hostile and angry here than other places.
I don't think we're disagreeing even but back to the topic (more or less) - I think living happily in Korea takes a lot more effort than other places and the board reflects this in many ways. |
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tjmauermann
Joined: 21 Jan 2009
Location: Bundang
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| Posted: Tue Jul 27, 2010 10:52 pm Post subject: |
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I do a lot of sightseeing, I read a lot. If I get angry I try to laugh at the whole situation and grab a beer and play some video games. I do whatever I can to relieve stress. Since it is nice out I picked up a mt bike and been doing my best to get out there and ride a few times a week.
Find a hobby and get out there and try something new or meet new people. Take advantage of your surroundings. Been in Korea nearly 2 years and have enjoyed 90% of my time here just by taking everything with a grain of salt.
It beats the hell out of teaching in the States and being in the military. Its a cake walk compared to those jobs. |
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Louis VI
Joined: 05 Jul 2010
Location: In my Kingdom
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| Posted: Wed Jul 28, 2010 5:30 am Post subject: Re: what do you do to stay positive? |
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| eljuero wrote: |
| Korea's a country, I think it's safe to say, with what would be described in other countries as a mental health crisis ie. very high suicide rates, depression etc... I think living happily in Korea takes a lot more effort than other places and the board reflects this in many ways. |
Sure seems like it sometimes. One draws solace from the fact that one is here for a limited time, that one can afford to focus on the positive, knowing that what's missing could be had later on, elsewhere. It is what it is, warts and all. Some can't stand it and others try to pretend it's all smellin' like roses while most I'd say actually are realistic and make the most of their time here for what it is: a way of saving money or experiencing life overseas before settling down back home or getting away from one's troubles. Those on Dave's, both malcontents and apologists, are the exception not the rule imo. |
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shifty
Joined: 21 Jun 2004
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| Posted: Wed Jul 28, 2010 8:53 am Post subject: |
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Our lives are taken up with sports, work, spiritual/hobby and family. One can envisage as five orbs, almost like the Olympic Rings touching one another or really overlapping.
Day by day, one or another of these orbs is gonna fall flat. It�s then when the other orbs must �carry� you. Let�s say on Sunday you bombed out in the sporting event, but on the night preceding you were the man, with everyone looking up to you.
You can then use the �credit� of your peers� esteem to defray the bitter disappointment of the bailed marathon or whatever to keep you on an even keel.
So really, you have to work to create for yourself worthwhile assets in each of aforementioned spheres. When life has taken a small knock in one or other dimension you can see everything in greater proportion. More balanced.
The problem is that as an expat in Korea, work becomes paramount and problems over emphasized. Family far away, sports not like at home, just maintenance really. . many of us secular so spiritual in terms of church can also be discounted.
It�s not easy to get a satisfactory social life going in Korea. Many people do but besmirched by a drinking culture.
Therefore my suggestions are; keep up a correspondence with home, take pains so that they can�t wait for weekly letter.
Learn something new. Such as guitar, commit yourself by buying one. Then seek out fellow guitarists and one thing will lead to another.
Splurge on books/download music and stuff.
Stay committed to the teaching by eating well and staying in good health.
K�ching!! |
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kingasiatic88
Joined: 02 Aug 2009
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| Posted: Wed Jul 28, 2010 9:39 am Post subject: |
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| eljuero wrote: |
| SK has, if I read a recent article correctly, the highest suicide rate of all developed countries. |
I'd imagine suicides (per capita) are higher in some of the former soviet republics - Belarus, Poland, Kazakhstan etc.
I don't know if you would consider these 'developed' though. But they aren't third world either.
But Korea seems to have a lot of really ugly suicides - that guy back in June with the camcorder cable....aigu. |
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Who's Your Daddy?
Joined: 30 May 2010
Location: Victoria, Canada.
