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Sergio Stefanuto
Joined: 14 May 2009
Location: UK
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 Posted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 4:52 am Post subject: Eco Terror at Discovery Channel |
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His name is James Lee � the Discovery channel attempted eco-suicide-bomber.
Just read some of the manifesto he posted on the internet and see for yourself:
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The humans? The planet does not need humans.
You MUST KNOW the human population is behind all the pollution and problems in the world, and YET you encourage the exact opposite instead of discouraging human growth and procreation. Surely you MUST ALREADY KNOW this! |
Does this sound like the ravings of a sad, deranged loner on the wilder fringes of eco-fascist lunacy? Not to me it doesn�t. Strip away the block capitals and what you have, word for word, is the core manifesto of the entire global green movement.
Some greens, such as Al Gore, the Prince of Wales [and] David Attenborough try to express their philosophy more diplomatically. Others, such as James Lee, are more forthright. Ideologically, however, there is not a cigarette paper�s difference between them.
The modern environmental movement is not kind, caring or gentle. It is a series of ticking time bombs waiting to blow up in our face.
http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/jamesdelingpole/100052207/james-lee-is-al-gore-is-prince-charles-is-the-unabomber/ |
My sentiments entirely. |
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geldedgoat
Joined: 05 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 5:48 am Post subject: Re: Eco Terror at Discovery Channel |
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| Sergio Stefanuto wrote: |
The humans? The planet does not need humans.
You MUST KNOW the human population is behind all the pollution and problems in the world, and YET you encourage the exact opposite instead of discouraging human growth and procreation. Surely you MUST ALREADY KNOW this! |
Well, his first assertion is true; if we were to up and vanish, the world wouldn't follow with us. Pollution? Mostly, yes, though its catastrophic effects are as yet unproven. And outside of disease, the occasional mauling, and natural disasters, humanity is responsible for all the world's problems (unless you want to blame the Earth for not being big enough to accommodate everyone and their ideologies).
But to compare this lunatic (and Nazis!  ) with all eco-minded individuals is more than a little disingenuous, especially by using one of the rational excerpts from his manifesto to do so. There's quite a few people out there incredibly interested in changing humanity's attitude towards the environment who would never get to the point Lee did. |
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Junior
Joined: 18 Nov 2005
Location: the eye
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| Posted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 5:50 am Post subject: |
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| the human population is behind all the pollution and problems in the world |
This is an undeniable fact.
Sergio I see where you're coming from. Being pro-environment does not equate to being anti-human. Where this guy made his mistake.
I do agree though humans should really be taking radical steps to look after our planet rather than trashing and over-exploiting it for short term benefits. I wouldn't bomb anyone to make that point though of course. But this sort of thing will probably get worse so long as nobody listens. |
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Leon
Joined: 31 May 2010
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| Posted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 5:54 am Post subject: |
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| I don't think that all environmentalists have this view point. I think that environmentalism can, and should be, a selfish thing. I want the world to be in the best shape possible because that is where I, and other humans, live. |
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mises
Joined: 05 Nov 2007
Location: retired
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| Posted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 10:11 am Post subject: |
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| Leon wrote: |
| I think that environmentalism can, and should be, a selfish thing. I want the world to be in the best shape possible because that is where I, and other humans, live. |
I agree. The earth should be protected because it is in our interests for it to be healthy. |
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On the other hand
Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Location: I walk along the avenue
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| Posted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 10:52 am Post subject: |
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Going by his Wikipedia entry, Lee would seem to have been a subscriber to the hardcore malthusian, anti-immigration tendency within the environmentalist movement...
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| His manifesto also railed against "immigration pollution and anchor baby filth" |
And of course, when an Asian American starts carrying on with expressions like "anchor baby filth", ya gotta think there might be some sort of personal psychological demons at work.
I'd hesitate to link this guy too closely to any respectable environmentalism. He seems like kind of a screwloose who could just as easily have latched onto another cause as his outlet. |
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The Happy Warrior
Joined: 10 Feb 2010
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| Posted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 11:59 am Post subject: |
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This is a common rhetorical trope. Take extremist X's words, then connect him to a movement, then associate the ideological roots of that movement with X's statements, then claim X's statements reflect the 'essence' of that movement.
Al Gore may be fantastically wrong. But he is not a 'diplomatic' version of this nut-job. He has tried to peacefully convince living humans to embrace the environment as their own. At times, he has offered exaggerated and false data. Occasionally he has portrayed his opponents as unethical. But who doesn't act this way when they become passionate about a political position? |
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Big_Bird
Joined: 31 Jan 2003
Location: Sometimes here sometimes there...
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| Posted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 2:29 pm Post subject: |
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Yes, one nutty eco warrior has shown his true colours, and now we can be sure that anyone you overhear in the cafeteria expressing his concern about the environment is a wild-eyed homocidal maniac - a timebomb waiting to explode!
| The Happy Warrior wrote: |
| This is a common rhetorical trope. Take extremist X's words, then connect him to a movement, then associate the ideological roots of that movement with X's statements, then claim X's statements reflect the 'essence' of that movement. |
You saved me the trouble. Ironic, given Sergio's great love of pointing out flawed logic.
