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What's the deal with vegetarianism?
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fosterman



Joined: 16 Nov 2011

PostPosted: Mon Sep 17, 2012 5:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kepler wrote:
fosterman wrote:
Kepler wrote:
I don't think vegetarianism is healthier. Humans evolved to be hunters and gatherers. Protein from animal sources contains the ideal combination amino acids for human needs. Protein from plant sources is missing essential amino acids. Whole grains are definitely not healthy. Whole wheat bread contains natural toxins and has a higher glycemic index than either table sugar or a candy bar. Consequently, it's more likely to lead to diabetes. You'd be better off eating white rice.


OHHHH come on dude! seriously? are you a doctor? because if you are gonna say that you had better present some facts, because their are doctors out there who have spent their life and millions of dollars in research grants looking into all of this and they would be quick to dismiss what you just said.

Since you seem so impressed by doctors you should read what Dr. Mercola has to say about the issue-

"Aside from providing excessive calories as carbohydrates, one of the major adverse consequences of most grains is that they are loaded with toxins.... The one grain type that is virtually toxin free is white rice, which has far fewer toxins than brown rice...."
http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2012/01/23/wheat-or-rice-as-safe-starch.aspx


Well of course he is like any other wannabe famous Dr, trying to sell a book or get on tv to make millions, I think we need to find a site or a video where non bias doctors have gathered to discuss this issue.
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The Cosmic Hum



Joined: 09 May 2003
Location: Sonic Space

PostPosted: Mon Sep 17, 2012 6:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

fosterman wrote:
... I think we need to find a site or a video where non bias doctors have gathered to discuss this issue.


Much easier said than done...this issue is loaded with bias...you can trust doctors about as much as you can trust politicians on this subject.

That being said...experiment yourself...use your own body as a guide for what works best for you.
Read as much as you can on this subject...then use that information as a general guide.

The human body is extremely flexible in some ways...and wickedly sensitive in others.
Just find out what works for you...and then share that with others.
Try to avoid the hype...and share what really works.

The other factor here is...what are your goals?
If being healthy is your ultimate goal...eat more vegies and less meat.(it doesn't have to be extremes.)
In fact, moderation and variety would serve most very well.

If being competitive is your goal...well...follow the science on that...they are discovering many 'new ways' to improve performance all the time.
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wishfullthinkng



Joined: 05 Mar 2010

PostPosted: Mon Sep 17, 2012 7:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Steelrails wrote:
I'd rather eat raw fish or even raw beef than a raw lime or a raw potato or raw corn or raw artichoke or raw brussels sprouts.

What an utter fail that post about raw pork was.

That being said, for all of those out there who claim that we are "meant to eat meat" I challenge you to go a couple months as a vegetarian and note the uh, consistency, cleanliness and err comfort, of your breaks for nature.

Basically I'd encourage anyone taking a dogmatic approach to meat-eating to lighten up. This goes both ways. And for all the crap vegetarians get for being like a cult, meat eaters can be pretty ridiculous themselves. I've actually met people who can't go more than two days without eating meat to the point of their moods changing drastically and displaying symptoms of physical addiction.



steel, even with all your haters you make sense most of the time. however, you can't possibly think humans weren't meant to eat meat. whenever a militant vegetarian tries to sell me their hogwash i laugh and ask them what they'd do if the world went to the pooper tomorrow and we all were forced to fend for ourselves. without their manufactured tofu and saitan and other protein sources they'd not last too long. as for the rest of humanity, they'd hunt their protein and gather their vegetables, just as humans were designed to do and they'd carry on just as humanity has done.

this isn't to say i don't have issues with eating meat. i also don't like the way animals are treated but i'm not so feeble minded to believe that vegetarianism is the answer.


