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Korean Job Discussion Forums "The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Teachers from Around the World!"
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Steelrails

Joined: 12 Mar 2009 Location: Earth, Solar System
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Posted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 9:45 pm Post subject: |
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Well, I'm not sure about Uni or H.S. jobs, but I can understand the hiring preference for women at the elementary school level.
Having seen various materials and lessons developed by female teachers vs. male, both from teachers I personally know and stuff posted on the net, there is a noticeable difference in quality. That's not to say every female teacher is better and that male teachers can't do those things well, but on average there is certainly a difference.
Go through waygook.org and look at the lesson plan materials. Look at ones posted by female teachers vs. male. Notice a trend?
Furthermore, the most offensive stuff I've seen has almost always come from male teachers.
Also, female teachers are in general able to better communicate, empathize, and show compassion to their students. Certainly they seem to generate more natural trust.
Also their ability to create well-designed, colorful, and quality hands on materials is noticeable. Men tend to take a more utilitarian view of hands-on materials, and their designs can be somewhat lacking in color and "zazz", which is important when dealing with young children.
Obviously these are very general things and there are countless exceptions on both sides, but I think one needs to consider those things.
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For all the complaining about sexist employers, boy some of the comments on this thread...oof.
Especially comments like "women are more easily bullied and manipulated". Is it really that? Maybe there's a flip side- women are more sensible when it comes to receiving instruction and are more willing to develop themselves. They are more apt to promote a cooperative workplace. To say nothing of the fact that plenty of women are confrontational and stand up for themselves. Plenty of theories on how women are inherently at a disadvantage but not any when it comes to men (except juvenile comments about T&A).
But guys, come on, are there any shortcomings we may have? Maybe its in how we are less apt to notice certain things or empathize or our linguistic abilities are on average lower than women's. Our lack of skill in fine motor skills? Lack of experience in things that might be conducive to young children's education? |
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edwardcatflap
Joined: 22 Mar 2009
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Posted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 10:25 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
Well, I'm not sure about Uni or H.S. jobs, but I can understand the hiring preference for women at the elementary school level.
Having seen various materials and lessons developed by female teachers vs. male, both from teachers I personally know and stuff posted on the net, there is a noticeable difference in quality. That's not to say every female teacher is better and that male teachers can't do those things well, but on average there is certainly a difference.
Go through waygook.org and look at the lesson plan materials. Look at ones posted by female teachers vs. male. Notice a trend?
Furthermore, the most offensive stuff I've seen has almost always come from male teachers.
Also, female teachers are in general able to better communicate, empathize, and show compassion to their students. Certainly they seem to generate more natural trust.
Also their ability to create well-designed, colorful, and quality hands on materials is noticeable. Men tend to take a more utilitarian view of hands-on materials, and their designs can be somewhat lacking in color and "zazz", which is important when dealing with young children.
Obviously these are very general things and there are countless exceptions on both sides, but I think one needs to consider those things.
===============================================
For all the complaining about sexist employers, boy some of the comments on this thread...oof.
Especially comments like "women are more easily bullied and manipulated". Is it really that? Maybe there's a flip side- women are more sensible when it comes to receiving instruction and are more willing to develop themselves. They are more apt to promote a cooperative workplace. To say nothing of the fact that plenty of women are confrontational and stand up for themselves. Plenty of theories on how women are inherently at a disadvantage but not any when it comes to men (except juvenile comments about T&A).
But guys, come on, are there any shortcomings we may have? Maybe its in how we are less apt to notice certain things or empathize or our linguistic abilities are on average lower than women's. Our lack of skill in fine motor skills? Lack of experience in things that might be conducive to young children's education |
You may have a point about kindergarten teachers but as you say, there are countless exceptions on both sides. Smart employers know this and are open to applications from both sexes. They should be able to wheedle out the duds of either sex during the application process. The ones that advertise 'females only' give the impression they are bowing to their own or others (the parents') prejudices. Or have another agenda |
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PatrickGHBusan
Joined: 24 Jun 2008 Location: Busan (1997-2008) Canada 2008 -
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Posted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 4:49 am Post subject: |
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The point Ed makes about impressions is quite valid.
However, elementary schools typically prefer to hire female teachers. This is for many reasons, namely appearances with parents, the "motherly" instinct with young kids and so on.
Men are not perceived the same way when it comes to teaching young learners and that is too bad because balance is necessary there!
As an aside, my son's kindergarten in Korea was fully staffed with female teachers (2 foreign women were part of the staff).
My son's current elementary school in Canada is staffed at about 90% by female teachers. The only male teachers are for Phys Ed and French. The school tries to hire male teachers but has a hard time finding any. Kind of a traditional thing I suppose.
I would think it would cost schools nothing to forgo asking for female applicants and then just apply an internal screening process with applicants and select only female teachers. That at the very least would avoid the bad appearance issue and it happens all the time with hiring processes. |
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Stan Rogers
Joined: 20 Aug 2010
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Posted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 5:25 am Post subject: |
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| They should be sued for discrimination against men. |
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PatrickGHBusan
Joined: 24 Jun 2008 Location: Busan (1997-2008) Canada 2008 -
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Posted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 7:31 am Post subject: |
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| Stan Rogers wrote: |
| They should be sued for discrimination against men. |
Cost vs reward...won't happen sadly. |
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transmogrifier
Joined: 02 Jan 2012 Location: Seoul, South Korea
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Posted: Fri Apr 12, 2013 1:51 am Post subject: |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
Well, I'm not sure about Uni or H.S. jobs, but I can understand the hiring preference for women at the elementary school level.