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| Posted: Wed Jul 28, 2010 4:49 pm Post subject: |
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| 7 years here, but I admit I survived year 2 by drinking. |
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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| Posted: Wed Jul 28, 2010 5:05 pm Post subject: |
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| eljuero wrote: |
It's a point well worth taking into consideration. SK has, if I read a recent article correctly, the highest suicide rate of all developed countries. As I recall there was an impressive gap between it and the 2nd place Japan - known for a high rate already.. |
The World Health Organization disagrees and places Japan in first place and South Korea in 2nd.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_OECD_countries_by_suicide_rate
And before anybody starts saying "Wikipedia?", let me point out that this is based on data from the WHO which is a reputable organization. |
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eljuero
Joined: 11 Aug 2009
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| Posted: Thu Jul 29, 2010 3:52 am Post subject: |
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| TheUrbanMyth wrote: |
| eljuero wrote: |
It's a point well worth taking into consideration. SK has, if I read a recent article correctly, the highest suicide rate of all developed countries. As I recall there was an impressive gap between it and the 2nd place Japan - known for a high rate already.. |
The World Health Organization disagrees and places Japan in first place and South Korea in 2nd.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_OECD_countries_by_suicide_rate
And before anybody starts saying "Wikipedia?", let me point out that this is based on data from the WHO which is a reputable organization. |
I believe the article was out of the Korea times and what was referred to was the change in the last year or two (ie. surpassed previous OECD stats). Your wiki linked stat appears to be for 2007. I can't swear to it though.
I'm not interested in quibbling over which is more suicidal - the point was that there are significant mental health issues in the country and that goes into the mix in living here.
RE: Kingasiatic
Yeah, the article I saw was about OECD countries specifically. |
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djsmnc
Joined: 20 Jan 2003
Location: Dave's ESL Cafe
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| Posted: Thu Jul 29, 2010 5:32 am Post subject: Re: what do you do to stay positive? |
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| eljuero wrote: |
| djsmnc wrote: |
| SunDevil Dre wrote: |
| eljuero wrote: |
Not a bad perspective. I happen to like teaching but it's not who I am. Korea's a weird place in many respects. It's a big market with a lot of people but the sheer number of posts with negative feelings in Korea indicates something. |
Perhaps it simply indicates that ESL Cafe is popular for venting? Some folks talk up Japan as if it's more desirable than Korea, but I've seen the same negativity on that forum.
http://forums.eslcafe.com/job/viewtopic.php?t=81596&sid=7bfb74b298673082a43244c74ef299f6 |
That's just because many ESLers are disappointed that the poor choices they made earlier in life led them to what they feel is an uncertain and unfulfilling career in cultures they are ill fit to adjust to. |
I can only speak for myself (I'm not sure if the above quote is directed at anyone in particular) but I'm not unhappy with my career choices at all nor do I feel teaching is unfulfilling (quite the opposite really).
Having said that, I think working in Korea is quite different from other parts of the world (maybe the least different from Japan?). The experiences and issues people seem to have here are pretty different from what I've seen elsewhere. ESLer's here also seem to have a very different temperament IMHO.
Korea's a country, I think it's safe to say, with what would be described in other countries as a mental health crisis ie. very high suicide rates, depression etc..
It's impossible to quantify but all of this goes into the mix of living here and of course the posts here. Having been on other boards for ESL (daves and elsewhere) the tone of things is remarkably more hostile and angry here than other places.
I don't think we're disagreeing even but back to the topic (more or less) - I think living happily in Korea takes a lot more effort than other places and the board reflects this in many ways. |
Well, I suppose it is also my own subjective coping mechanism, though I have found that other foreigners I surround myself with are quite optimistic and pleasant as well. The others, as I shall generically refer to them, have more often than not seemed to be unable to either:
1. Stand up for themselves (patiently or responsibly) when wronged
2. Reach the stage of acceptance of being in a culture different from their own (particularly the people in a new country for the first time)
3. Recognize that they aren't going to be given red carpet treatment just because they are from what they consider to be a more civilized, experienced, and/or powerful society
4. Control their intake of chemicals that provide temporary relief
5. Motivate themselves to learn a new language or befriend people to build a support group (and by that I am referring even to a haphazard one that can at least cover a bus fare or taxi if you lose your wallet)
or
6. Make an effort to be what some might consider a halfway decent teacher
Of course, those are generalizations, and with all the available of jobs that have gradually opened up here over the years there have been more than a fair share of shady, corrupt, and downright nasty employment situations. Having come here FOB in a new country for the first time with a crummy job that required a few entanglements, though, I think there is a general resourcefulness people should have when leaving home and going far away. You and I could both go to live in Mexico for the first time and have some possessions stolen after a month and not be paid by our employers, and I could go on fussing about how Mexicans are filthy drug selling murderers and thieves with greasy food whereas you would have already picked up some Spanish, found a few friends (Mexican and expat), and told your boss that if he/she doesn't pay up that you'll be promptly headed elsewhere.
