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jaj
Joined: 01 Oct 2011
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 Posted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 5:26 am Post subject: |
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Regarding most people not knowing what Konglish is:
Yes, true and that would include Koreans.
Konglish is much more than the laundry list of phrases so far presented in this thread.
It's a distortion of original English meanings.
It's the consequence of inaccuracy in applying English grammar. It's a misuse of continuous verb tenses. It's mispronounced or entirely missing English letters and sounds. It's Koreans playing 'American' based on "Gossip Girl" and "Sex in the City."
It's a language of consumption where "Ugg boot" becomes "boots." The word "fancy" loses its irony; Markety terms like "satisfaction" and "purchase" seep into casual speech, where any old trench coat is a "Burberry."
Despite how you may feel about this, somebody does own English. That would be the native speakers who create its proficiency standards -- and if anybody wants to question why native speakers should own this process, please look at the English textbooks written by Koreans "fluent" in English that my students are reading -- what a mess!
Anyway, sensitizing students to the difference between Konglish and English is good. Contrary to those who wax poetic about Konglish, its usage is not intentional and until the Korean education system decides otherwise, at least in classrooms, is a sign of English illiteracy. |
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Captain Corea
Joined: 28 Feb 2005
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 5:42 am Post subject: |
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| I'm in the "wide" Konglish camp. Heck, a good portion of it isn't even from English. |
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Carbon
Joined: 28 Jan 2011
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| Posted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 1:23 pm Post subject: |
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| jaj wrote: |
Regarding most people not knowing what Konglish is:
Yes, true and that would include Koreans.
Konglish is much more than the laundry list of phrases so far presented in this thread.
It's a distortion of original English meanings.
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Everything past this point in your post is just a mindless rant. Take a rest. |
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Carbon
Joined: 28 Jan 2011
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| Posted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 1:48 pm Post subject: |
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| Captain Corea wrote: |
| I'm in the "wide" Konglish camp. Heck, a good portion of it isn't even from English. |
Which wouldn't make it Konglish, which only serves to make my original point: people don't know what the term means.
It has become a catch-all for every problem Koreans exhibit in English, used by those who don't know the correct terms associated with said problems (jaj highlights this very well).
| jaj wrote: |
| ...Markety terms like "satisfaction"... |
Ironically (leaving aside the hypocrisy), "Markety" is not an English word. |
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Panda
Joined: 25 Oct 2008
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| Posted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 9:27 pm Post subject: |
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| Carbon wrote: |
When an English word is brought into a different language and then a new meaning is attached to that word, it becomes a version of English. These versions are, in common parlance, called "Konglish" or "Chinglish".
"one piece", "padding jacket"...these are Konglish because they don't mean the same in Korean as they do in English, even though the words' origin is English.
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All the proverbs (except long time no see) I listed are exactly the English that brought into China that got the new meaning, and importantly, it is accepted and practised by more and more people. |
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Captain Corea
Joined: 28 Feb 2005
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 10:07 pm Post subject: |
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| Carbon wrote: |
| Captain Corea wrote: |
| I'm in the "wide" Konglish camp. Heck, a good portion of it isn't even from English. |
Which wouldn't make it Konglish, which only serves to make my original point: people don't know what the term means.
It has become a catch-all for every problem Koreans exhibit in English, used by those who don't know the correct terms associated with said problems (jaj highlights this very well).
| jaj wrote: |
| ...Markety terms like "satisfaction"... |
Ironically (leaving aside the hypocrisy), "Markety" is not an English word. |
I disagree. The term "arbeit" has long been used here and categorized as Konglish, yet it comes from German.
Many of the Konglish words we see here were actually brought here from the Japanese.
And like I said, I have no problem using the broader definition of Konglish.
You may not agree, and that's your call, but I ...well, really don't give a toss what you think. It's not like you can enforce your will on everyone on the peninsula and MAKE them use Konglish they way you think it should be used. |
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The Floating World
Joined: 01 Oct 2011
Location: Here
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| Posted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 10:10 pm Post subject: |
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Geebus, craptain shows himself up once again...
If the term arbeit is from German - it ain't Konglish (Korean and English) it is Korman.
