|
Korean Job Discussion Forums
"The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Teachers from Around the World!"
|
| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
Kuros
Joined: 27 Apr 2004
|
 Posted: Tue Oct 16, 2012 3:20 pm Post subject: Britain's 'Live-at-home' Men |
 |
|
Young adults have become reluctant to fly the family nest
| Quote: |
The number of Britons aged between 20 and 34 still living at home has increased by 28% to 3.2m since 1997, despite little change in the size of the population of that age bracket. The trend is accelerating: over the past year alone the number has increased by 6%. Around one in three young men and one in six young women now lives with their parents.
. . .
Above all, more people are going to university and then �boomeranging� back. According to research by Ann Berrington, at the ESRC Centre for Population Change at the University of Southampton, young people with degrees are much more likely to live with their parents.
. . .
Britain has become less like Scandinavia, where young people tend to leave home at 18 or 19 and never return, and more like a Mediterranean country, where kids can stick around for decades. There is one difference, however. In countries like Italy, parents tend to want to keep their children at home, says Maria Iacovou, of the University of Essex, and young adults with richer parents are actually more likely to live at home. British parents, stuck washing and cooking for their grown-up children, are typically less enthusiastic. |
The article accurately describes the usual outcome of the Mama's Boys of the Bronx lifestyle. Men who delay careers and mortgages for fun and freedom from responsibility often end up without future prospects.
Being without future prospects is a crappy outcome for them. For the society, if this becomes common it is a disaster. The full economic potential of college graduate males will not contribute to economic growth and the result will be a lower quality group on the whole. |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
Fox
Joined: 04 Mar 2009
|
| Posted: Tue Oct 16, 2012 4:12 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| I see a lot of benefits in the multi-generational household model, though I agree that, "I don't want responsibility," is not a good reason to embrace such a lifestyle. It should be noted, though, that it's not delaying "careers and mortgages" that has a detrimental impact on the male psyche (and accordingly, the male population), it's delaying starting a family. Having a wife and children to provide for is something which can have a profound impact on the male psyche, which in turn naturally channels him towards socially-productive modes of life. Although perhaps made in sarcasm, this really is the flip-side of the "leftover women" thread, since it shows how modern feminist culture can and often does impact men, and it's not a positive influence. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Titus
Joined: 19 May 2012
|
| Posted: Tue Oct 16, 2012 4:56 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Sarcasm and snark are feminine.
The men who sit in basements watching porn and playing computer games are extremely angry. They'd happily watch the world burn.
Women are naturally hypergamous and their ego unrestrained. The dominant men bang all the bangable women and the other men jack off all day (with the hope that an aging fatty might settle for them when her eggs are almost gone). The blue collar jobs are in China and vibrants/women given preference for white collar jobs. They are a perfect example of the dead end that has arrived. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Titus
Joined: 19 May 2012
|
| Posted: Tue Oct 16, 2012 5:30 pm Post subject: |
|
|
The best summary:
http://heartiste.wordpress.com/2012/02/21/its-time-for-women-to-woman-up/
| Quote: |
There�s been a lot of talk lately in the mainstream (read: leftist) media organs about the rising numbers of single moms and their bastard spawn in America, a dystopian trend to which hosts at Le Chateau were generous enough to alert the reading audience on and off over the past four years. The hand-wringing, the excusing and the rationalizing have reached a fever pitch as sob stories of tragicomic proportions litter the pages of esteemed broadsheets like the Beta Times. It�s a crescendo of heartwarming, anti-male anecdotes about poor, put-upon single moms with snot machines in tow bitterly complaining about the lack of good, reliable men.
Reading this gruesome tripe, something occurs to me. Not once, not anywhere, is the point of view of the typical man in these benighted communities across America examined. Nowhere did I find a mention, even the slightest acknowledgement, of the responsibility that women bear to attract a decent man for marriage and future fatherhood. It�s just assumed that men alone are the sex abdicating their societal duty, that all women need to do is show up, no matter how broken, bedraggled and burdened with bastards, and men will feel an overwhelming urge to marry these unfeminine, spiteful ogresses and provide for them. Yeah right!
