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student turnover rate in a hagwon??

 
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cassimira



Joined: 26 Dec 2009
Location: Daeso, South Korea

PostPosted: Thu Oct 07, 2010 12:08 am    Post subject: student turnover rate in a hagwon?? Reply with quote

In ya'll's experience, what is the normal student turnover rate in a hagwon??
Our Korean friends have told us that its normal to have a pretty high turnover rate, but we're concerned our number might be excessively high.

I've been crunching numbers, and it looks like, since our first month, our hagwon has lost about 28% of the kids in the English program in the past 7 months. Now, a good amount of this was stuff beyond our control.... several kids moved to new towns, or did badly on a school test at the public school so their moms panicked, etc. We also had a bit of a organizational nightmare in a staff/curriculum shakedown our first few months, so some of it was that.

However, given this, does this rate seem unusually high to anyone else? The kids seem to really like us, so we're kind of at a loss as to what's going on.
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Son Deureo!



Joined: 30 Apr 2003

PostPosted: Thu Oct 07, 2010 1:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

As I'm sure your boss has already told you, the sole factor that determines student retention and recruitment is how good its foreign teachers are. If 28% of the students have left in recent months, that means that 28% of the students were dissatisfied with you as a teacher. Period.

I'm sure there will be naysayers on this board who will be quick to tell you that other factors may have been involved despite your best efforts. Some will tell you it may be because the students were lured away by a rival English hogwon, or that hogwons are a seasonal and cyclical business with new students arriving every winter and summer, only to disappear every spring and autumn. You may also hear that some parents may wish to have their children focus on other priorities besides English such as taekwondo or mathematics. You may even hear that some parents will decide their children should spend more time with their families.

Don't believe them. It's all your fault. How could your boss possibly be wrong when he is admonishing his subordinates?

Now go ahead and teach those Saturday classes and stop asking what happened to your health insurance and overtime pay while your boss drives a brand new car to work.
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Nester Noodlemon



Joined: 16 Jan 2009

PostPosted: Thu Oct 07, 2010 4:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Son Deureo! wrote:
As I'm sure your boss has already told you, the sole factor that determines student retention and recruitment is how good its foreign teachers are. If 28% of the students have left in recent months, that means that 28% of the students were dissatisfied with you as a teacher. Period.

I'm sure there will be naysayers on this board who will be quick to tell you that other factors may have been involved despite your best efforts. Some will tell you it may be because the students were lured away by a rival English hogwon, or that hogwons are a seasonal and cyclical business with new students arriving every winter and summer, only to disappear every spring and autumn. You may also hear that some parents may wish to have their children focus on other priorities besides English such as taekwondo or mathematics. You may even hear that some parents will decide their children should spend more time with their families.

Don't believe them. It's all your fault. How could your boss possibly be wrong when he is admonishing his subordinates?

Now go ahead and teach those Saturday classes and stop asking what happened to your health insurance and overtime pay while your boss drives a brand new car to work.


this^

Sir Son Deureo, you should be considered for a Dave's ESL Noble Award!
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northway



Joined: 05 Jul 2010

PostPosted: Thu Oct 07, 2010 4:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

My school lost 50% of its enrollment in kindergarten last year, but we're still doing fine.

My friend actually has it written into her contract that if she loses a third of her kinder homeroom she can be fired. I told her not to sign it and they insisted that it was very rare and only when teachers do a bad job. I call BS.
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raptorsfan



Joined: 16 Jul 2009

PostPosted: Thu Oct 07, 2010 6:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
If 28% of the students have left in recent months, that means that 28% of the students were dissatisfied with you as a teacher


Yeah, but that doesn't mean you are a bad teacher.
Remember, most of the students want to play and joke around in class(in Korean) as they were dragged into the hagwons by their parents.
If you try to be like a real teacher and be strict with your students, then they will definately learn, but they will hate you.
If you decide to be like an edu-tainer, then the students will like you, but most likely they won't learn very much.
Of course, some edu-taners are able to teach exceptionally well. But they are a rare breed

In the end, it comes down to who decides to switch schools. The parents or the students?
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Radius



Joined: 20 Dec 2009

PostPosted: Thu Oct 07, 2010 6:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

raptorsfan wrote:
Quote:
If 28% of the students have left in recent months, that means that 28% of the students were dissatisfied with you as a teacher


Yeah, but that doesn't mean you are a bad teacher.
Remember, most of the students want to play and joke around in class(in Korean) as they were dragged into the hagwons by their parents.
If you try to be like a real teacher and be strict with your students, then they will definately learn, but they will hate you.
If you decide to be like an edu-tainer, then the students will like you, but most likely they won't learn very much.
Of course, some edu-taners are able to teach exceptionally well. But they are a rare breed

In the end, it comes down to who decides to switch schools. The parents or the students?