As far as the bad choices thing I mentioned goes, I personally think that someone who decided to come and teach English with no type of background experience and complains about how things are working out has made a bad decision. I wouldn't go take an oil rig job in southeast Asia or the Gulf of Mexico, even though I could snag a hefty sum of cash over a year, because I know that I am not prepared or trained for such a venture and would not know how to cope with anything that went wrong. |
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eljuero
Joined: 11 Aug 2009
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| Posted: Thu Jul 29, 2010 6:01 am Post subject: Re: what do you do to stay positive? |
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| djsmnc wrote: |
| eljuero wrote: |
| djsmnc wrote: |
| SunDevil Dre wrote: |
| eljuero wrote: |
Not a bad perspective. I happen to like teaching but it's not who I am. Korea's a weird place in many respects. It's a big market with a lot of people but the sheer number of posts with negative feelings in Korea indicates something. |
Perhaps it simply indicates that ESL Cafe is popular for venting? Some folks talk up Japan as if it's more desirable than Korea, but I've seen the same negativity on that forum.
http://forums.eslcafe.com/job/viewtopic.php?t=81596&sid=7bfb74b298673082a43244c74ef299f6 |
That's just because many ESLers are disappointed that the poor choices they made earlier in life led them to what they feel is an uncertain and unfulfilling career in cultures they are ill fit to adjust to. |
I can only speak for myself (I'm not sure if the above quote is directed at anyone in particular) but I'm not unhappy with my career choices at all nor do I feel teaching is unfulfilling (quite the opposite really).
Having said that, I think working in Korea is quite different from other parts of the world (maybe the least different from Japan?). The experiences and issues people seem to have here are pretty different from what I've seen elsewhere. ESLer's here also seem to have a very different temperament IMHO.
Korea's a country, I think it's safe to say, with what would be described in other countries as a mental health crisis ie. very high suicide rates, depression etc..
It's impossible to quantify but all of this goes into the mix of living here and of course the posts here. Having been on other boards for ESL (daves and elsewhere) the tone of things is remarkably more hostile and angry here than other places.
I don't think we're disagreeing even but back to the topic (more or less) - I think living happily in Korea takes a lot more effort than other places and the board reflects this in many ways. |
Well, I suppose it is also my own subjective coping mechanism, though I have found that other foreigners I surround myself with are quite optimistic and pleasant as well. The others, as I shall generically refer to them, have more often than not seemed to be unable to either:
1. Stand up for themselves (patiently or responsibly) when wronged
2. Reach the stage of acceptance of being in a culture different from their own (particularly the people in a new country for the first time)
3. Recognize that they aren't going to be given red carpet treatment just because they are from what they consider to be a more civilized, experienced, and/or powerful society
4. Control their intake of chemicals that provide temporary relief
5. Motivate themselves to learn a new language or befriend people to build a support group (and by that I am referring even to a haphazard one that can at least cover a bus fare or taxi if you lose your wallet)
or
6. Make an effort to be what some might consider a halfway decent teacher
Of course, those are generalizations, and with all the available of jobs that have gradually opened up here over the years there have been more than a fair share of shady, corrupt, and downright nasty employment situations. Having come here FOB in a new country for the first time with a crummy job that required a few entanglements, though, I think there is a general resourcefulness people should have when leaving home and going far away. You and I could both go to live in Mexico for the first time and have some possessions stolen after a month and not be paid by our employers, and I could go on fussing about how Mexicans are filthy drug selling murderers and thieves with greasy food whereas you would have already picked up some Spanish, found a few friends (Mexican and expat), and told your boss that if he/she doesn't pay up that you'll be promptly headed elsewhere.