Peruse any feminist or beta male columnist pontificating on the single mom + illegitimate hellion phenomenon, and the message condenses to a screech against male desire, tantamount to a lede saying �Men drop out, women and children suffering, men need to man up�. Someone should acquaint this crowd with the saying �it takes two to tango�.
If you want to know why men are running away from marriage, children and beta provisioning, one major reason is that the women available to these working class men are flat out disgusting. Take a look for yourself. What man of normal mental health and active libido wants to romantically woo and date, let alone marry, a beastly, waddling tatted mountain of pustulence with the issue of three other men barking and nipping at her cankles?
If you were a man with diminishing job prospects and stagnant wages thanks to mass low-skill immigration and automation, would you �man up� and �do your duty� for the sake of societal health and elite approval if the only women in your milieu are snorting megafauna hiding week-old salami in their stomach folds and eager to have you babysit their fatherless womb filth? Or would you say �*beep* it�, hit the XBox and apply a dollop of asshole game to score a succession of flings and one night stands with the few remaining slender babes in your neighborhood?
And let�s not forget that economically empowered and government-assisted women, slaves to their hypergamous impulse for higher status mates than themselves, can�t help but winnow the pool of men deemed acceptable marriage material. When women say �there are no good men left�, what the astute observer hears is �there are no good men left thanks to a combination of my increased expectations and decreased attractiveness.�
So instead of facing the sexual market head on and grappling with its workings, you get �family values� white knighting numbskulls like BIll Bennett, lost for anything insightful to say, berating men for abandoning those incorruptible angels known as women, and feminists like Katie Roiphe, doing what feminists divorced from reality do best, recasting single momhood and bastard spawn into a valid alternative lifestyle that we should all show more tolerance toward, and redefining standards of civilized family functioning to avoid the omnipresent gaze of the evil eye of judginess.
And there you have the crassest self-deception of the traditionalist and feminist mindset laid bare: the former refusing to understand that standards of sexual behavior are a two-way street, the latter refusing to accept that standards of sexual behavior can�t be waved away to turn losers into winners.
If single momhood and bastard spawn are the blights on civilized Western society that all the data and real world observations indicate they are, then this blog�s simple program to save the institution of marriage is required reading for the �experts�. I�d add the following suggestions you won�t see in the mainstream media to encourage marriage and the formation of two-parent households among the non-elite classes:
Women �
Lose weight. Stop being so goddamned fat. Men are more willing to provide for women who are young and slender.
Learn to use contraception. Do not get pregnant outside of marriage. Men really don�t like taking on the responsibility of children not their own.
Try not to *beep* around so much. Men are not enthusiastic about marrying women whose vaginas have played host to numerous cocks before them.
Government �
Stop paying women for pumping out broods of bastards. You get more of what you pay for. Let the infants die of exposure if necessary. There�s nothing like the starvation death of a newborn child to clarify the mind.
Stop offering incentives to women to attend college and training classes. End all affirmative action for women. Governmental incentives like this effectively price working class men out of marriage contention.
Stop making laws that mandate companies have to accommodate pregnant women and mothers. Substituting big daddy government for beta provider men means fewer beta provider men.
�Experts� �
Relearn the valuable lesson that shame is a great motivator of human behavior. Stop normalizing the abnormal. Call a spade a spade, a bastard spawn a bastard spawn. This is the kind of hammer blow to the head that the lower classes need so that they know which life choices are good for them and which life choices are bad for them.
Do not be afraid to be judgmental. Judgment is alpha.
Self-esteem is not a virtue, it is a symptom. Get the causality straight.
Feminists �
Shoot yourselves. Seriously. You do no one but your own tender egos any good. Your semantic wordplay does nothing to thwart the inevitable reckoning.
Lords of Lies �
Start thinking about what kind of society your lies will create in the long term. That is, if you care at all.
Men �
Read this blog. If the rules won�t play by you, then learn to play by your own rules.
And finally, to the factory-farmed ivory tower sociologists studying marriage trends and turning out paper after paper of half-assed hogwash: there�s a whole other world out there. It�s the world of men, and in that world, men�s desires matter. You should think about incorporating that ugly reality into your theories.