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| Al Gore may be fantastically wrong. But he is not a 'diplomatic' version of this nut-job. He has tried to peacefully convince living humans to embrace the environment as their own. At times, he has offered exaggerated and false data. Occasionally he has portrayed his opponents as unethical. But who doesn't act this way when they become passionate about a political position? |
Is Al Gore fantastically wrong? Not a challenge, just a question motivated out of curiousity - one has be clear about these things in Internet Warrior stomping grounds.  What has he been found fantastically wrong on? I've never watched his movie, and I've never read him or listened to him, but I have read discussons where it is has been pointed out that at least some of his 'errors' were caused by the fact that his film was made before some later research was published - i.e. that people were comparing what his film said against the new 'improved on' research that Gore wouldn't have had access to during the making of the film. That's something that Gore couldn't have helped.
It's just a guess, but I rather suspect that (although I imagine him to be a somewhat flawed character - he's a politian after all) what he says is mostly correct (as far as scientists can determine) and that a few errors have been made from molehill to mountain. Rather like the IPCC 'debacle.' |
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conrad2
Joined: 05 Nov 2009
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| Posted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 2:31 pm Post subject: |
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| James Lee goes on about anchor babies and immigrant filth yet he was convicted of smuggling illegal aliens from Mexico. Bizarre. Oh. And the world doesnt really need walruses either. |
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The Happy Warrior
Joined: 10 Feb 2010
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| Posted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 3:00 pm Post subject: |
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| Big_Bird wrote: |
| The Happy Warrior wrote: |
| This is a common rhetorical trope. Take extremist X's words, then connect him to a movement, then associate the ideological roots of that movement with X's statements, then claim X's statements reflect the 'essence' of that movement. |
You saved me the trouble. Ironic, given Sergio's great love of pointing out flawed logic.
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| Al Gore may be fantastically wrong. But he is not a 'diplomatic' version of this nut-job. He has tried to peacefully convince living humans to embrace the environment as their own. At times, he has offered exaggerated and false data. Occasionally he has portrayed his opponents as unethical. But who doesn't act this way when they become passionate about a political position? |
Is Al Gore fantastically wrong? Not a challenge, just a question motivated out of curiousity - one has be clear about these things in Internet Warrior stomping grounds. What has he been found fantastically wrong on? I've never watched his movie, and I've never read him or listened to him, but I have read discussons where it is has been pointed out that at least some of his 'errors' were caused by the fact that his film was made before some later research was published - i.e. that people were comparing what his film said against the new 'improved on' research that Gore wouldn't have had access to during the making of the film. That's something that Gore couldn't have helped.
It's just a guess, but I rather suspect that (although I imagine him to be a somewhat flawed character - he's a politian after all) what he says is mostly correct (as far as scientists can determine) and that a few errors have been made from molehill to mountain. Rather like the IPCC 'debacle.' |
I don't really know if Al Gore is right or wrong. He is a political figure, not a climate scientist. My guess is that he gets a lot of things right. But I also believe that as a former Vice President and Democratic Presidential Candidate, he's helped polarize science. That's unfortunate. |
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Axiom
Joined: 18 Jan 2008
Location: Brisbane, Australia
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young_clinton
Joined: 09 Sep 2009
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| Posted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 4:07 pm Post subject: |
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No! This video is right on target.
Global warming is going to cause serious problems and we may be too late to do anything about it. |
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Axiom
Joined: 18 Jan 2008
Location: Brisbane, Australia
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| Posted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 5:25 pm Post subject: |
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http://weblog.greenpeace.org/climate/2010/04/will_the_real_climategate_plea_1.html
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"If you're one of those who have spent their lives undermining progressive climate legislation, bankrolling junk science, fueling spurious debates around false solutions, and cattle-prodding democratically-elected governments into submission, then hear this:
We know who you are. We know where you live. We know where you work. And we be many, but you be few.� |
Interesting, they have moved the original webpage to here http://gp-bc7f8.posterous.com/ and replaced it with some kind of justification for the threats.
Last edited by Axiom on Fri Sep 03, 2010 5:39 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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Fox
Joined: 04 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 5:35 pm Post subject: |
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| Leon wrote: |
| I think that environmentalism can, and should be, a selfish thing. I want the world to be in the best shape possible because that is where I, and other humans, live. |
This is my position as well. |
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Axiom
Joined: 18 Jan 2008
Location: Brisbane, Australia
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| Posted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 5:45 pm Post subject: |
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| Fox wrote: |
| Leon wrote: |
| I think that environmentalism can, and should be, a selfish thing. I want the world to be in the best shape possible because that is where I, and other humans, live. |
This is my position as well. |
It depends on what you mean by selfish.
If it means telling your neighbour about recycling and encouraging him to do the right thing, no problems.
If it means punching him in the face because you saw him put a plastic milk bottle in with the non-recyclables, then you have lost me. |
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