Last edited by wishfullthinkng on Tue Sep 18, 2012 7:38 pm; edited 1 time in total
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NYC_Gal 2.0



Joined: 10 Dec 2010

PostPosted: Mon Sep 17, 2012 7:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

In all fairness, most humans don't hunt their own meat.
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Kepler



Joined: 24 Sep 2007

PostPosted: Mon Sep 17, 2012 7:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

In general, I think doctors are a poor source of information about nutrition. They are not educated on the subject in medical school and it's against a doctor's interests for people to eat healthy. More people eating healthy means less people getting sick and thus less money for doctors. Going 100% vegan is not healthy. You'd be deficient in Vitamin B12 if you ate only plant food. People don't really need to eat a lot of meat to get sufficient protein. About 50 grams of animal protein a day is enough for most adults. People didn't evolve to eat grains. Some people on paleo style diets, however, think eating white rice in moderate amounts is okay. White rice has had most of the bad stuff that is in other grains removed in the refining process or killed when the rice is cooked.
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Steelrails



Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System

PostPosted: Mon Sep 17, 2012 8:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

wishfullthinkng wrote:
Steelrails wrote:
I'd rather eat raw fish or even raw beef than a raw lime or a raw potato or raw corn or raw artichoke or raw brussels sprouts.

What an utter fail that post about raw pork was.

That being said, for all of those out there who claim that we are "meant to eat meat" I challenge you to go a couple months as a vegetarian and note the uh, consistency, cleanliness and err comfort, of your breaks for nature.

Basically I'd encourage anyone taking a dogmatic approach to meat-eating to lighten up. This goes both ways. And for all the crap vegetarians get for being like a cult, meat eaters can be pretty ridiculous themselves. I've actually met people who can't go more than two days without eating meat to the point of their moods changing drastically and displaying symptoms of physical addiction.



steel, even with all your haters you make sense most of the time. however, you can't possibly think humans weren't meant to eat meat. whenever a militant vegetarian tries to sell me their hogwash i laugh and ask them what they'd do if the world went to the pooper tomorrow and we all were forced to fend for ourselves. without their manufactured tofu and saitan and other protein sources they'd not last too long. as for the rest of humanity, they'd hunt their protein and gather their vegetables, just as humans we designed to do and they'd carry on just as humanity has done.

this isn't to say i don't have issues with eating meat. i also don't like the way animals are treated but i'm not so feeble minded to believe that vegetarianism is the answer.


I should clarify that by saying "meant to eat meat" I didn't say we aren't able to eat meat. I meant that meat is apparently not an ideal source of nutrition for us, giving the greater challenge in digesting and processing it. and overabundance of meat seems to not digest well (but the so does an overabundance of everything). Needless to say I don't hear vegetarians clinching like mad and needing half a roll of TP...
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NYC_Gal 2.0



Joined: 10 Dec 2010

PostPosted: Mon Sep 17, 2012 8:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kepler wrote:
In general, I think doctors are a poor source of information about nutrition. They are not educated on the subject in medical school and it's against a doctor's interests for people to eat healthy. More people eating healthy means less people getting sick and thus less money for doctors. Going 100% vegan is not healthy. You'd be deficient in Vitamin B12 if you ate only plant food. People don't really need to eat a lot of meat to get sufficient protein. About 50 grams of animal protein a day is enough for most adults. People didn't evolve to eat grains. Some people on paleo style diets, however, think eating white rice in moderate amounts is okay. White rice has had most of the bad stuff that is in other grains removed in the refining process or killed when the rice is cooked.


Marmite's loaded with B12.
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wishfullthinkng



Joined: 05 Mar 2010

PostPosted: Mon Sep 17, 2012 11:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Steelrails wrote:
wishfullthinkng wrote:
Steelrails wrote:
I'd rather eat raw fish or even raw beef than a raw lime or a raw potato or raw corn or raw artichoke or raw brussels sprouts.

What an utter fail that post about raw pork was.

That being said, for all of those out there who claim that we are "meant to eat meat" I challenge you to go a couple months as a vegetarian and note the uh, consistency, cleanliness and err comfort, of your breaks for nature.