In short, men will man up when women woman up. Because women, as the gatekeepers of sex, get the men they deserve. And, more often than not, what they deserve is what they want. |
^ the truth. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Titus
Joined: 19 May 2012
|
| Posted: Tue Oct 16, 2012 5:40 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Fox wrote: |
| I see a lot of benefits in the multi-generational household model |
I agree. My mother in law is moving in with us and I think it is fantastic. Takes some pressure off of Mrs. Titus, gives her company and family when I'm at work and adds an extra layer of emotional support and stability for children.
I guess I could throw Mrs. Titus in the labor force, send the kids to daycare and buy a nicer car. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Kuros
Joined: 27 Apr 2004
|
| Posted: Tue Oct 16, 2012 5:44 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Titus wrote: |
Sarcasm and snark are feminine.
The men who sit in basements watching porn and playing computer games are extremely angry. They'd happily watch the world burn.
Women are naturally hypergamous and their ego unrestrained. The dominant men bang all the bangable women and the other men jack off all day (with the hope that an aging fatty might settle for them when her eggs are almost gone). The blue collar jobs are in China and vibrants/women given preference for white collar jobs. They are a perfect example of the dead end that has arrived. |
I start a thread about British men who continue live with their families. Fox talks about the impact of feminist culture on men. Naturally, Titus talks about porn.
Unemployment? No, its culture. *headsmack* |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Titus
Joined: 19 May 2012
|
| Posted: Tue Oct 16, 2012 5:47 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| You see no relation between the behavior of men and the behavior of men? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Fox
Joined: 04 Mar 2009
|
| Posted: Tue Oct 16, 2012 6:13 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Kuros wrote: |
| Unemployment? No, its culture. *headsmack* |
Don't be an economic reductionist. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Kuros
Joined: 27 Apr 2004
|
| Posted: Tue Oct 16, 2012 6:17 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Fox wrote: |
| Kuros wrote: |
| Unemployment? No, its culture. *headsmack* |
Don't be an economic reductionist. |
The economic crisis has shattered a generation. Women's rights? Not so much. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Fox
Joined: 04 Mar 2009
|
| Posted: Tue Oct 16, 2012 6:41 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Kuros wrote: |
| Fox wrote: |
| Kuros wrote: |
| Unemployment? No, its culture. *headsmack* |
Don't be an economic reductionist. |
The economic crisis has shattered a generation. Women's rights? Not so much. |
Social forces are a contiguous mass. Economists trying to explain the world in terms of pure economic activity fail again and again, which is part of the reason listening to them can be so destructive. You say say, "Hey, it's just unemployment!" if you like, but I don't think the state of the economy and the cultural atmosphere are unrelated phenomena which can or should be understood independently of one another. Too complex for forum discussion I suppose. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Kuros
Joined: 27 Apr 2004
|
| Posted: Tue Oct 16, 2012 7:30 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Fox wrote: |
| Kuros wrote: |
| Fox wrote: |
| Kuros wrote: |
| Unemployment? No, its culture. *headsmack* |
Don't be an economic reductionist. |
The economic crisis has shattered a generation. Women's rights? Not so much. |
Social forces are a contiguous mass. Economists trying to explain the world in terms of pure economic activity fail again and again, which is part of the reason listening to them can be so destructive. You say say, "Hey, it's just unemployment!" if you like, but I don't think the state of the economy and the cultural atmosphere are unrelated phenomena which can or should be understood independently of one another. Too complex for forum discussion I suppose. |
You can continue debating that economic reductionist over there. But the economic crisis has had cultural impact. The domination of the 1% and the elite fill the youth with despair and listlessness about their future prospects. That's not an economist's diagnosis, its a cultural diagnosis about corporatism and the aftermath of elite piracy.
I don't have much evidence for this thesis, its merely a likely story. But I think corporatist corruption is a more likely cultural cause of British youth refusing to leave the nest than porn or the aftermath of the women's movement. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
recessiontime
Joined: 21 Jun 2010
Location: Got avatar privileges nyahahaha
|
| Posted: Wed Oct 17, 2012 2:53 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Fox wrote: |
| I see a lot of benefits in the multi-generational household model, though I agree that, "I don't want responsibility," is not a good reason to embrace such a lifestyle. It should be noted, though, that it's not delaying "careers and mortgages" that has a detrimental impact on the male psyche (and accordingly, the male population), it's delaying starting a family. Having a wife and children to provide for is something which can have a profound impact on the male psyche, which in turn naturally channels him towards socially-productive modes of life. Although perhaps made in sarcasm, this really is the flip-side of the "leftover women" thread, since it shows how modern feminist culture can and often does impact men, and it's not a positive influence. |
Fair enough, I'd further argue that being powerless is damaging to the male psyche. Living with your parents is all fine but the fact is you are living in your parents' house in the prime time of your life being unproductive and at the same time being a burden on them. Flightless bird syndrome is something I understand personally.
