Korean Job Discussion Forums

[escarole]

I was recently burned by a small hagwon.

I was fired in my 11th month with only verbal notice about 40 days before, saying that I'd "have to quit" on August 31st.

I know that the Korean Labor Standards Act says I should be given 30 days written notice. However, thanks to my recent experience, I'm now under the impression that hagwons don't have to abide by the KLSA if they are employing less than 5 regular (full-time) employees.

I had read on Dave's that I should absolutely not abandon my job if I was fired without a written letter of dismissal, because of the hagwon tactic of verbally firing and then claiming the employee simply abandoned their job.

So, being under this impression, I guess I made a real ass of myself when I refused to leave the hagwon after the director verbally fired me that afternoon when I showed up to work. He called the police to the hagwon, and although I showed the police article 27 of the KLSA, in Korean, that didn't stop them from asking me to come with them, which I did.

I was told at the meeting with the Ministry of Labor that because the hagwon has fewer than 5 full-time employees that there was nothing unfair about my dismissal, considering I was given 40 days verbal notice. I did manage to get the pay I was owed for the time I had worked up until I was fired, but as one can imagine I'm far from happy about the way things have worked out.

So, I have three questions, to anyone who'd be kind of enough to offer their thoughts:

1) Is the Ministry of Labor doing their job in this case?

It's occurred to me that the grumpy old man who is working my case just doesn't feel like dealing with it.

Another idea: I know that the director of this hagwon is the head of the English hagwon association for this city, and perhaps my fear is unfounded but some kind of nepotistic double dealing seems congruent with this director's character.

2) If the MOL isn't doing its job, for whatever reason, who do I go to?

Should I call 1350? Should I go to the provincial office of MOL?

And, my most important question, for future reference:

3) If it's indeed true that small hagwons don't have to abide by the Korean Labor Standards Act, then what piece of law, if any, does govern their treatment of their employees?

[koreatimes]

If you are admitting he gave 40 days notice, then I don't see much of an issue here. Demanding something written would better be paired up with, "I never got ANY notice officer!!!"

As for the 5 employee rule, I never heard about exceptions unless it related to pension, but that doesn't mean others don't exist.

It seems like you initially had an 11th month firing case, but you are spending too much time going over proper notice. Are they somehow telling you that if it is more than 30 days notice then that doesn't constitute 11th month firing?

What was their response if you went to them with the 11th month firing argument? If you didn't yet, this might be your last opportunity. Don't emphasize notice being written or verbal. I don't think it matters in this case. What matters is that it seems like they fired you at the 11th month to avoid paying you severance and airfare home. The extra 10 days is just a cover up to make it look legit.

[thegadfly]

...so you had a 9th month, 3rd week firing, for which you were given notice in excess of Korean labor law requirements, which you admitted when you went to the labor board, and you are wondering if THEY are doing their jobs correctly?

A firing occurs when you are TOLD you are fired, not when you leave -- you were fired in month 9 or 10, which is NOT an 11th month firing, and therefore, not quite as suspect. I'm not saying you weren't dismissed for less-than sound reasons -- simply that your dismissal seems to be legal...except for the whole "in writing" thing.

As was stated, since you admitted to having received proper notification, I don't think you have much to complain about, legally or otherwise. You WERE given enough notice and you WERE paid all you were owed...the fact that it wasn't on a piece of paper could have been used for you to prove your case, but as you admitted that you received the notice, and understood it, it makes the point moot. Had you lied and said you had not received any notice, then you may have had a legal leg to stand on, though morally suspect.

The thing about 5 full-time employees -- remember, this includes bus drivers, cleaners, secretaries, and anyone else associated with the school as employees -- NOT just other teachers...so it would have to be pretty small to fit into this designation....

[Wildbore]

[thegadfly]

[escarole]

To clarify the timeframe, I started on October 11th 2010, so July 20th would be the 2nd week of the 10th month, I think.

I might indeed not have any legal leg to stand on thanks to saying that I received verbal notice.

When I was told on July 20th that I would have to quit, the reason the director gave is that he had arranged for another native teacher to replace me, based on my own prior request to finish my contract early.

I know it takes time to find native teachers and bring them over and I realize it's possible the director might be able to justify firing me on this basis alone.

Obviously, I made a big mistake in giving this director any inkling that I was wanting to stop working at the school. I thought I was being courteous, but it just got me on his vindictive side. Lesson learned.

About 20 days after I was told I would be replaced, I received word that the prospective new hire had decided he didn't want to take the position.

After that, the director's story changed and he said he was now firing me because the school's enrollment had fallen and he couldn't afford to pay me. He said he no longer had plans to hire a new native teacher.

Might not make a difference to MOL, but that is how it happened.

[Deranged Ranger]

[escarole]

October 11-November 10: month 1
November 11-December 10: month 2
December 11-January 10: month 3
January 11-February 10: month 4
February 11-March 10: month 5
March 11-April 10: month 6
April 11-May 10: month 7
May 11-June 10: month 8
June 11-July 10: month 9
July 11-August 10: month 10
August 11-September 10: month 11
September 11-October 10: month 12

Thanks for the tip, but it looks like I was counting fine without having to use my fingers

[koreatimes]