| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
Allthechildrenareinsane
Joined: 23 Jun 2011
Location: Lost in a Roman wilderness of pain
|
 Posted: Fri Mar 02, 2012 11:23 am Post subject: |
 |
|
| Dodge7 wrote: |
| Allthechildrenareinsane wrote: |
| Dodge7 wrote: |
Where were all of you white, self-hating liberals when the Wayan bros. made a WHOLE MOVIE about the negative stereotypes of white woman in "White Chicks?" And the countless comedians that get nasty with their overt racism towards white people. Blacks literally make a living on disrespecting white and every other racial group. I think black face is totally fine.
What's good for the goose... |
Wow. You're trolling, obviously, but let me just point out for the sake of it that race (as distinct from, say, ethnicity or socio-cultural or national identity) is entirely about the distribution of various kinds of power in a society.
If one is, say, a white American, then one is a member of a group that is considered socially normative and is more politically and economically empowered than other racial groups.
That's the whole point of "whiteness" -- to consolidate and preserve social, economic and political power in the hands of those considered "white," and to disempower and exclude those considered non-white. There is no biologically sound basis for race. Race is all about power, pure and simple -- who has it and who doesn't.
My racial identity as a white person is something that's distinct from whatever particular cultural, national or regional identities I may consciously hold dear, so I don't feel offended in the least when someone makes fun of "white people." As a white person and therefore a beneficiary of white privilege, I have no problem with the Wayans Brothers or anyone else satirizing, parodying or critiquing "whiteness," since what they're doing is essentially speaking truth to power. |
Wow you've been thoroughly indoctrinated by the liberal, white guilt agenda. Not me.
So what you're saying is that if you are the majority then no one can be racist to you? So I can go out in "Korean face" and yell "ching chong chu!" because I am the minority here? Are you starting to see my point? You're off your rocker!
There will always be a racial divide if one party gets to make be racist against another race. It just doesn't go like that. Not everyone in the white camp is happy with your "rules." Sorry. If we are truly ever going to be equal then EVERYONE has to play by the same rules.
You're insane. |
Judging by your last sentence, I can tell you're the type who's deeply interested in constructive, open-minded debate and the free exchange of ideas and not given whatsoever to off-hand ad hominem attacks.
Maybe I am insane for arguing about race, of all things, on the internet, of all places, but I will say this: a proper, empirically informed understanding of the workings and nature of race is not a matter of "liberal" or "conservative" ideologies. Rather, it is simply a matter of facing certain unpleasant facts about how societies work. I suggest you put down your copy of The Bell Curve and brush up instead on some legitimate, empirically sound social science.
I'm done now.  |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
Smithington
Joined: 14 Dec 2011
|
| Posted: Sat Mar 03, 2012 6:04 pm Post subject: |
|
|
This skit needs to be placed in the larger context of cultural distain for coloured people. The 'white face only' adverts for hogwan jobs; the way blacks are depicted in Gyeongido school text books; the way students (and occasionally the K teacher) break into laughter when a black face appears on the screen (ever shown your kids the Justin Beiber video 'Baby'?); the whole Hines incident; the....
It's an ugly aspect of Korean culture that should not be excused or reasoned away. Apologists make fools of themselves when they try to do so. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
|
| Posted: Sat Mar 03, 2012 8:47 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Smithington wrote: |
Anyone remember the Busan incident a few years back? English teachers put on a play ridiculing aspects of Korean culture. A Korean complained to the police. The participants were arrested, charged with 'violating their visas' and deported - each and every one of them. 
. |
When you write stuff like this...you really shouldn't be calling anyone else "fools"
--The play ridiculed expat reactions as well.
--To the best of my knowledge no one was deported...several left but several others stayed.
--They were charged with violating their visas because that is what they did. They charged money to attend the play. Under the terms of the E-2 visa you simply can't do that.
--Oh and it wasn't just English teachers who were involved...there were a few Koreans as well. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Allthechildrenareinsane
Joined: 23 Jun 2011
Location: Lost in a Roman wilderness of pain
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
fermentation
Joined: 22 Jun 2009
|
| Posted: Sun Mar 04, 2012 9:42 pm Post subject: |
|
|
That was a much more thoughtful discussion of the issue than anything I've read here. Good stuff |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Smithington
Joined: 14 Dec 2011
|
| Posted: Mon Mar 05, 2012 6:09 pm Post subject: |
|
|
The annoying thing is this. Many Koreans feel comfortable openly mocking or ridiculing aspects of other cultures. Yet when mere children dared to criticize K-pop on that show 'Kids React to" the netizens went ballistic. How dare children criticize an aspect of Korean culture?
Then off home the netizens go to turn on the television and guffaw at Koreans dressed up in black face acting the fool.
Speaks volumes. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
|
| Posted: Mon Mar 05, 2012 8:09 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| fermentation wrote: |
That was a much more thoughtful discussion of the issue than anything I've read here. Good stuff |
Yeah there some interesting examples. For example, the 'Roots' production I don't think qualifies as blackface as clearly its attempting to portray a story and "being black" is essential to that story.