Feminism had a profound impact on unemployment. The simple fact that women were able to take the job vacancies traditionally reserved for men spelled out disaster. Now the jobs that are vacant ones are low quality and thus young people put off marriage and having children. I'm not going to say that feminism is the sole reason for the circumstances Western nations are in. There's still outsourcing, cronyism, etc etc. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Squire
Joined: 26 Sep 2010
Location: Jeollanam-do
|
| Posted: Wed Oct 17, 2012 4:55 am Post subject: |
|
|
I can see the economic and separate cultural reasons for young guys staying with their parents for longer. Obviously lack of jobs is a big one, but also the idea that you are younger for longer
I liked that article on feminism. There were some good points made there that don't ever get brought up |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
bucheon bum
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
|
| Posted: Wed Oct 17, 2012 7:30 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Kuros wrote: |
| Titus wrote: |
Sarcasm and snark are feminine.
The men who sit in basements watching porn and playing computer games are extremely angry. They'd happily watch the world burn.
Women are naturally hypergamous and their ego unrestrained. The dominant men bang all the bangable women and the other men jack off all day (with the hope that an aging fatty might settle for them when her eggs are almost gone). The blue collar jobs are in China and vibrants/women given preference for white collar jobs. They are a perfect example of the dead end that has arrived. |
I start a thread about British men who continue live with their families. Fox talks about the impact of feminist culture on men. Naturally, Titus talks about porn.
Unemployment? No, its culture. *headsmack* |
The article you posted stated:
| Quote: |
| Oddly, though, young people are increasingly likely to live at home even if they do have jobs. Some of this is pragmatic: high rents and tight mortgage-lending criteria make it expensive and difficult to fly the nest. But bigger forces are at work, too. |
Obviously culture is playing a part. I guess you could say that the economic crisis made moving back home culturally acceptable.
I really don't know who would choose to live with their parents (assuming they are gainfully employed and are in normal health). Sure, it might save you money but the non-monetary costs are certainly high.
| Fox wrote: |
| It should be noted, though, that it's not delaying "careers and mortgages" that has a detrimental impact on the male psyche (and accordingly, the male population), it's delaying starting a family. Having a wife and children to provide for is something which can have a profound impact on the male psyche, which in turn naturally channels him towards socially-productive modes of life. |
So you don't think living on one's own is any different than living with family? At least for a single adult male? Or that living on his own has no role in pushing a man into becoming more "socially-productive"? That seems a bit extreme. Sure, living on one's own doesn't have the same impact as having a family does, but it certainly does push a person into becoming more connected to the world around him (especially in contrast to living with his parents). |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Fox
Joined: 04 Mar 2009
|
| Posted: Wed Oct 17, 2012 3:50 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| recessiontime wrote: |
| Fox wrote: |
| I see a lot of benefits in the multi-generational household model, though I agree that, "I don't want responsibility," is not a good reason to embrace such a lifestyle. It should be noted, though, that it's not delaying "careers and mortgages" that has a detrimental impact on the male psyche (and accordingly, the male population), it's delaying starting a family. Having a wife and children to provide for is something which can have a profound impact on the male psyche, which in turn naturally channels him towards socially-productive modes of life. Although perhaps made in sarcasm, this really is the flip-side of the "leftover women" thread, since it shows how modern feminist culture can and often does impact men, and it's not a positive influence. |
Fair enough, I'd further argue that being powerless is damaging to the male psyche. Living with your parents is all fine but the fact is you are living in your parents' house in the prime time of your life being unproductive and at the same time being a burden on them. Flightless bird syndrome is something I understand personally. |
There's some truth to that. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
|
|
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