Basically I'd encourage anyone taking a dogmatic approach to meat-eating to lighten up. This goes both ways. And for all the crap vegetarians get for being like a cult, meat eaters can be pretty ridiculous themselves. I've actually met people who can't go more than two days without eating meat to the point of their moods changing drastically and displaying symptoms of physical addiction.



steel, even with all your haters you make sense most of the time. however, you can't possibly think humans weren't meant to eat meat. whenever a militant vegetarian tries to sell me their hogwash i laugh and ask them what they'd do if the world went to the pooper tomorrow and we all were forced to fend for ourselves. without their manufactured tofu and saitan and other protein sources they'd not last too long. as for the rest of humanity, they'd hunt their protein and gather their vegetables, just as humans we designed to do and they'd carry on just as humanity has done.

this isn't to say i don't have issues with eating meat. i also don't like the way animals are treated but i'm not so feeble minded to believe that vegetarianism is the answer.


I should clarify that by saying "meant to eat meat" I didn't say we aren't able to eat meat. I meant that meat is apparently not an ideal source of nutrition for us, giving the greater challenge in digesting and processing it. and overabundance of meat seems to not digest well (but the so does an overabundance of everything). Needless to say I don't hear vegetarians clinching like mad and needing half a roll of TP...



i would agree that an overabundance of meat is not ideal and that it doesn't digest well. a balanced diet of meat and vegetables is necessary. however meat is a great source of many important nutritional building blocks that are difficult or nearly impossible to find in plant matter and i still stand by the idea that the human body inherently was designed to eat meat.

however, as for meat not being able to digest well, once we found out that heat denatures proteins, meat became much better suited for eating. Since fire is easily started, the argument of meat not being able to be digested well holds little water, especially considering a lot of plant mass (fiber) can't be readily digested at all.
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TheUrbanMyth



Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired

PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2012 12:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Steelrails wrote:
[I should clarify that by saying "meant to eat meat" I didn't say we aren't able to eat meat. I meant that meat is apparently not an ideal source of nutrition for us, giving the greater challenge in digesting and processing it. and overabundance of meat seems to not digest well (but the so does an overabundance of everything). Needless to say I don't hear vegetarians clinching like mad and needing half a roll of TP...



Cook it until tender, cut it into small pieces and chew throughly before swallowing . If your digestive system is up to par you should be able to digest and process it perfectly well. And that's with no "clinching like mad and needing half a roll of TP"

If someone has a problem with digesting meat it might be that the person's own system is compromised in some fashion...or they are eating too much of it. Many other people (myself among them) eat meat and have no problems whatsoever with it.
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Gorf



Joined: 25 Jun 2011

PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2012 10:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Come on guys, JustinC is a known troll. You're playing right into his hand.
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fosterman



Joined: 16 Nov 2011

PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2012 4:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

still, kind of strange that Humans go from breast milk to cows milk though isn't it.? I mean unnatural when you think about it.
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Captain Corea



Joined: 28 Feb 2005
Location: Seoul

PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2012 5:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've got a number of sharp teeth. I figure they are there for a reason. Smile
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Underwaterbob



Joined: 08 Jan 2005
Location: In Cognito

PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2012 6:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

fosterman wrote:
still, kind of strange that Humans go from breast milk to cows milk though isn't it.? I mean unnatural when you think about it.


Maybe when you think about it, but then not all of us have your hang ups. Cows and goats are just as much a part of nature as you or I. People have been drinking their milk since we first domesticated them thousands of years ago. Drinking milk is no more unnatural than eating bread.
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Zyzyfer



Joined: 29 Jan 2003
Location: who, what, where, when, why, how?

PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2012 6:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

fosterman wrote:
still, kind of strange that Humans go from breast milk to cows milk though isn't it.? I mean unnatural when you think about it.


We're just preparing them for the wonderful world of cheese.
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CentralCali



Joined: 17 May 2007

PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2012 9:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

fosterman wrote:
I think we need to find a site or a video where non bias doctors have gathered to discuss this issue.


How about American Dietetic Association and Dietitians of Canada for an unbiased group?
Quote:
It is the position of the American Dietetic Association and Dietitians of Canada that appropriately planned vegetarian diets are healthful, nutritionally adequate, and provide health benefits in the prevention and treatment of certain diseases.


And come on, folks! Asserting that doctors are interested in keeping people sick is conspiracy theory territory.
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