The other two that might have gotten a pass from me were the Eric from Shinhwa one, because if that is indeed him in the photo, then he was pretty much identical to Eddie Griffin, so with the uncanny resemblance I can see that. That's not so much blackface as he happens to look identical to someone who is black.
The last was the female circumcision which obviously was trying to attract attention to a human rights issue and perhaps was intended to show similarities and make people think beyond skin color.
Many of the other examples were at best tasteless, and at worse downright bigoted. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Smithington
Joined: 14 Dec 2011
|
| Posted: Tue Mar 06, 2012 7:10 pm Post subject: |
|
|
[quote="TheUrbanMyth"][quote="Smithington"]Anyone remember the Busan incident a few years back? English teachers put on a play ridiculing aspects of Korean culture. A Korean complained to the police. The participants were arrested, charged with 'violating their visas' and deported - each and every one of them.
Urban myth wrote:
The play ridiculed expat reactions as well.
Were the Koreans who phoned the police offended by the depiction of foreigners in the play?
--To the best of my knowledge no one was deported...several left but several others stayed.
Are you sure about this? You seem somewhat uncertain.
--They were charged with violating their visas because that is what they did. They charged money to attend the play. Under the terms of the E-2 visa you simply can't do that.
I have attended numerous plays in Korea performed by teachers on an E-2 visa. Tickets were sold for each event. They were violating their visas, but it was a minor violation. None of these events got raided by immigration. The event in Busan ridiculed Korean customs. It was raided by immigration. If you really think this was a coincidence you are beyond naive. Do you really believe that if the play was praising the positive aspects of Korea (while still charging a fee) that immigration would have raided the place. Do ya really think so?
--Oh and it wasn't just English teachers who were involved...there were a few Koreans as well.
This changes nothing.
Last edited by Smithington on Tue Mar 06, 2012 11:18 pm; edited 1 time in total |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
|
| Posted: Tue Mar 06, 2012 10:53 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Smithington wrote: |
| TheUrbanMyth wrote: |
| Smithington wrote: |
Anyone remember the Busan incident a few years back? English teachers put on a play ridiculing aspects of Korean culture. A Korean complained to the police. The participants were arrested, charged with 'violating their visas' and deported - each and every one of them.
. |
Urban myth wrote:
The play ridiculed expat reactions as well.
1. Were the Koreans who phoned the police offended by the depiction of Koreans in the play?
--To the best of my knowledge no one was deported...several left but several others stayed.
2.Are you sure about this? You seem somewhat uncertain.
--They were charged with violating their visas because that is what they did. They charged money to attend the play. Under the terms of the E-2 visa you simply can't do that.
3. I have attended numerous plays in Korea performed by teachers on an E-2 visa. Tickets were sold for each event. They were violating their visas, but it was a minor violation. None of these events got raided by immigration. The event in Busan ridiculed Korean customs. It was raided by immigration. If you really think this was a coincidence you are beyond naive. Do you really believe that if the play was praising the positive aspects of Korea (while still charging a fee) that immigration would have raided the place. Do ya really think so?
--Oh and it wasn't just English teachers who were involved...there were a few Koreans as well.
(4) This changes nothing.
|
|
(numbers are mine)
1. How should I know what some random Koreans were thinking? Seriously?
2. At least 2 people who were questioned by the police for participating in the play were able to renew their visas. How do I know this? Because both were posters on here and were here well past the date of that incident. If they were here then others could have stayed as well. My point was when you claimed that each and every one was deported...that was 100% wrong.
3. And how would Immigration know about these events unless there were Koreans there who were offended and calling them up? Do you really believe that Immigration has agents that go around and follow foreigners on their off-time? Immigration would not know about any of these events UNLESS they were tipped off. Yes I think Immigration would have raided the place even if they were praising the place...tell you what. You put on a play that praises Korea, and get someone to tip off Immigration. Let's see what happens.
4. Um yes...they got in trouble as well and it wasn't for making fun of Korea.. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Smithington
Joined: 14 Dec 2011
|
| Posted: Thu Mar 08, 2012 5:23 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Looks like Koreans' depiction of coloured people is finally getting attention in the US. This courtesy of the Marmot's Hole.
http://www.rjkoehler.com/2012/03/07/k-pop-or-kkk-pop/
The article itself is lame, and the notion that K-pop is sweeping the US is laughable - 99% of Americans have likely never heard of K-pop (nor should they want to). Anyway, people who read pop magazines are getting a glimpse of this highly unpleasant aspect of Korean culture. And no, it's not just harmless fun. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
|
| Posted: Thu Mar 08, 2012 6:36 pm Post subject: |
|
|
It was already said on the Marmot's Hole but it bears repeating here
| Quote: |
| Don�t overestimate the handful of blog posts on the topic over nine years by insulated expat writers, and don�t mistake that for some national awakening about the use of blackface |
| Quote: |
| ...Korea� didn�t do this, it was �MBC� who did it. Criticism should be directed at them. There were lot of Koreans too who were embarrassed by them who can�t control what the country�s media does. |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