And there you have it folks.
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northway



Joined: 05 Jul 2010

PostPosted: Thu Oct 07, 2010 6:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

raptorsfan wrote:
Quote:
If 28% of the students have left in recent months, that means that 28% of the students were dissatisfied with you as a teacher


Yeah, but that doesn't mean you are a bad teacher.
Remember, most of the students want to play and joke around in class(in Korean) as they were dragged into the hagwons by their parents.
If you try to be like a real teacher and be strict with your students, then they will definately learn, but they will hate you.
If you decide to be like an edu-tainer, then the students will like you, but most likely they won't learn very much.
Of course, some edu-taners are able to teach exceptionally well. But they are a rare breed

In the end, it comes down to who decides to switch schools. The parents or the students?


I find that there's an inverse relationship between the age of a student and how effective you can be as an edutainer. With kindergarten it can get you very far, with sixth graders they're not going to learn much.


Last edited by northway on Thu Oct 07, 2010 7:31 am; edited 1 time in total
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Son Deureo!



Joined: 30 Apr 2003

PostPosted: Thu Oct 07, 2010 7:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

raptorsfan wrote:
Quote:
If 28% of the students have left in recent months, that means that 28% of the students were dissatisfied with you as a teacher


Yeah, but that doesn't mean you are a bad teacher.


Please try to understand, it is Korean culture. Some of the mothers have been complaining about her teaching. She must not play the game during the class, and her lesson must also be more funny. She must also spend more time preparing for her classes, including the new one which is waiting in the classroom for her right now even though it was not on her schedule. That is why 28% of the students have left her school. She must be more diligent.
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tomato



Joined: 31 Jan 2003
Location: I get so little foreign language experience, I must be in Koreatown, Los Angeles.

PostPosted: Thu Oct 07, 2010 11:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Son Deureo! is right.
I once worked at a school where there were three foreign teachers, each of us teaching one-third of the students.
One day, the director sent notes home with the students, but she didn't tell us what the notes said.
One of the other foreign teachers asked the advanced students what the notes said.
They said that it was announcing a fee increase.
Two-thirds of the students quit.
The director kept me in the school and transferred the other two foreign teachers to another branch.
Then she told me that the students quit because I was such a boring teacher.
I'm sure she was telling the truth because a Korean director would never lie.
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southernman



Joined: 15 Jan 2010
Location: On the mainland again

PostPosted: Fri Oct 08, 2010 2:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

tomato wrote:
Son Deureo! is right.
I once worked at a school where there were three foreign teachers, each of us teaching one-third of the students.
One day, the director sent notes home with the students, but she didn't tell us what the notes said.
One of the other foreign teachers asked the advanced students what the notes said.
They said that it was announcing a fee increase.
Two-thirds of the students quit.
The director kept me in the school and transferred the other two foreign teachers to another branch.
Then she told me that the students quit because I was such a boring teacher.
I'm sure she was telling the truth because a Korean director would never lie.


My last Hagwon put the student fees up 25%, nothing changed, in fact the role slowly increased as before.

For 2/3rds of the students to leave is pretty conclusive..... Either the Hagwon or the teachers sucked and mommy wasn't going to pay more for a sub standard product
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Juregen



Joined: 30 May 2006

PostPosted: Fri Oct 08, 2010 2:45 am    Post subject: Re: student turnover rate in a hagwon?? Reply with quote

cassimira wrote:
In ya'll's experience, what is the normal student turnover rate in a hagwon??
Our Korean friends have told us that its normal to have a pretty high turnover rate, but we're concerned our number might be excessively high.

I've been crunching numbers, and it looks like, since our first month, our hagwon has lost about 28% of the kids in the English program in the past 7 months. Now, a good amount of this was stuff beyond our control.... several kids moved to new towns, or did badly on a school test at the public school so their moms panicked, etc. We also had a bit of a organizational nightmare in a staff/curriculum shakedown our first few months, so some of it was that.

However, given this, does this rate seem unusually high to anyone else? The kids seem to really like us, so we're kind of at a loss as to what's going on.


This is a bit high but not an abnormal high turn over rate.

What is more important are the reasons for the turn over, if they move out of town, it is not your problem, if they do bad at their test, that is your problem.
Then the shakedown indicates instability in the school, which parents dislike completely.

Kids liking you or not matters only in the negative.
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Juregen



Joined: 30 May 2006

PostPosted: Fri Oct 08, 2010 2:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

tomato wrote:
Son Deureo! is right.
I once worked at a school where there were three foreign teachers, each of us teaching one-third of the students.
One day, the director sent notes home with the students, but she didn't tell us what the notes said.
One of the other foreign teachers asked the advanced students what the notes said.
They said that it was announcing a fee increase.
Two-thirds of the students quit.
The director kept me in the school and transferred the other two foreign teachers to another branch.
Then she told me that the students quit because I was such a boring teacher.
I'm sure she was telling the truth because a Korean director would never lie.


I am going to increase my fee with 25%!
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