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NYC_Gal 2.0
Joined: 10 Dec 2010
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 Posted: Fri Dec 21, 2012 4:21 am Post subject: |
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It's not greedy. He was told that it was the same contract that he had previously, which had paid vacation. He was lied to. He should have read it, of course, but everyone makes mistakes. That does not make him greedy. Sheesh. He isn't looking for a whole year's worth of holiday time. Let's say a hagwon gives 2 weeks of paid vacation on a standard contract. For half that time, he should be entitled to 1 week. His bosses are being greedy.
I say walk. You can get another job easily with your type of visa. Best of luck! |
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YTMND
Joined: 16 Jan 2012
Location: You're the man now dog!!
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| Posted: Fri Dec 21, 2012 5:11 am Post subject: |
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| For half that time, he should be entitled to 1 week. His bosses are being greedy. |
If I were on an E2 visa, yes, I would agree to that. However on an F visa, they are trying to hire teachers without giving the benefits. That's the point. I don't know how naive you can be to be on an F visa and not see this.
That's why you got the job over an E2 visa holder, they don't have to pay out as much. Either you understand this or you don't.
| Quote: |
| I say walk. You can get another job easily with your type of visa. Best of luck! |
Easy for an F visa holder. For an E2 visa holder you have to get all your documents again. |
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PatrickGHBusan
Joined: 24 Jun 2008
Location: Busan (1997-2008) Canada 2008 -
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| Posted: Fri Dec 21, 2012 6:25 am Post subject: |
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| YTMND has a point here. |
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nautilus
Joined: 26 Nov 2005
Location: Je jump, Tu jump, oui jump!
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| Posted: Fri Dec 21, 2012 7:09 am Post subject: |
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| Suwon Fish wrote: |
The contract changes are so subtle and sly I don't really feel bad about missing them.
After a good year with the company then bailing them out it never occured to me they'd sc#%w me over.^ |
Oh I know how you feel.
Exactly the same happened to me.
It the sheer ingratitude that gets me. |
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ontheway
Joined: 24 Aug 2005
Location: Somewhere under the rainbow...
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| Posted: Fri Dec 21, 2012 8:50 am Post subject: Re: Help to escape an overly onerous contract |
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| Suwon Fish wrote: |
Hi guys,
Long story short, I'd spent a good year with S####care in their afterschool program. At the end of the contract they couldn't find a new teacher for some reason. I stayed a week, then a couple of weeks then agreed to sign up for another 5 months.
The contract looked like my previous one, and I was assured it was essentially the same....
Hmmmmm.... Actually it turns out it was so "weasely worded" that I'm not getting national holidays paid or my winter vacation that is explicitly in the contract.
Ok, I signed it. I'm no lawyer and I trusted them but mea culpa, I
signed it.
Here's my question. S####care is trying to escape paying my vacation by pointing out the vacation clause refers to a 1 year period. There are other discrepancies too where 5 months and 1 year are both refered to in the contract.
So, do these date discrepancies render the contract invalid? I.e. legally void...
Thanks in advance and Merry Christmas ^^ |
Getting back to your actual question:
No, your contract is not automatically void because of discrepancies. There may be sections of the contract that are ambiguous or rendered moot, but it is not void. Even illegal sections of a contract which may be void do not void other sections of the contract. This is actually to the benefit of both parties in most cases. You cannot seek legal redress if the entire contract is void.
As to your situation, it sounds like you only have two months left. So, you have to decide what you want to do from now until the end of February.
It may be a bad contract, however you are losing out on only a few days of potential vacation and holiday income. It's possible you have some legal recourse (as others have said, we first need to see your specific contract), but it's likely to be more costly and time consuming than even the maximum you can get.
Sounds like you should finish the two months you have left while looking for your next job; chalk it up to "lesson learned" and read your contract next time.
However, if you're up for a bit of time off and enjoy revenge more than cash you could just quit early and go on vacation. They may have cause to sue you, but they will probably just replace you with someone else and have too few damages to make it worthwhile. |
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Weigookin74
Joined: 26 Oct 2009
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| Posted: Mon Dec 24, 2012 5:39 am Post subject: |
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| YTMND wrote: |
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| My unpaid vacation starts next week. |
What does that mean to an F visa holder?
The whole point in you greedy poster getting a job instead of an E2 visa holder is that you get the job, not them.
Why are you so greedy that you ask for paid vacation?
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| I have my own apartment. I get a single payment that covers pension, housing, health and salary. |
So, you are covered. Stop bitching like a bitch. |
Meow!! |
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YTMND
Joined: 16 Jan 2012
Location: You're the man now dog!!
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| Posted: Mon Dec 24, 2012 5:30 pm Post subject: |
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I apologize to all cat lovers. After rereading the post quoted above, I realized I was a bit strong. Sometimes I come off as a tiger.
The main point I was getting across is that F visa holders have the ability to schedule vacation time more easily between jobs, part-time or full, but E2 visa holders are less likely to get the same treatment. The school will want them full-time and have a schedule all laid out where they can't schedule vacation time.
If I were on an F visa, I wouldn't sign the same kind of deal an E2 visa holder would agree to because there would be more options.
Maybe the original poster is just learning this and was operating along the lines of an E2 visa holder. So, this is one lesson to learn and be more careful next time you sign a contract on an F visa. Get your days all squared away in advance. |
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Zyzyfer
Joined: 29 Jan 2003
Location: who, what, where, when, why, how?
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| Posted: Wed Dec 26, 2012 12:59 am Post subject: |
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| PatrickGHBusan wrote: |
| YTMND has a point here. |
No not really. At least, the point you feel is being made is peanuts compared to the rope-a-dope posting style of YTMND.
