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World Traveler
Joined: 29 May 2009
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 Posted: Mon Dec 19, 2011 1:42 am Post subject: Why my family and I must leave Korea |
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http://groovekorea.com/article/why-my-family-and-i-must-leave-korea
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| At this point, my 7-year-old, daughter speaks to me in Korean and I respond in English. But her Korean is way beyond mine as my ability has atrophied with lack of use and we now have communication problems which are affecting our relationship. The same process has now started with my 3-year-old son. |
This part of the article struck me as interesting, as I was wondering why a man who had been living in Korea for fourteen years would have a Korean ability so much lower than that of his children.
I then thought about age as it relates to language learning.
Harvard professor Steven Pinker wrote that
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| language acquisition is guaranteed for children up to the age of six, is steadily compromised from then until shortly after puberty, and is rare thereafter. |
I spoke to an owner of a language school in China. He told me that it is possible for an adult to learn a language, but that the cost is much higher.
Also noteworthy is that those who were raised bilingual are able to pick up a third language much faster than those who grew up monolingual. Unfortunately, many of us in the West are raised monolingual, which hurts our ability to learn other languages down the road.
Another surprising part of the article was the way it ended:
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| One final reason for leaving is the biased reporting in the newspaper against ESL/EFL teachers. The newspapers here for the past several years have taken every opportunity (and I swear have created some) to vilify all foreign English teachers for the actions of a minority. It�s been going on for a long time and there appears to be no end in sight and I�m just not interested in being part of a target group for which I do not fit the profile other than for my job. |
Are the Korean newspapers really that negative towards Western English teachers? Does this seem like a good reason to leave? |
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Captain Corea
Joined: 28 Feb 2005
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Mon Dec 19, 2011 2:37 am Post subject: |
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I think that ppl have their reasons for either leaving or staying (or in some cases, returning).
The author has stated his, and I'm not about to argue with them. I can question, and wonder, but at the end of the day, he (and his family) made the decision and made the move.
This topic has been done a number of times before on this forum and unfortunately often devolves into a "Korea sucks and back home is better" or "The west is a pile of XYZ, and Korea is paradise compared to that!".
As a parent, I'm not always sure of the best path for my family. I don't know 100% which way is the absolute BEST way... but I (and my wife) eventually have to make a call. That's what parents do.
The guy in the article (who I know, BTW), seems happy with his choice. Good for him - I hope he and his family succeed in whichever direction they head. |
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eamo
Joined: 08 Mar 2003
Location: Shepherd's Bush, 1964.
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| Posted: Mon Dec 19, 2011 2:46 am Post subject: |
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If this guy's kids can't communicate with him in English then he didn't put in enough effort to ensure that his kids' English stayed on a par with their Korean. Lots of international couples are raising bilingual kids in Korea with little or no problems....
....but you have to work at it. I'm lucky enough to have a job which allows me to get home early enough every day to give my daughter lots of hours of English environment every weekday and weekends.........It's a lot harder for the typical F2 teacher who's working evenings to bring in the bacon. |
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stevieg4ever
Joined: 11 Feb 2006
Location: London, England
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| Posted: Mon Dec 19, 2011 2:51 am Post subject: |
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Surely his daughter and wife speak English ?? but he seems to be saying that the kids are unable to communicate through English without really stating such.
Towards the end he seems to be making excuses; the 'no bbqs and playing outdoors' thing made me chuckle. |
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Captain Corea
Joined: 28 Feb 2005
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Mon Dec 19, 2011 2:53 am Post subject: |
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| eamo wrote: |
| If this guy's kids can't communicate with him in English then he didn't put in enough effort to ensure that his kids' English stayed on a par with their Korean. Lots of international couples are raising bilingual kids in Korea with little or no problems.... |
Yeah, my daughter is 4 1/2 and having no issues in regards to language so far. She attends a Korean Kindergarten, but her English never ceases to amaze me.
I went to an event at her kindergarten last month and got to meet her English teachers (one Native, one Korean). They only teach her for a few minutes a day (no surprise), but they actually thought she grew up overseas. One of them was joking about her saying "Holy Guacamole!".
