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aq8knyus
Joined: 28 Jul 2010
Location: London
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 Posted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 5:38 am Post subject: |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
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| It was clear from the OP that the problem was not communication as the nurses eventually understood, albeit with great difficulty |
Yes or no, did the OP possess any ability in Korean to express what he wanted?
Yes or no, did the OP attempt to communicate in the native language of the nurses?
Yes or no, did the OP ask for the correct test?
The answer to all of these is no, therefore clearly communication was at the core of things. If the OP has good ability to speak in Korean does this situation occur? If the OP asked for the general blood test (the correct test), rather than an AIDs test, does this occur?
Clearly the OP was getting a little agitated, is it possible that the nurses themselves were a little agitated as well? If they were, is it fair to solely blame them for the outcome?
The point isn't that the nurses were innocent, but rather they were not wholly guilty, nor is the OP a complete victim.
The reality is that the less ability you have to speak the native language of the country in which you are residing, the greater the chances for problems like this to occur, and one must be willing to accept their own responsibility and fault when these take place.
We're all foreign language teachers. Experience should prepare one for the fact that in such situations, voices tend to rise and speaking in low tones tends to not be good for understanding, and that a frequent reaction to the "Eureka!" of understanding someone is to say the word in a louder voice. There is a reason "Eureka!" always has an exclamation point.
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| You would expect it to be used or at least understood in the most basic sense. |
English here is to be appreciated, not expected.
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| How many take Korean or Arabic in school in the west? |
Fine, substitute French. A nice agitated Frenchman in your face getting upset with you that you don't speak French.
As for being stigmatized and making it about AIDs, the OP brought it upon himself. When I go in for my yearly physical, I treat it as a physical and I don't regard it as being stigmatized. The AIDs test is not the central focus when I go to the hospital. Heck, it's not even the central focus of the blood test. A simple change in mindset would have resulted in a completely different attempt to communicate what the OP was trying to get. |
1) Any ablility? He was eventually understood, so yes, evidently he did possess some ability to communicate in Korean.
2) Type in 에이즈 into naver and you will see it is used quite regularly. Obviously not the best way of saying it in Korean, but perfectly acceptable. Seeing as the nurses eventually understood it obviously worked.
3) No, but he was understood.
I dont want to even begin to go down into the rabbit hole of your 'Eureka' reasoning.
I'll finish with a Yes or No question of my own. Is it wrong for medical professionals to shout out in a room full of other people that the person standing in front of you wants an AIDS test? |
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mikesaidyes
Joined: 26 Apr 2011
Location: Sanbon, South Korea
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| Posted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 7:46 am Post subject: |
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Not quite acceptable for a visa test, BUT I HIGHLY recommend KHAP. Anonymous and fast HIV testing. I went today actually to the Seoul facility in Gireum. They also have one in Ansan.
Completely free and anonymous! I even got a nice MAC branded memory stick and stickynote pad as a gift haha! |
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nate1983
Joined: 30 Mar 2008
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| Posted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 1:47 pm Post subject: |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
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| It was clear from the OP that the problem was not communication as the nurses eventually understood, albeit with great difficulty |
Yes or no, did the OP possess any ability in Korean to express what he wanted?
Yes or no, did the OP attempt to communicate in the native language of the nurses?
Yes or no, did the OP ask for the correct test?
The answer to all of these is no, therefore clearly communication was at the core of things. If the OP has good ability to speak in Korean does this situation occur? If the OP asked for the general blood test (the correct test), rather than an AIDs test, does this occur? |
I speak far, far better Korean than you do, and I don't see what the situation has to do with a linguistic barrier. Get off your high horse. |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 3:21 pm Post subject: |
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1) Any ablility? He was eventually understood, so yes, evidently he did possess some ability to communicate in Korean.
2) Type in 에이즈 into naver and you will see it is used quite regularly. Obviously not the best way of saying it in Korean, but perfectly acceptable. Seeing as the nurses eventually understood it obviously worked.
3) No, but he was understood. |
1)Go back and read the story. No Korean was used. He tried writing 'HIV'
2)"Aidsuh" and "Testuh" are not communicating in the native language of the person. Good grief, we're teachers.
3)No, he wasn't understood. He was looking for the physical examination and blood test, not an AIDs test. Medically, the physical is far different from an AIDs test.