I gave up caring about it but since I know Suwon Fish in person I would pay good money to watch YTMND bang on about looking at things from an E-2 perspective and call Mr. Fish a bitch and tell him to stop bitching. Where people get off acting like complete jerks online is beyond me.
If you sign a contract as an F visa holder and do the school a solid by covering since it can't find a replacement and then agree to sign a new contract that, as stated, is the same contract except for the length, you don't expect them to do things like completely remove vacation time etc.
Sure Suwon Fish should have double-checked to be safe but it has nothing to do with having an F visa or not. It's just a giant attempt at a rope-a-dope.
I'll give YTMND credit for being pretty damn good at it, though. Always writing replies that are juuuuuuuuuuuust enough out there to get long-winded, teeth-grinding responses. |
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YTMND
Joined: 16 Jan 2012
Location: You're the man now dog!!
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| Posted: Wed Dec 26, 2012 2:36 am Post subject: |
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| If you sign a contract as an F visa holder and do the school a solid by covering since it can't find a replacement and then agree to sign a new contract that, as stated, is the same contract except for the length, you don't expect them to do things like completely remove vacation time etc. |
They aren't removing it. It was never there to begin with. |
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Zyzyfer
Joined: 29 Jan 2003
Location: who, what, where, when, why, how?
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| Posted: Wed Dec 26, 2012 4:50 am Post subject: |
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| See what I mean? |
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YTMND
Joined: 16 Jan 2012
Location: You're the man now dog!!
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| Posted: Wed Dec 26, 2012 5:13 am Post subject: |
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| Zyzyfer wrote: |
| See what I mean? |
No I don't. Vacation time is for people who will put time in before and after the vacation.
What logic are you using to justify vacation time after someone has extended a previous year's contract?
Let's simplify this. Let's say your employer wants you to work an extra week after a contract period. Should you get vacation time in relationship to this extra week? Why or why not?
Let's say you do something more reasonable and the school wants 1 more month. You extend it one month, does that mean you are expecting 83% of a day off? Let's say it's 1 day vacation time.
I get this figure by taking into account 10 vacation days per year and applying it to 1 month.
Show me your logic so I can see the error of my ways. I can't see how extending a visa contract entitles you to more vacation time unless you actually plan on returning to work after the vacation period.
That is the whole definition behind a vacation. Otherwise you would be leaving. Get it? |
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PatrickGHBusan
Joined: 24 Jun 2008
Location: Busan (1997-2008) Canada 2008 -
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| Posted: Wed Dec 26, 2012 1:57 pm Post subject: |
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| Zyzyfer wrote: |
| PatrickGHBusan wrote: |
| YTMND has a point here. |
No not really. At least, the point you feel is being made is peanuts compared to the rope-a-dope posting style of YTMND.
I gave up caring about it but since I know Suwon Fish in person I would pay good money to watch YTMND bang on about looking at things from an E-2 perspective and call Mr. Fish a bitch and tell him to stop bitching. Where people get off acting like complete jerks online is beyond me.
If you sign a contract as an F visa holder and do the school a solid by covering since it can't find a replacement and then agree to sign a new contract that, as stated, is the same contract except for the length, you don't expect them to do things like completely remove vacation time etc.
Sure Suwon Fish should have double-checked to be safe but it has nothing to do with having an F visa or not. It's just a giant attempt at a rope-a-dope.
I'll give YTMND credit for being pretty damn good at it, though. Always writing replies that are juuuuuuuuuuuust enough out there to get long-winded, teeth-grinding responses. |
Oh I agree about YTMND's posting methods, they are just as you said. However, he did have a point, even if may have made that point by accident... |
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YTMND
Joined: 16 Jan 2012
Location: You're the man now dog!!
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| Posted: Wed Dec 26, 2012 3:16 pm Post subject: |
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| even if may have made that point by accident... |
Oh, now I am making good posts, but by accident? How do I do this in other languages? I need to tap into that ability next.  |
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joelove
Joined: 12 May 2011
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| Posted: Wed Dec 26, 2012 3:18 pm Post subject: |
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| Suwon Fish wrote: |
Yup I hear you, I've been here for 10 years and didn't think I'd fall into this trap either...
The contract changes are so subtle and sly I don't really feel bad about missing them.
After a good year with the company then bailing them out it never occured to me they'd sc#%w me over.
Crazy thing, they didn't tell me I wasn't getting national holidays or my paid vacation until two weeks before they want me to do 2 weeks of 10 hour days to "pay back" my national holidays and vacation. I.e. 50 hours of unpaid overtime.
You can imagine how amused I was ^^ |
They are being jerks, though you say it was a good year and just 2 months left, so I wouldn't fuss too much, but, paying back national holidays and vacation time that is all unpaid? That makes no sense. Isn't there a law about being paid for national holidays? They sound awfully stingy or ungrateful or broke. |
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Zyzyfer
Joined: 29 Jan 2003
Location: who, what, where, when, why, how?
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| Posted: Wed Dec 26, 2012 6:37 pm Post subject: |
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| YTMND wrote: |
No I don't. Vacation time is for people who will put time in before and after the vacation.
What logic are you using to justify vacation time after someone has extended a previous year's contract?
Let's simplify this. Let's say your employer wants you to work an extra week after a contract period. Should you get vacation time in relationship to this extra week? Why or why not?
Let's say you do something more reasonable and the school wants 1 more month. You extend it one month, does that mean you are expecting 83% of a day off? Let's say it's 1 day vacation time.
I get this figure by taking into account 10 vacation days per year and applying it to 1 month.
Show me your logic so I can see the error of my ways. I can't see how extending a visa contract entitles you to more vacation time unless you actually plan on returning to work after the vacation period.
That is the whole definition behind a vacation. Otherwise you would be leaving. Get it? |
What on earth are you on about? I think you should read the original post again. |
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