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| ....but you have to work at it. I'm lucky enough to have a job which allows me to get home early enough every day to give my daughter lots of hours of English environment every weekday and weekends.........It's a lot harder for the typical F2 teacher who's working evenings to bring in the bacon. |
I think this goes to the heart of it. You either have to "work" hard at it, or set yourself up in a situation/circumstance that promotes it. If you've got the type of job that does, I can see it going a long way to helping.
I know that I'm a pretty talkative guy... so that influences things too. If you're on the quiet side, and you're the "only English influence", then I can see where trouble might grow.
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| stevieg4ever wrote: |
Towards the end he seems to be making excuses; the 'no bbqs and playing outdoors' thing made me chuckle. |
I kind of read that as him listing off some things he found important. 
Last edited by Captain Corea on Mon Dec 19, 2011 3:11 am; edited 1 time in total |
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jvalmer
Joined: 06 Jun 2003
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| Posted: Mon Dec 19, 2011 3:02 am Post subject: Re: Why my family and I must leave Korea |
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| World Traveler wrote: |
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| At this point, my 7-year-old, daughter speaks to me in Korean and I respond in English. But her Korean is way beyond mine as my ability has atrophied with lack of use and we now have communication problems which are affecting our relationship. The same process has now started with my 3-year-old son. |
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Should this even be an issue? Countless numbers of immigrants and their offspring have had this problem. But I guess they really never had the choice to go back to their home countries. |
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Julius
Joined: 27 Jul 2006
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| Posted: Mon Dec 19, 2011 5:13 am Post subject: Re: Why my family and I must leave Korea |
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| One final reason for leaving is the biased reporting in the newspaper against ESL/EFL teachers. The newspapers here for the past several years have taken every opportunity (and I swear have created some) to vilify all foreign English teachers for the actions of a minority. It�s been going on for a long time and there appears to be no end in sight and I�m just not interested in being part of a target group for which I do not fit the profile other than for my job. |
Blaming foreigners is the only way Koreans have left to bond together. |
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Swampfox10mm
Joined: 24 Mar 2011
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| Posted: Mon Dec 19, 2011 5:24 am Post subject: |
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| Captain Corea wrote: |
I think that ppl have their reasons for either leaving or staying (or in some cases, returning).
The author has stated his, and I'm not about to argue with them. I can question, and wonder, but at the end of the day, he (and his family) made the decision and made the move.
This topic has been done a number of times before on this forum and unfortunately often devolves into a "Korea sucks and back home is better" or "The west is a pile of XYZ, and Korea is paradise compared to that!".
As a parent, I'm not always sure of the best path for my family. I don't know 100% which way is the absolute BEST way... but I (and my wife) eventually have to make a call. That's what parents do.
The guy in the article (who I know, BTW), seems happy with his choice. Good for him - I hope he and his family succeed in whichever direction they head. |
Now THIS is what you call an excellent post. |
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PatrickGHBusan
Joined: 24 Jun 2008
Location: Busan (1997-2008) Canada 2008 -
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| Posted: Mon Dec 19, 2011 6:56 am Post subject: |
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The guy made a choice for his family. He cannot be faulted for it and the important point is that he and his family are happy.
Each place (Korea, Canada, UK and so on) will offer its own set of benefits and drawbacks. It is up to each person or each family to decide which set suits them best!
We started our family in Korea and now live in Canada. I can honestly say that each place has offered us substantial benefits (family-wise) and some annoyances and drawbacks (again from a family perspective).
The language issue that was raised is interesting because there you have a choice to make and have some sort of control for a time. You can create an environment where your mixed kids learn English as well as Korean while living in K-land. Thats is up to the parents. This is best done at an early age. Later on (teens for example) it will be a different ball game as you cannot really force a teenage to keep up with language practice if he or she does not want to but thats down the road for us anyway.
What you can do is create an interest for that language in your children and foster that interest by showing them the value of speaking that language. In our case, being able to communicate with grandparents, cousins, uncles and aunts has worked wonders as a motivation for our son to keep up the Korean while living in Canada. |
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isitts
Joined: 25 Dec 2008
Location: Korea
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| Posted: Mon Dec 19, 2011 5:47 pm Post subject: |
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| Swampfox10mm wrote: |
| Captain Corea wrote: |
I think that ppl have their reasons for either leaving or staying (or in some cases, returning).
The author has stated his, and I'm not about to argue with them. I can question, and wonder, but at the end of the day, he (and his family) made the decision and made the move.
