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jrabernethy
Joined: 14 Jul 2010
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 Posted: Mon Jan 03, 2011 4:47 pm Post subject: How important is sex, race, etc. to landing a decent job? |
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I've been reading a lot on these forums as of late, and it's been pretty depressing...
I'm a 26 year old male, who is white/korean biracial. I have a TESOL certificate from a large American university, and I'm working on my MA in Linguistics from the same university. I really want to go work in Korea opposed to other places for heritage reasons and because I have some friends there.
Do you think I have any shot at getting a decent position in a decent location (like PS) or would I be stuck taking a Hagwon position in the boonies? Do you think I should avoid making any reference to being Korean, and try to highlight my white features (like dying hair, etc.)?
I don't really plan on staying in the system for that long, 2-3 years maximum before I move on.
I hope all my work for the past years trying to get these qualifications isn't completely for naught... |
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ttompatz
Joined: 05 Sep 2005
Location: Kwangju, South Korea
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| Posted: Mon Jan 03, 2011 5:07 pm Post subject: |
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Just apply as a (insert nationality here). I am assuming you hold a US passport.
Unless you qualify for an F4 visa (Korean ancestry) or have very "Asian" features I wouldn't mention it.
You certainly qualify for a PS position but may find yourself overlooked as being "over qualified" (read too expensive) with a TESOL cert and MA.
There are about 30,000 E2 visas issued each year and (rough estimate) about 20% are female so your chances of actually getting a job are pretty good.
With your MA (even without experience) you may also be able to land a university position at one smaller universities (but may have to front your own airfare to Korea).
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jrabernethy
Joined: 14 Jul 2010
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| Posted: Mon Jan 03, 2011 5:28 pm Post subject: |
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thanks once again for your help ttompatz
After googling it, I'm pretty sure I qualify for the F4 visa. I didn't even know about it... this is huge! I'm definitely going to look into it.
About the PS position, I don't mind taking a pay cut if it's a decent position in a good location. Hopefully they will give me that option.
I've always thought about uni positions, but figured I would look at them when I had time and an already established position through some program. But heck, with that F4 visa, I think my ability to look for a position increased significantly. |
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interestedinhanguk
Joined: 23 Aug 2010
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| Posted: Mon Jan 03, 2011 5:29 pm Post subject: |
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| ttompatz wrote: |
There are about 30,000 E2 visas issued each year and (rough estimate) about 20% are female so your chances of actually getting a job are pretty good.
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When was that? |
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ttompatz
Joined: 05 Sep 2005
Location: Kwangju, South Korea
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| Posted: Mon Jan 03, 2011 7:54 pm Post subject: |
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| interestedinhanguk wrote: |
| ttompatz wrote: |
There are about 30,000 E2 visas issued each year and (rough estimate) about 20% are female so your chances of actually getting a job are pretty good.
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When was that? |
2009 immigration (published) figures.
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PigeonFart
Joined: 27 Apr 2006
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| Posted: Mon Jan 03, 2011 9:10 pm Post subject: |
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You have nothing to worry about. Koreans have no preference regarding age, gender, race, nationality, or sexual orientation. South Korea is one of the most open minded countries in the world. Teachers are hired on their experience, qualifications, and passion for the job. I have never met a more enlightened and progressive people before.
p.s. I just fell and bumped my head a few minutes ago so i might not be talking any sense.  |
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olsanairbase
Joined: 30 Aug 2010
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| Posted: Mon Jan 03, 2011 9:11 pm Post subject: |
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| jrabernethy wrote: |
thanks once again for your help ttompatz
After googling it, I'm pretty sure I qualify for the F4 visa. I didn't even know about it... this is huge! I'm definitely going to look into it.
About the PS position, I don't mind taking a pay cut if it's a decent position in a good location. Hopefully they will give me that option.
I've always thought about uni positions, but figured I would look at them when I had time and an already established position through some program. But heck, with that F4 visa, I think my ability to look for a position increased significantly. |
I would hold your thanks for now. Koreans are notorious for paying Koreans and Korean Americans less than they pay non-Koreans from Western countries. |
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jrwhite82
Joined: 22 May 2010
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| Posted: Mon Jan 03, 2011 9:20 pm Post subject: |
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Yeah, the advantage of the F4 is that it gives you the ability to switch jobs easily, or work two or three jobs at once. It's a visa that allows you to stay in Korea and work, but is not tied to your job. And you can get around the hassle of a background check which can take months to complete.
The E2 is a work visa, so it is only good as long as you are working for your sponsor. You can't work anywhere else, unless they give you permission (good luck with that).
The market however is different. Most hagwons, parents and administrators want white people in their English classrooms. Why? I still don't understand the logic. But it is true. Sure many schools do hire F4s, but it might be a little harder.
As for the Masters, I recommend getting it. It will make you much more marketable. On the otherhand, in this economy some schools don't want to pay you extra for it. But they still wouldn't mind having you for the same money as someone who is unqualified. I still think MOST schools would be willing to hire you. Also, with those credentials (are you also bilingual?) you can look into international schools. |
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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| Posted: Mon Jan 03, 2011 9:45 pm Post subject: |
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| olsanairbase wrote: |
| jrabernethy wrote: |
thanks once again for your help ttompatz
After googling it, I'm pretty sure I qualify for the F4 visa. I didn't even know about it... this is huge! I'm definitely going to look into it.
About the PS position, I don't mind taking a pay cut if it's a decent position in a good location. Hopefully they will give me that option.