Having seen various materials and lessons developed by female teachers vs. male, both from teachers I personally know and stuff posted on the net, there is a noticeable difference in quality. That's not to say every female teacher is better and that male teachers can't do those things well, but on average there is certainly a difference. |
Having worked in a high school back home, I can say that the above generalization is total crap. |
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Weigookin74
Joined: 26 Oct 2009
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Posted: Fri Apr 12, 2013 5:51 pm Post subject: |
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| Time to get that sex change, rib removal, dye your hair blond, and get blue eyed contacts. Ha ha.... |
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Weigookin74
Joined: 26 Oct 2009
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Posted: Fri Apr 12, 2013 6:02 pm Post subject: |
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| PatrickGHBusan wrote: |
The point Ed makes about impressions is quite valid.
However, elementary schools typically prefer to hire female teachers. This is for many reasons, namely appearances with parents, the "motherly" instinct with young kids and so on.
Men are not perceived the same way when it comes to teaching young learners and that is too bad because balance is necessary there!
As an aside, my son's kindergarten in Korea was fully staffed with female teachers (2 foreign women were part of the staff).
My son's current elementary school in Canada is staffed at about 90% by female teachers. The only male teachers are for Phys Ed and French. The school tries to hire male teachers but has a hard time finding any. Kind of a traditional thing I suppose.
I would think it would cost schools nothing to forgo asking for female applicants and then just apply an internal screening process with applicants and select only female teachers. That at the very least would avoid the bad appearance issue and it happens all the time with hiring processes. |
Never steriotype. I did a semester of public school kindergarden in my old rural town. Some ajossi principals hated my being a man and couldn't wait to get rid of me. Even when I taught regular elementary schools too. But, pre recession Korea meant not enough English teachers so they had to take what they could get. Otherwise, I would suspect that the local ed office would have sent a female foriegner if they could have. There was only one woman, but she was 59 at the time and crabby (grumpy).
Anyways, after much skepticism, the kids and parents all loved me because I was energetic. I remembered some little Korean girls in elementary telling me in broken English: "Teacher! You comedy!!" I was a man around 30 at the time. Broke all the steriotypes.
But in my new town, seems men are mostly assigned to middle schools and women mostly assigned to elementary schools. Shame as I like elementary better because the kids were more excitable and energetic.
As I was leaving my old town, the recession took hold and there were younger foriegn women there during my last few months. New guys sent to middle school and women sent to elementary. I was the exception due to my past reputation. Anyhow, seemed to me some of these women weren't that loving towards the kids and seemed more interested in going to Seoul to drink on the weekends. I had to visit some of these schools I had previously taught at for the local ed office. Whenever I went back, the kids were more excited to see me than the new female teachers.
My point is you can't steriotype. Some people are good with kids and some aren't. (No, I'm not a girly man or anything like that. I think I have a silly, goofy, and energetic side maybe?) So, women are not always best with kids even if they may be better more often than men. But, there's no absolute rule. Never steriotype. |
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Weigookin74
Joined: 26 Oct 2009
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Posted: Fri Apr 12, 2013 6:05 pm Post subject: |
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| Though I stress some ajossi principals prob hated my talking to Korean female teachers too. May have been part of wanting to get rid of me. Lol. But the ed office had the power. In GEPIK, it's the local school principals from what I hear? (Just curious.) |
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MUOhio82
Joined: 25 Apr 2008
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Posted: Fri Apr 12, 2013 6:14 pm Post subject: |
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Where are all these jobs for women only?!
I'm blonde, blue eyed, almost 6 feet tall and can't even get a return email from anyone?!
Help a woman out! |
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World Traveler
Joined: 29 May 2009
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Posted: Fri Apr 12, 2013 8:42 pm Post subject: |
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The good jobs are out there for you, MUOhio82. Keep looking and don't give up hope! 화이팅!
| NYC_Gal 2.0 wrote: |
| Nearly every university lists a MA as a requirement. That being said, many of those same universities will hire people without a MA. |
| NYC_Gal 2.0 wrote: |
| I don't have a completed MA degree, which was a requirement. |
| NYC_Gal 2.0 wrote: |
| I get paid more than 3 million won a month, have 15 hours of work a week, and 5 months of paid vacation |
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PatrickGHBusan
Joined: 24 Jun 2008 Location: Busan (1997-2008) Canada 2008 -
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Posted: Sat Apr 13, 2013 2:57 am Post subject: |
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Weigookin74,
You are right that this is not some hard rule. It just tends to happen that way sometimes. |
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PatrickGHBusan
Joined: 24 Jun 2008 Location: Busan (1997-2008) Canada 2008 -
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Posted: Sat Apr 13, 2013 2:57 am Post subject: |
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| World Traveler wrote: |
The good jobs are out there for you, MUOhio82. Keep looking and don't give up hope! 화이팅!
| NYC_Gal 2.0 wrote: |
| Nearly every university lists a MA as a requirement. That being said, many of those same universities will hire people without a MA. |
| NYC_Gal 2.0 wrote: |
| I don't have a completed MA degree, which was a requirement. |
| NYC_Gal 2.0 wrote: |
| I get paid more than 3 million won a month, have 15 hours of work a week, and 5 months of paid vacation |
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Last she said, NYCGal works in a Hakwon WT... |
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World Traveler
Joined: 29 May 2009
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Posted: Sat Apr 13, 2013 4:09 am Post subject: |
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| Last month she left the job at the kids hagwon and entered the sweet university position. I am jealous. |
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sluggo832004
Joined: 04 Sep 2010
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Posted: Sat Apr 13, 2013 4:23 am Post subject: |
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| World Traveler wrote: |
| Last month she left the job at the kids hagwon and entered the sweet university position. I am jealous. |
Is this a goverment funded uni? or a private?
I heard privates pay more, but its more of a hassle. |
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