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HijackedTw1light
Joined: 24 May 2010
Location: Daegu
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 Posted: Thu Jul 21, 2011 1:02 am Post subject: Re: More stupidity on the subway |
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| jrwhite82 wrote: |
You're right. Maybe he isn't racist. I amend my previous statement. Julius only says racist things but is in fact not a racist.
"scary and "dirty"...typical Korean attitudes to animals."
"a mass mental disorder of sorts"
"Generally speaking, Koreans attitudes..." |
These quotes criticize Korean society but don't necessarily speak to intrinsic genetic properties.
To show racism, you should show these are not merely cultural criticisms.
You haven't. |
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Zyzyfer
Joined: 29 Jan 2003
Location: who, what, where, when, why, how?
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| Posted: Thu Jul 21, 2011 1:04 am Post subject: |
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I think I've read a grand total of 6 current events threads, and have learned very little from these experiences.
But I have learned one very, very important point: Don't bother arguing with Julius.
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On topic, I am devastated to report that my lady friend is scared of pigeons. And small dogs. And butterflies. It disheartens me so... |
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jrwhite82
Joined: 22 May 2010
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| Posted: Thu Jul 21, 2011 1:27 am Post subject: Re: More stupidity on the subway |
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| HijackedTw1light wrote: |
| jrwhite82 wrote: |
You're right. Maybe he isn't racist. I amend my previous statement. Julius only says racist things but is in fact not a racist.
"scary and "dirty"...typical Korean attitudes to animals."
"a mass mental disorder of sorts"
"Generally speaking, Koreans attitudes..." |
These quotes criticize Korean society but don't necessarily speak to intrinsic genetic properties.
To show racism, you should show these are not merely cultural criticisms.
You haven't. |
Ok so you made up your own definition for racism. I can't argue against that. You win. |
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HijackedTw1light
Joined: 24 May 2010
Location: Daegu
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| Posted: Thu Jul 21, 2011 1:40 am Post subject: Re: More stupidity on the subway |
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| jrwhite82 wrote: |
| HijackedTw1light wrote: |
| jrwhite82 wrote: |
You're right. Maybe he isn't racist. I amend my previous statement. Julius only says racist things but is in fact not a racist.
"scary and "dirty"...typical Korean attitudes to animals."
"a mass mental disorder of sorts"
"Generally speaking, Koreans attitudes..." |
These quotes criticize Korean society but don't necessarily speak to intrinsic genetic properties.
To show racism, you should show these are not merely cultural criticisms.
You haven't. |
Ok so you made up your own definition for racism. I can't argue against that. You win. |
If anyone is making up his own definition of racism, it's clearly you.
You presented a dictionary definition of racism, but as I pointed out, you failed to show how his comments meet that definition.
If you want to keep on believing his racist, though, fine, have fun. |
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jrwhite82
Joined: 22 May 2010
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| Posted: Thu Jul 21, 2011 1:55 am Post subject: Re: More stupidity on the subway |
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| HijackedTw1light wrote: |
| jrwhite82 wrote: |
| HijackedTw1light wrote: |
| jrwhite82 wrote: |
You're right. Maybe he isn't racist. I amend my previous statement. Julius only says racist things but is in fact not a racist.
"scary and "dirty"...typical Korean attitudes to animals."
"a mass mental disorder of sorts"
"Generally speaking, Koreans attitudes..." |
These quotes criticize Korean society but don't necessarily speak to intrinsic genetic properties.
To show racism, you should show these are not merely cultural criticisms.
You haven't. |
Ok so you made up your own definition for racism. I can't argue against that. You win. |
If anyone is making up his own definition of racism, it's clearly you.
You presented a dictionary definition of racism, but as I pointed out, you failed to show how his comments meet that definition.
If you want to keep on believing his racist, though, fine, have fun. |
So I made it up by quoting the dictionary? I'm not following your logic.
Most other people here except you and him are in agreement or at least understand that his comments came off as racist. If you can't follow along with the rest of the class, maybe you should stay behind. |
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HijackedTw1light
Joined: 24 May 2010
Location: Daegu
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| Posted: Thu Jul 21, 2011 5:55 am Post subject: Re: More stupidity on the subway |
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| jrwhite82 wrote: |
| HijackedTw1light wrote: |
| jrwhite82 wrote: |
| HijackedTw1light wrote: |
| jrwhite82 wrote: |
You're right. Maybe he isn't racist. I amend my previous statement. Julius only says racist things but is in fact not a racist.
"scary and "dirty"...typical Korean attitudes to animals."
"a mass mental disorder of sorts"
"Generally speaking, Koreans attitudes..." |
These quotes criticize Korean society but don't necessarily speak to intrinsic genetic properties.