I've always thought about uni positions, but figured I would look at them when I had time and an already established position through some program. But heck, with that F4 visa, I think my ability to look for a position increased significantly. |
I would hold your thanks for now. Koreans are notorious for paying Koreans and Korean Americans less than they pay non-Koreans from Western countries. |
For entry-level jobs involving speaking English yes...not so much in other fields. |
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interestedinhanguk
Joined: 23 Aug 2010
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| Posted: Mon Jan 03, 2011 10:28 pm Post subject: |
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| ttompatz wrote: |
| interestedinhanguk wrote: |
| ttompatz wrote: |
There are about 30,000 E2 visas issued each year and (rough estimate) about 20% are female so your chances of actually getting a job are pretty good.
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When was that? |
2009 immigration (published) figures.
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The job market is a lot different now. |
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jrwhite82
Joined: 22 May 2010
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| Posted: Mon Jan 03, 2011 10:36 pm Post subject: |
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| interestedinhanguk wrote: |
| ttompatz wrote: |
| interestedinhanguk wrote: |
| ttompatz wrote: |
There are about 30,000 E2 visas issued each year and (rough estimate) about 20% are female so your chances of actually getting a job are pretty good.
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When was that? |
2009 immigration (published) figures.
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The job market is a lot different now. |
Source? |
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ttompatz
Joined: 05 Sep 2005
Location: Kwangju, South Korea
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| Posted: Mon Jan 03, 2011 10:40 pm Post subject: |
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| jrwhite82 wrote: |
| interestedinhanguk wrote: |
| ttompatz wrote: |
| interestedinhanguk wrote: |
| ttompatz wrote: |
There are about 30,000 E2 visas issued each year and (rough estimate) about 20% are female so your chances of actually getting a job are pretty good.
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When was that? |
2009 immigration (published) figures.
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The job market is a lot different now. |
Source? |
No it isn't. There may be a bit more competition for jobs (so you won't be getting 20 offers for each application) and there may be some budget squeezing but the demand is still high (in the 25-30,000 range).
2009 figures are not that out of date either - 2010 just ended and the 2010 figures won't be out for a couple months yet.
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jrabernethy
Joined: 14 Jul 2010
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| Posted: Tue Jan 04, 2011 4:52 am Post subject: |
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| jrwhite82 wrote: |
| The market however is different. Most hagwons, parents and administrators want white people in their English classrooms. Why? I still don't understand the logic. But it is true. Sure many schools do hire F4s, but it might be a little harder. |
Yeah, I've been reading a lot about the discriminatory practices up on these boards. That's one reason I was wondering if I should play up the white features. Supposedly, according to Koreans and other people I know, I have really "white" features. Most people I make contact with think I'm white until they look really closely at the eyes or something. Still not a woman though, so I imagine that doesn't help.
| Quote: |
| As for the Masters, I recommend getting it. It will make you much more marketable. On the otherhand, in this economy some schools don't want to pay you extra for it. But they still wouldn't mind having you for the same money as someone who is unqualified. I still think MOST schools would be willing to hire you. Also, with those credentials (are you also bilingual?) you can look into international schools. |
I'm definitely getting the masters - I was planning on getting the Masters even if I don't plan on going overseas with it as I would like to get a PhD someday. (TBH my masters isn't even in Applied SLA/TEFL but in theoretical SLA, which I don't know if that hurts or helps).
And like I said I don't mind taking a pay cut when working in an entry level position. Just as long as I have enough to make payments on my loans. Thankfully, the F4 should give me enough options I think.
Unfortunately, I'm not bilingual. My primary reason for going to teach in Korea is to learn the language. |
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olsanairbase
Joined: 30 Aug 2010
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| Posted: Fri Jan 07, 2011 5:09 pm Post subject: |
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| jrabernethy wrote: |
| jrwhite82 wrote: |
| The market however is different. Most hagwons, parents and administrators want white people in their English classrooms. Why? I still don't understand the logic. But it is true. Sure many schools do hire F4s, but it might be a little harder. |
Yeah, I've been reading a lot about the discriminatory practices up on these boards. That's one reason I was wondering if I should play up the white features. Supposedly, according to Koreans and other people I know, I have really "white" features. Most people I make contact with think I'm white until they look really closely at the eyes or something. Still not a woman though, so I imagine that doesn't help.
| Quote: |
| As for the Masters, I recommend getting it. It will make you much more marketable. On the otherhand, in this economy some schools don't want to pay you extra for it. But they still wouldn't mind having you for the same money as someone who is unqualified. I still think MOST schools would be willing to hire you. Also, with those credentials (are you also bilingual?) you can look into international schools. |
I'm definitely getting the masters - I was planning on getting the Masters even if I don't plan on going overseas with it as I would like to get a PhD someday. (TBH my masters isn't even in Applied SLA/TEFL but in theoretical SLA, which I don't know if that hurts or helps).
And like I said I don't mind taking a pay cut when working in an entry level position. Just as long as I have enough to make payments on my loans. Thankfully, the F4 should give me enough options I think.
Unfortunately, I'm not bilingual. My primary reason for going to teach in Korea is to learn the language. |
Become a Mormon Missionary. Of every foreigner I have met their ability to pick up the language is astonishing. I know a good amount of Korean but they blow me away in terms of knowledge of the language.
They have "lots of free time" to learn. |
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dyc
Joined: 16 Dec 2010
Location: Vancouver
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| Posted: Fri Jan 07, 2011 5:17 pm Post subject: |
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Not to hijack the thread, but I'm ethnically Chinese and look the part. I'm pretty much "whitewashed" though (born and raised in Canada, never learned Chinese, etc).
However, I would like to think that my English ability is better than lots of white people I know.
Would I have a hard time landing a hakwon job? |
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