Korean Job Discussion Forums

chronicpride · Joined: 16 Jan 2003

There are many, many teachers who come here that don't care if they had to work Saturdays, they just want a good, reliable job for a year. The problem is that your director is looking for teachers on an internet site where teachers are conditioned to be picky. After spending 3 or 4 months reading this board, one will be trained not to accept anything below 2.0, split shifts, Saturdays, or less than 10 days vacation, unless there are uncommon perks elsewhere in the contract. The amount of scrutiny that gets placed on these contract details tend to be viewed with more regard than a school's reliability and 'super laid-back' environment. The excessiveness of this scrutiny is why teachers get burnt by bad schools. Dime a dozen for every great contract on paper,and then the teacher seeking a release or running after 3 months.

The best bet is to advertise on internet mediums where teachers just care about finding a good, reliable place to work and want to live in a foreign country for a year. Monster.com, hotjobs.com, workopolis.com, etc...Try the big job sites. There are a lot of people graduating from universities now and checking these sites.

Derrek · Joined: 15 Jan 2003

chronicpride · Joined: 16 Jan 2003

My beef is that the words 'reliable' and 'reputable' and 'on-time pay' and 'honest director who speaks great english', gets 2nd billing to 'no Saturdays', 'split shifts', etc...

My first year I worked for 1.8 and Saturdays, and 5 days vacation, and so did 24 others. The reason why those conditions were not a daily gripe from us and why they have many teachers sign for 2nd and 3rd contracts, is because they are a fantastic school to work for and have a great reputation with their teachers. Pay on time, overtime projects (only if you're interested), and negotiable vacation (I added another 10 days into my year. I know others that were able to get 20-30 days, and they saw a lot of Asia in one year.)

You don't see these things in a contract. So when people judge a school by their contract numbers, that greatly narrows the field of schools. Potentially very good schools.

Teachers 'should' sign contracts with schools, who they've researched and qualified them to be of good standing, financially solvent, good work environment, and then, only after that, choose from the schools for their numbers. The over-emphasis on contract numbers on this site strays people away from this practice.

cdn · Joined: 19 Jan 2003

Hi
Yeah I am in the same boat. I have no idea why my hogwon can't find someone new. They do waNt a female, but there are no saturdays and you work 25 or less hours per week. :(

Zyzyfer · Posted: Thu Apr 29, 2004 10:57 pm Post subject:

aussie col · Joined: 31 Jan 2004

I don��t see what��s so hard to understand about the difficulty in finding a teacher.

So, you want a female? That removes 50% of the possibilities.

You want a North American. What��s that, about 25% of teachers?

You want someone to teach kindergarten. Maybe 60% of the rest.

You want someone to work Saturdays. Maybe 20% of people would.

So lets see. Of all the possible teachers out there you would only consider 1.5% of them acceptable (50%x25%x60%x20%). So you either have to offer a really good deal to get one of the 1.5% or get lucky and catch a newbie out of university.

chronicpride · Joined: 16 Jan 2003

JackSarang · Joined: 28 Jan 2003

The only place you've posted the ad is PusanWeb? Its not exactly the site with the highest traffic of prospective ESL teachers.

Tell your Director to toss out a little cash and post an ad either on Dave's or on englishspectrum. Two sites that get a hell of a lot more traffic than Pusanweb.

Hagwon Muppet · Joined: 18 Mar 2003

I think there is a tendency to over analyse the 'facts' in a contract.....I'm really surprised how many people think that 2.0m is WWAAAYYY better than 1.9m (its less than 25 US bucks a week folks) but at the same time the 'facts' are the only things you can really compare on.

'Great director' , 'laid back style' etc are all subjective and differ from person to person. We've already seen here that some people consider 'no prep' a bonus and others think its a bad sign.

You never really can tell what the culture is like until you experience it for a while so there is a tendency to say 'well its more money per hour than school X so might as well go for it'

Derrek · Joined: 15 Jan 2003

Chronic, I respect your answer more now, but...

Going into a contract as a newbee to Korea, how many people truly can count on what they hear about how "great" a school or director is when they hear it from a stranger?

Sure, if someone you knew personally before coming to Korea recommends XYZ school because "they're honest, great, etc." even though you have to work Saturdays, then it could be fine.

I'm sure less than 1% of those who come to teach in Korea actually have a friend who is already teaching and happy with a particular school.

Also, in over two years of talking to teachers and looking at job ads from time-to-time, I have never once heard one say they worked at a great school which included Saturday time. I have, however, heard of people being shafted into working on Saturdays because the director pushed them into it, and they agreed (out of their own weakness).

On the subject of pay, however, I will say that trying to find the 2.2+ jobs is going at it the wrong way. If you can get a job at 2.0 with fewer (or better) working hours, and more vacation -- take it.

TheUrbanMyth · Joined: 28 Jan 2003 Location: Retired

phaedrus · Joined: 13 Nov 2003 Location: I'm comin' to get ya.

Hypothetically, if Mother Teresa, Gandhi and the Dalai Lama were my bosses (some dead some living), and I was teaching hot babes, I still wouldn't work a split shift and Saturdays. What a way to ruin a perfectly good life.

chronicpride · Joined: 16 Jan 2003

I agree with you guys on your viewpoint that a teacher's opinion of the school is subjective and the only thing that is true and binding is the contract. No question about it.

But my gripe is the over-emphasis on the contract makes many teachers overlook the importance of asking informed questions to the director and talking to current and former teachers.

If one or two teachers say that the school is hell on earth and they are seeking letters of release, despite the contract looking very appealing, then that should send off warning bells in the prospective teacher's head. If not to turn it down, then at least to ask the director and/or recruiter more informed questions about the school and position to counter-balance the current teacher(s) opinions.

I have issue that the 'no split shifts', 'no Saturdays', 'nothing less than 2.0' advice mantras on here, resonate far louder than 'ask questions about the school, not just the job', or 'make sure you talk to current teachers and try for an email address or two of past teachers'. It would save a lot of grief to a lot of teachers if contract screening and school reference checks were promoted with equal vigor.

phaedrus · Joined: 13 Nov 2003 Location: I'm comin' to get ya.

I agree with chronicpride that the whole story is important.

Most directors don't even know what's in their contract. It might be really good, but they might be a real story themselves. It might be a really bad contract, but maybe they are really nice and will change it, etc.

On that note, though, the ideal situation would be no split shift, no Saturdays (or at least a five day week), 2.0M or over, and a great school.

A good sign that the school is up to par and fair to their teachers is the fact that they offer good conditions.

Of course if it sounds too good to be true they are probably hiding something.

jajdude · Joined: 18 Jan 2003

Well I just find it reassuring I suppose to know there are always jobs out there. If it's so hard to find someone then I guess that means it's an easy job to get?