To show racism, you should show these are not merely cultural criticisms.
You haven't. |
Ok so you made up your own definition for racism. I can't argue against that. You win. |
If anyone is making up his own definition of racism, it's clearly you.
You presented a dictionary definition of racism, but as I pointed out, you failed to show how his comments meet that definition.
If you want to keep on believing his racist, though, fine, have fun. |
So I made it up by quoting the dictionary? I'm not following your logic.
Most other people here except you and him are in agreement or at least understand that his comments came off as racist. If you can't follow along with the rest of the class, maybe you should stay behind. |
I see. You're a little slow on the uptake. I'll explain.
Yes, you quoted the dictionary, but to no apparent purpose, because your dictionary definition of racism did not match up with his comments, as I pointed out.
In other words, your own source contradicted your argument. Look, it's not like I picked your source for you. You could probably have found another definition. But your own source contradicted you!
So when the dictionary failed you, you said, "look at these quotes, they're racist," because...jrwhite says so! When I pointed out that that wasn't adequate, and his comments could be construed as cultural criticism rather than racism, you accused me of making up my own definition of racism. That was kind of a head-scratcher. A desperate gambit, I guess.
I agree his comments may have come off as insensitive and could even hint at prejudice. That's his problem. But we have to give each other room to make cultural criticisms without lashing out with accusations of racism. |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Thu Jul 21, 2011 6:08 am Post subject: Re: More stupidity on the subway |
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| HijackedTw1light wrote: |
| jrwhite82 wrote: |
| HijackedTw1light wrote: |
| jrwhite82 wrote: |
| HijackedTw1light wrote: |
| jrwhite82 wrote: |
You're right. Maybe he isn't racist. I amend my previous statement. Julius only says racist things but is in fact not a racist.
"scary and "dirty"...typical Korean attitudes to animals."
"a mass mental disorder of sorts"
"Generally speaking, Koreans attitudes..." |
These quotes criticize Korean society but don't necessarily speak to intrinsic genetic properties.
To show racism, you should show these are not merely cultural criticisms.
You haven't. |
Ok so you made up your own definition for racism. I can't argue against that. You win. |
If anyone is making up his own definition of racism, it's clearly you.
You presented a dictionary definition of racism, but as I pointed out, you failed to show how his comments meet that definition.
If you want to keep on believing his racist, though, fine, have fun. |
So I made it up by quoting the dictionary? I'm not following your logic.
Most other people here except you and him are in agreement or at least understand that his comments came off as racist. If you can't follow along with the rest of the class, maybe you should stay behind. |
I see. You're a little slow on the uptake. I'll explain.
Yes, you quoted the dictionary, but to no apparent purpose, because your dictionary definition of racism did not match up with his comments, as I pointed out.
In other words, your own source contradicted your argument. Look, it's not like I picked your source for you. You could probably have found another definition. But your own source contradicted you!
So when the dictionary failed you, you said, "look at these quotes, they're racist," because...jrwhite says so! When I pointed out that that wasn't adequate, and his comments could be construed as cultural criticism rather than racism, you accused me of making up my own definition of racism. That was kind of a head-scratcher. A desperate gambit, I guess.
I agree his comments may have come off as insensitive and could even hint at prejudice. That's his problem. But we have to give each other room to make cultural criticisms without lashing out with accusations of racism. |
Again, who cares if Julius is a racist or not. He could be a racist and say something true. He could be colorblind and say a lie. He's racist or not, but one thing is for sure- He fails at logic.
Let's stick to his woeful fail in logic that the woman on the subway, the person who was ridiculed by every Korean on that subway, is somehow an example of a "typical Korean".
I mean that's saying 1/100 is the norm while 99/100 is the oddity.
I believe this called a "failure in critical thinking".
I've posted twice asking him for an explanation of that one. We don't get a straight answer, instead it's stories about kids at school or some ajosshi with a sack of puppies. |
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Julius
Joined: 27 Jul 2006
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| Posted: Thu Jul 21, 2011 6:12 am Post subject: Re: More stupidity on the subway |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
Julius, please, how can you say that that lady was an example of "typical" Korean behavior, when the typical Korean said she was an idiot?
Can you please answer this point??? |
I believe I already have. on page 1:
| Julius wrote: |
| Kuros wrote: |
| You have a group of Koreans in the subway who understood the function of the dog, and one who didn't. You focus on the odd one out? |
OK, point taken. But, as Northway said:
| Northway wrote: |
| I've found there to be a really disproportionate number of Koreans who are absolutely terrified of dogs in particular, and wildlife in general. |
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You will notice I admitted it was wrong to criticise an entire nation based on one incident.
That is not what I'm doing however.