This topic has been done a number of times before on this forum and unfortunately often devolves into a "Korea sucks and back home is better" or "The west is a pile of XYZ, and Korea is paradise compared to that!".
As a parent, I'm not always sure of the best path for my family. I don't know 100% which way is the absolute BEST way... but I (and my wife) eventually have to make a call. That's what parents do.
The guy in the article (who I know, BTW), seems happy with his choice. Good for him - I hope he and his family succeed in whichever direction they head. |
Now THIS is what you call an excellent post. |
+1
World Traveller will not give up on giving foreigners reasons they should leave Korea (so the job market will open up for him)...from suggesting that it's an environmental wasteland with horrible working conditions, to now pointing out that your children won't be able to speak English and it will tear your family apart.
While the ideas in this article are interesting, I think people have managed in whatever ways they see fit. |
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I-am-me
Joined: 21 Feb 2006
Location: Hermit Kingdom
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| Posted: Tue Dec 20, 2011 11:29 pm Post subject: |
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| There are so many english kids shows on tv, no excuse why the daughter doesnt know english. Why is it when koreans are involved, english is never learned? I know parents who speak other languages, and the kids have no problems learning 2 or 3. When it comes to korean mixed families, and I do know many, the kids only learn one language...Korean! |
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Yaya
Joined: 25 Feb 2003
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Tue Dec 20, 2011 11:34 pm Post subject: |
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| Many people leave only to return. I wonder what this guy will do. |
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Adventurer
Joined: 28 Jan 2006
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| Posted: Tue Dec 20, 2011 11:46 pm Post subject: |
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| I-am-me wrote: |
| There are so many english kids shows on tv, no excuse why the daughter doesnt know english. Why is it when koreans are involved, english is never learned? I know parents who speak other languages, and the kids have no problems learning 2 or 3. When it comes to korean mixed families, and I do know many, the kids only learn one language...Korean! |
Can't you often say that in North America, many people don't know their language of heritage well. Usually, it's the kids who spent the first several years of their lives in say Poland who can speak decent Polish, but if you get an American born Polish-American, chances are the child wouldn't speak so much Polish. A friend of mine is married to a Croatian American. The older sister speaks pretty good Serbo-Croation, but not the younger sister. It's a serious challenge for most families to have a child strong in both languages, and some parents who fail a it blame the geographic location like this parent.
Did he, as a teacher, have a plan for his kids to become bilingual? Did he take Korean classes to learn adequate Korean in the 14 years he's been here? I've taken two classes, and it's made a big different. I don't know if I'll have the time to finish the 4th or 5th class, but I am certain if I finished the 5th, I would know enough to understand a Korean child. The problem is not Korea, it's the parent. |
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Captain Corea
Joined: 28 Feb 2005
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Tue Dec 20, 2011 11:54 pm Post subject: |
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I'm not here to defend the guy or anything, but just to clear something up... His Korean was reasonable. He was not one of those guys that could barely function here.
When I read the article, I take away from it that he saw the direction his children's language ability was heading, and made a choice to change it.
Could he have done that here in Korea? Sure, I suppose so. Others have, I'm sure. But it was one Man's observation about what he was seeing in his family.
We can try to judge all we want, but...what's the point? Perhaps instead of judging, we might try sharing how we've handled similar things.
How did you handle multiple languages in your home? What do you think worked better for you vs what didn't? Did you notice swings in your child's preference at different ages?
Maybe that might be a better way to head than to play Monday morning quarterback on a guy's life decisions. |
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Captain Corea
Joined: 28 Feb 2005
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Tue Dec 20, 2011 11:59 pm Post subject: |
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| I-am-me wrote: |
| There are so many english kids shows on tv, no excuse why the daughter doesnt know english. Why is it when koreans are involved, english is never learned? I know parents who speak other languages, and the kids have no problems learning 2 or 3. When it comes to korean mixed families, and I do know many, the kids only learn one language...Korean! |
For the record, my 4 1/2 year old is fluent in both...with no major preference so far.
Out of all the "mixed" families I know here, I've found that the language learning is quite varied. Sometimes it seems dependent on the parents, but also, I've noticed many times that it's simply the direction the child chooses.
Those little buggers have a nasty habit of having a will/personality of their own sometimes. lol |
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