As far as the bad choices thing I mentioned goes, I personally think that someone who decided to come and teach English with no type of background experience and complains about how things are working out has made a bad decision. I wouldn't go take an oil rig job in southeast Asia or the Gulf of Mexico, even though I could snag a hefty sum of cash over a year, because I know that I am not prepared or trained for such a venture and would not know how to cope with anything that went wrong. |
You make some good points. I've been surprised at times to hear people don't even have a TESOL certificate and state outright that they don't take it to seriously (teaching). When you combine that with what sounds like an influx of people from the States who are really "just here to pay off some loans" or can't find work in their field it's a good set up for unhappiness.
If the market that's hiring accepts applicants with little or no experience then you can't blame people who need a job from trying it either. I'm on the right side of your examples 1-6 (exception #5 - for the amount of time I"ll be here I'm not interested in learning Korean but do have some K teacher's in my social circle) but have narrowly avoided problems at work - the communication issues (not English per se) can be a minefield even for those who are pretty responsible and skilled at communicating.
Point about alcohol intake: Couldn't agree more. It can be a bit of an embarrassment to see and impossible to imagine someone doing a good job the following week at school with the apparent intake! I"d be hard pressed to say which may comes first in some people - overindulging in alcohol which leads to other problems or genuinely unhappy with Korea and drinking more because of it. I barely drink at all but have to say I drink more here than ever before.
So, just for clarity, I'm not disagreeing with your points - they are part of the complex picture here.
A side note, but what the hell:
Some job markets are not clear to put it mildly. I've lived and taught in Mexico and got burned there as well as in Central America. The information you really need in those markets isn't necessarily posted or online anywhere. You learn by experience and it's often the hard way. It can differ greatly from region to region or city to city. Korea, by comparison, is pretty standardized. |
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lorenchristopher
Joined: 25 Dec 2007
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| Posted: Fri Jul 30, 2010 10:47 pm Post subject: Re: what do you do to stay positive? |
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| questionmark wrote: |
I worked in counseling centers for a number of years and one technique to avoid "burn out" is to practice "separating yourself from the situation." When you're in the classroom, keep doing your professional best but from now on when you're teaching don't take anything personally. Let students talk, complain, whatever. You can't do anything about that.
Thank the obnoxious students for their comments and keep the class moving on. These students are insecure and waiting to get in a debate with you. The best thing is to ignore them.
Remember your nice students, forget your bad students when you leave at the end of the day.
You also need to keep in mind that mental illness is a pervasive problem across Korea (suicide, dementia, general unhappiness), so you will have to deal with students who are irrational, management that is irrational, etc. Don't take advice from people with problems; it will cause you problems.
Exercise, activities with friends outside of work, weekend trips, fun stuff that has nothing to do with school ...anything to take your mind off of work will help. |
^This! I saved this on my computer to read every now and then to remind myself of this philosophy, it's similar to my own.
I'm going on 3 years here and sometimes I feel exhausted and frustrated when I have a difficult class or student, or am just exhausted in general. I remind myself that I am a good teacher to my students, I know this, my students like me a lot.....although some of them misbehave and are disrespectful that doesn't reflect on me 100%, and I cannot control all of them so I shouldn't get too emotionally involved.
I take deep breaths, listen to a good song on my iphone, remind myself of my paycheck, remember why I love Korea and my friends and loved ones and fun life I have here....and then the problems and negativity about work fade away.
Ironically, when I practice this way of emotionally detaching myself from the stress of work is when I do my best teaching and am most engaging with my students. Perhaps because I am indeed just thinking positively, relaxed, and in a good mood therefor the students pick up on that and we all have a good time. |
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