My criticism is based on numerous, commonplace incidences that I have noticed, involving many people, in all parts of the country, over the years. |
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jrwhite82
Joined: 22 May 2010
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| Posted: Thu Jul 21, 2011 6:30 am Post subject: Re: More stupidity on the subway |
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| HijackedTw1light wrote: |
| jrwhite82 wrote: |
| HijackedTw1light wrote: |
| jrwhite82 wrote: |
| HijackedTw1light wrote: |
| jrwhite82 wrote: |
You're right. Maybe he isn't racist. I amend my previous statement. Julius only says racist things but is in fact not a racist.
"scary and "dirty"...typical Korean attitudes to animals."
"a mass mental disorder of sorts"
"Generally speaking, Koreans attitudes..." |
These quotes criticize Korean society but don't necessarily speak to intrinsic genetic properties.
To show racism, you should show these are not merely cultural criticisms.
You haven't. |
Ok so you made up your own definition for racism. I can't argue against that. You win. |
If anyone is making up his own definition of racism, it's clearly you.
You presented a dictionary definition of racism, but as I pointed out, you failed to show how his comments meet that definition.
If you want to keep on believing his racist, though, fine, have fun. |
So I made it up by quoting the dictionary? I'm not following your logic.
Most other people here except you and him are in agreement or at least understand that his comments came off as racist. If you can't follow along with the rest of the class, maybe you should stay behind. |
I see. You're a little slow on the uptake. I'll explain.
Yes, you quoted the dictionary, but to no apparent purpose, because your dictionary definition of racism did not match up with his comments, as I pointed out.
In other words, your own source contradicted your argument. Look, it's not like I picked your source for you. You could probably have found another definition. But your own source contradicted you!
So when the dictionary failed you, you said, "look at these quotes, they're racist," because...jrwhite says so! When I pointed out that that wasn't adequate, and his comments could be construed as cultural criticism rather than racism, you accused me of making up my own definition of racism. That was kind of a head-scratcher. A desperate gambit, I guess.
I agree his comments may have come off as insensitive and could even hint at prejudice. That's his problem. But we have to give each other room to make cultural criticisms without lashing out with accusations of racism. |
You are the one who has limited the term racism to be applied to DNA and genetic properties. Where does that come from? You made it up? Or please tell me where you found that definition.
If you can't see how his statements match up with the definition of racism, it is you who is slow on the uptake. Or perhaps dead on the uptake because it painfully obvious.
I can give room for people to make criticisms. If they do it in a way that isn't blanketing and diagnosing an entire race of people with a mental disorder. Or accusing an entire country of something based on the actions of one person.
Ok here goes. One more time. Try to keep up.
Racism -
Noun:The belief that all members of each race possess characteristics or abilities specific to that race, esp. so as to distinguish it as inferior or superior to another race or races
Julius believes that Koreans suffer from a massive mental disorder. He stated that Koreans (not the government, or a few people) but that Koreans in general, as in, a stereotype of Koreans, (look up stereotype too, no DNA in the definition of that either) share a characteristic specific to their race and it makes them inferior to Western cultures. He said it. Check the list of quotes I compiled.
I can't say it any plainer. I tried to line it up for you. So you think its a cultural criticism because it lacks a comment about genomes, I think its racism. Learn the definition of a word before you argue it. Nothing to do with DNA, genetics, RNA, ribosomes, nucleic acid, amino acids. Got it? |
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jrwhite82
Joined: 22 May 2010
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| Posted: Thu Jul 21, 2011 6:54 am Post subject: Re: More stupidity on the subway |
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| Julius wrote: |
| Steelrails wrote: |
Julius, please, how can you say that that lady was an example of "typical" Korean behavior, when the typical Korean said she was an idiot?
Can you please answer this point??? |
I believe I already have. on page 1:
| Julius wrote: |
| Kuros wrote: |
| You have a group of Koreans in the subway who understood the function of the dog, and one who didn't. You focus on the odd one out? |
OK, point taken. But, as Northway said:
| Northway wrote: |
| I've found there to be a really disproportionate number of Koreans who are absolutely terrified of dogs in particular, and wildlife in general. |
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You will notice I admitted it was wrong to criticise an entire nation based on one incident.
That is not what I'm doing however.
My criticism is based on numerous, commonplace incidences that I have noticed, involving many people, in all parts of the country, over the years. |
Not for nothing, but I've been here a few years and I've never seen guys walking around carrying sacks full of puppies and dragging them all over the ground. Are you sure what you witnessed was not another exception? You must frequent some bizarre places man. |
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Julius
Joined: 27 Jul 2006
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| Posted: Thu Jul 21, 2011 7:12 am Post subject: Re: More stupidity on the subway |
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| jrwhite82 wrote: |
| Julius believes that Koreans suffer from a massive mental disorder. |
Irrational fears and phobias come under the definition of disorders of the mind. Look it up in the dictionary if you don't believe me.
e.g. if you are afraid of pigeons then that is an irrational fear.. because pigeons cannot harm you.