Likewise Japanese loan words, they are Koreanese. |
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Carbon
Joined: 28 Jan 2011
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| Posted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 10:24 pm Post subject: |
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| Captain Corea wrote: |
I disagree. The term "arbeit" has long been used here and categorized as Konglish, yet it comes from German.
Many of the Konglish words we see here were actually brought here from the Japanese.
And like I said, I have no problem using the broader definition of Konglish.
You may not agree, and that's your call, but I ...well, really don't give a toss what you think. It's not like you can enforce your will on everyone on the peninsula and MAKE them use Konglish they way you think it should be used. |
Focus cappy.
Take some relax. |
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tiger fancini
Joined: 21 Mar 2006
Location: Testicles for Eyes
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| Posted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 12:08 am Post subject: |
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"Nowadays, as time goes by, I came to be solo.
How I miss the skinship."
Whether it's Konglish or not, it makes me smile.
And there is something intrinsically funny about the statement, "I took my wife to the Jew last Saturday." |
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jaj
Joined: 01 Oct 2011
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| Posted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 4:05 am Post subject: |
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Wow, don't even know where to start with the self-professed Konglish scholar here...
Assuming we're chatting and all just engaging in a written form of speech, yes, "markety" is real English.
As we all seem to agree, language, especially spoken language is fluid.
But a native speaker consciously departing from grammar during a conversation shouldn't be compared to a Korean speaker who says, "I'm going to shit down," or "tomorrow we have an erection."
Of course, I never intended to attack Korean English and incite anyone to defend it from me. |
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Captain Corea
Joined: 28 Feb 2005
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 4:16 am Post subject: |
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| The Floating Turd wrote: |
Geebus, craptain shows himself up once again...
If the term arbeit is from German - it ain't Konglish (Korean and English) it is Korman.
Likewise Japanese loan words, they are Koreanese. |
So... let me ask you... go around and ask 10 Koreans near you if they've ever heard of Koreanese or Korman. The result?
Face it, these terms often get lumped together. If you insist on being a purist, go for it.
http://koreanselfstudyisntlame.blogspot.com/2010/02/ultimate-konglish-list.html
Personally, I'm fine with the broader definition and use of the term Konglish. But you and Carbon can use whatever the heck ya like. |
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jaj
Joined: 01 Oct 2011
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Carbon
Joined: 28 Jan 2011
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| Posted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 5:38 am Post subject: |
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I will use the correct understanding, thanks. It keeps me from looking stupid in conversations.
Instead of digging around for answers in bloggerland or Yahoo Answers, what about a bit more serious pursuit of understanding? Here is a paper that does a reasonable job of articulating what Konglish is:
http://www2.kumagaku.ac.jp/teacher/~judy/gyoseki/36konglish.doc
You're welcome. |
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Carbon
Joined: 28 Jan 2011
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| Posted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 5:42 am Post subject: |
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"Jibberish" is gibberish.
You are pretty critical for a native English speaker who can't even spell in English. BTW, "markety" is not a word; being inarticulate does not make an incorrect usage acceptable. If it did, it would only serve to further undermine your very point. You hide behind your use of "markety" the same way you accuse Koreans of hiding behind their 'incorrectness'. They however, have the luxury of being EFL learners while you have no defense at all.
"Marketing terms, like..." "Words used in(for) marketing, such as..."
You pass all of this off as "conversation", yet we are writing, not talking. If we want to get pedantic, using the term "conversation" or "discussion" for internet forums is a misnomer, but I digress. Now you are furiously searching the word "conversation" in Google to show me how it can also be used to represent this scenario.... |
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jaj
Joined: 01 Oct 2011
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| Posted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 6:28 am Post subject: |
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Hey Carbon, calling names isn't necessary. You're being scarily hostile but I read your paper anyway.
There's a reference to Japanese being diluted and polluted by English that points to the natural fears historical speakers of a language have about the future of their tongue -- yes, I believe the Japanese own Japanese even if "dilution" and "pollution" sound like something from Mein Kampf and don't capture the spirit with which I agree.
The funny thing is, the name of this thread is "Embracing Konglish." It could easily be the name of the paper you attached.
Anyway, I'm done here, fine people. Hope everyone enjoys their weekend. |
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