Are you seriously suggesting that there is no responsibility for this on his part? Is the OP that much of a helpless infant?
I'm fine with assigning some blame to the nurses, but the OP is in no way, shape, or form a complete victim. Sorry, but you can't wander about in a foreign country demanding services while speaking in English, expecting perfect understanding in English, and then complaining when after trying to communicate for 5 minutes someone blurts out an embarrassing English word, the very word you were trying to get them to understand.
And sorry, as for the whole "Nurses should understand English", that is soooo self-centered. Nurses should be concerned with studying nursing and providing care to the 99% of the population that can speak Korean, not rolling out the red carpet for NETs.
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| I'll finish with a Yes or No question of my own. Is it wrong for medical professionals to shout out in a room full of other people that the person standing in front of you wants an AIDS test? |
Let me put the question in its proper context, is it wrong, after spending 5-10 minutes trying to understand what the person is trying to say in English, that people who are no more fluent in English than the patient is in Korean and are living in Korea, blurt out the word that the patient is trying to get them to understand?
I'm not going to say it's okay, but I understand. And again, the OP is not without responsibility.
Instead of trying to get the nurses to understand English, maybe the OP should have taken some effort to try and understand Korean. Maybe the OP could have spent those 10 minutes looking at a dictionary or doing a Naver search for proper terms or calling his co-teacher on his cell phone.
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| I speak far, far better Korean than you do, and I don't see what the situation has to do with a linguistic barrier. |
You don't see how the OP's inability to ask for the proper test in Korean and going back and forth for 10 minutes resulted in the nurses blurting out AIDs when they finally understood what he was trying to say?
We've all had moments with Koreans where we try to understand each other. What is the natural reaction to that moment when you finally get it? You repeat the word or phrase in question, loudly, and in a tone that communicates understanding.
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| Get off your high horse. |
My advice to the OP and those that agree with his actions and stroll into places demanding service in English and then getting upset when things don't go well. |
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hiamnotcool
Joined: 06 Feb 2012
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| Posted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 4:10 pm Post subject: |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
I'm fine with assigning some blame to the nurses, but the OP is in no way, shape, or form a complete victim. Sorry, but you can't wander about in a foreign country demanding services while speaking in English, expecting perfect understanding in English, and then complaining when after trying to communicate for 5 minutes someone blurts out an embarrassing English word, the very word you were trying to get them to understand.
And sorry, as for the whole "Nurses should understand English", that is soooo self-centered. Nurses should be concerned with studying nursing and providing care to the 99% of the population that can speak Korean, not rolling out the red carpet for NETs.
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I don't see any excuse for making someone's personal information public as if they don't matter. It is unprofessional and stupid. Behavior like this will only encourage people to NOT get STD testing and that is a dangerous thing. I guess the OP is responsible for how long it took to convey the point, but OP is in no way responsible for how inconsiderate the nurses were with sensitive information.
And, the test is a requirement set by Korean immigration. Learning Korean is not a requirement set by immigration. Maybe it would make sense to accommodate the foreigners who are only doing what they have to do with some kind of system for the required health check. You know, make things faster? More efficient? Less humiliating and stigmatizing? Something like that.
I wish everyone in the friggin country had to get an annual STD test personally. |
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thatkidpercy
Joined: 05 Sep 2010
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| Posted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 4:34 pm Post subject: |
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@steelrails: Your posts are very entertaining. I can't believe anyone would go to such lengths to defend an obviously unprofessional incident unless they were doing it to wind the other person up.
I'd be very angry if I was in the same situation as the OP. Arguing about whether he should have used Korean is besides the point - no nurse in their right mind should announce to a room full of other patients that somebody is there for a HIV test (or... well, anything for that matter). I'm sure this kind of thing happens from time to time in the West too, and I'd be just as angry at home - language barrier or not, it was unacceptable.
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| We've all had moments with Koreans where we try to understand each other. What is the natural reaction to that moment when you finally get it? You repeat the word or phrase in question, loudly, and in a tone that communicates understanding. |
I'd like to think most people would have the self-awareness to not shout something out loud if it's sensitive. I certainly wouldn't.
I hate the over-generalising "Why do Koreans always..." type threads too, but it's okay to admit that even Koreans make mistakes sometimes - go ahead and try, it won't hurt!  |
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aq8knyus
Joined: 28 Jul 2010
Location: London
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| Posted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 4:39 pm Post subject: |
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