I have met so many, many Koreans that are either afraid of, averse to, disgusted by, nervous around, over-reactionary to, disrespectful of, or antagonistic towards other species, that I feel justified in guessing that the vast majority of Koreans are this way.
Animals ranging from moths, butterflies, frogs, paying mantises, grasshoppers, to dogs, cats, pigeons, birds, and in fact all other living creatures. If you want quick evidence of this just take a walk around the zoo or maybe the coex aquarium and watch the reactions of people around you.
Is it wrong? of course its wrong. No humans should be that estranged from, or view themselves as so separate from, their natural environment and other living things. Lack of familiarity breeds lack of understanding, which breeds fear, ..which breeds abuse and cruelty. You can see all those four elemental stages in the face of the average ajosshi approaching a chained-up dog. |
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HijackedTw1light
Joined: 24 May 2010
Location: Daegu
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| Posted: Thu Jul 21, 2011 7:12 am Post subject: Re: More stupidity on the subway |
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| jrwhite82 wrote: |
| You are the one who has limited the term racism to be applied to DNA and genetic properties. Where does that come from? You made it up? Or please tell me where you found that definition. |
We are using the definition you yourself provided:
Racism -
Noun:The belief that all members of each race possess characteristics or abilities specific to that race, esp. so as to distinguish it as inferior or superior to another race or races
If all members of a race possess a characteristic, it stands to reason it's based on genetics and not culture. In other words, all gyopos would have that trait--every person of Korean extraction would have it whether they lived in Seoul, New York, Paris or Cairo.
Got it? |
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Julius
Joined: 27 Jul 2006
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| Posted: Thu Jul 21, 2011 8:14 am Post subject: Re: More stupidity on the subway |
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| jrwhite82 wrote: |
| You must frequent some bizarre places man. |
Jrwhite has indirectly called Korea "bizarre".
He has slandered the homeland of an entire ethno-genetic group. I suggest we alert the wider community to his raschism. |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Thu Jul 21, 2011 11:57 am Post subject: Re: More stupidity on the subway |
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| Julius wrote: |
| Steelrails wrote: |
Julius, please, how can you say that that lady was an example of "typical" Korean behavior, when the typical Korean said she was an idiot?
Can you please answer this point??? |
I believe I already have. on page 1:
| Julius wrote: |
| Kuros wrote: |
| You have a group of Koreans in the subway who understood the function of the dog, and one who didn't. You focus on the odd one out? |
OK, point taken. But, as Northway said:
| Northway wrote: |
| I've found there to be a really disproportionate number of Koreans who are absolutely terrified of dogs in particular, and wildlife in general. |
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You will notice I admitted it was wrong to criticise an entire nation based on one incident.
That is not what I'm doing however.
My criticism is based on numerous, commonplace incidences that I have noticed, involving many people, in all parts of the country, over the years. |
I'm sorry but, "Okay, point taken but" is not addressing it. That's a non-apology apology for a blatant fail of logic.
You utterly, utterly failed at critical thinking and analyzing the situation.
You took a 1/100 person and made them "the norm" while calling the 99/100 the exception. I don't know, maybe that is because of your "bad culture" and irrationality.
I mean, isn't that what those "delusional" Koreans do? Aren't you guilty of exactly the same thing as them?
Now, as for you other "incidents" your past performance, being of such an epic fail of critical thinking, does make one question whether your other "claims" are indeed accurate.
| Quote: |
| Animals ranging from moths, butterflies, frogs, paying mantises, grasshoppers, to dogs, cats, pigeons, birds, and in fact all other living creatures. If you want quick evidence of this just take a walk around the zoo or maybe the coex aquarium and watch the reactions of people around you. |
Gee, I didn't get the hoards of fleeing and screaming people....I must have lucked out and gotten the day where the people looked at the tanks and read the placards...
Oh and never seen an NET freak out about spiders, snakes, rats, cockroaches, various insects, squid, octopus, snails, whatever animal the kids dig up from the garden on a rainy day, nope never seen that at all... 
Did it ever occur to you sir, Julius, that YOU might be the one that is delusional? |
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visitorq
Joined: 11 Jan 2008
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| Posted: Thu Jul 21, 2011 12:25 pm Post subject: Re: More stupidity on the subway |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
| You utterly, utterly failed at critical thinking and analyzing the situation. |
We could probably delete the last several pages of fruitless exchanges between Julius and other posters, and just insert the above to sum it all up, much, much more concisely... |
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