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Korean Job Discussion Forums
"The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Teachers from Around the World!"
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Scorpion
Joined: 15 Apr 2012
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 Posted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 6:10 pm Post subject: |
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It's astonishing that Koreans can be so hypersensitive to any perceived insult to them (however small), yet feel completely at ease depicting ESL teachers here (all with at least one university degree) as drug addicted, aids infected rapists and paedophiles with forged degrees. That doesn't seem to offend any section of Korean society. But a foreign executive gets off the plane in Seoul with his tie undone, well that's just a premediated insult to every Korean ever born.
Just another reason why, outside of work, I have as little to do with Koreans as humanly possible. Honestly, sometimes it feels like I'm living on a different planet, not just another country.
Now back to composing my 'white face only' ad for my new hogwan.
This is one freaky place. |
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KimchiNinja
Joined: 01 May 2012
Location: Gangnam
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| Posted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 6:45 pm Post subject: |
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Bill was here representing some of our ventures. Without getting into details I think it's important to note we are here asking them for investment capital. When you go asking people for millions of dollars you 1) "suit up", 2) learn something about the local customs, and 3) learn about who you are meeting.
Unfortunately Americans don't seem to give this much thought. Plus Seattle tech people are infamous for being casual, wearing jeans to the office, having facial hair, putting their feet up on the table, swearing in meetings, drooling, and numerous other things which are cool in Seattle, but not so cool in Asia. 
Anyhow, I've been telling our guys for years they ought to get briefed before doing meetings in Asia, never happens though. |
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hellofaniceguy
Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Location: On your computer screen!
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| Posted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 6:49 pm Post subject: |
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Who gives a rat's rear end about a hand shake! Except the korean cry babies
who have nothing else better to do with their time!
And I see a whole lot of disrespecting going on in korea as it is between koreans!
I suppose respect means red light districts? Massage places? Buy me drinkee bars? Barber shops? Love hotels? Coffee shop gals? Yep...a whole lot of shaking going on in them places!
Gates has been shaking hands the same way for many years..and I don't see or hear other countries crying like babies! |
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Who's Your Daddy?
Joined: 30 May 2010
Location: Victoria, Canada.
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optik404
Joined: 24 Jun 2008
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| Posted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 6:58 pm Post subject: |
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| Lots of Bill Gates Apologists itt |
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EZE
Joined: 05 May 2012
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| Posted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 7:08 pm Post subject: |
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| KimchiNinja wrote: |
| Without getting into details I think it's important to note we are here asking them for investment capital. When you go asking people for millions of dollars |
Park asked Gates to come and help give her ideas and advice on how to make Korea's economy "creative." |
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Smithington
Joined: 14 Dec 2011
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| Posted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 7:30 pm Post subject: |
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Forget about the handshake. I want to know what Gates thought about Park's table manners (not to mention the snorting, hacking and grunting made by her male cabinet members.) Now that's something I'd be interested in hearing about. Koreans lecturing others about their 'bad manners' always makes me cringe. Are they so unaware of how primitive and vulgar their manners appear to others?
Oops, have to go. Eating lunch; need to go empty my nostrils into the nearest ashtay.  |
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KimchiNinja
Joined: 01 May 2012
Location: Gangnam
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| Posted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 7:36 pm Post subject: |
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| EZE wrote: |
| KimchiNinja wrote: |
| Without getting into details I think it's important to note we are here asking them for investment capital. When you go asking people for millions of dollars |
Park asked Gates to come and help give her ideas and advice on how to make Korea's economy "creative." |
He gets booked for misc meetings while here, but primarily here asking Koreans for hundreds of millions. Although the Park meeting is just "because he was in the neighborhood", public relations are important in raising the capital, especially in Korea. |
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hiamnotcool
Joined: 06 Feb 2012
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| Posted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 7:40 pm Post subject: |
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| everything-is-everything wrote: |
| hiamnotcool wrote: |
| It's unprofessional, and from what I perceive he is just a rich guy that doesn't care if he offends an entire country. |
There's numerous photos of Gates with his hand in his pocket.
Again, it's a sign of social insecurity. |
If you read the article it states that he greeted Lee Myung Bak with both hands. Who knows why that happened, maybe Lee Myung Bak has a helper go around and tell all the foreigners what's up so they don't have to worry about this crap happening.
It isn't a perceived insult either, it is an actual insult in Korea. Korean etiquette is a lot different than American etiquette. How to greet someone is some of the most basic information to get before you travel abroad. Bill Gates is a smart guy, I think he knows that. I don't think he was trying to insult anybody though, I just don't think he cares enough to find out. It was an inconsiderate move, that's all. If he did care it would be as easy as saying something on twitter or in an interview about how he didn't know. I doubt he will though because he's rich and just doesn't care. He's doing better than I am, maybe I should start greeting people with one hand here too.
Even if he has aspergers he could have his PR guys just release some information and make this all better.
Again though, I think the western media is blowing this out of proportion. I imagine most Korean people saw that picture and just figured it was another nerdy white guy lost in Korea.
I do agree the double standard about manners is annoying. It drives me crazy. |
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cabeza
Joined: 29 Sep 2012
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| Posted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 7:49 pm Post subject: |
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| hiamnotcool wrote: |
| everything-is-everything wrote: |
| hiamnotcool wrote: |
| It's unprofessional, and from what I perceive he is just a rich guy that doesn't care if he offends an entire country. |
There's numerous photos of Gates with his hand in his pocket.
Again, it's a sign of social insecurity. |
If you read the article it states that he greeted Lee Myung Bak with both hands. Who knows why that happened, maybe Lee Myung Bak has a helper go around and tell all the foreigners what's up so they don't have to worry about this crap happening. |
You are the second person who said this. It doesn't say that.
Its says he greeted Kim Dae jung with the double hander, but Lee Myung Bak with a single hander. Which apparently pissed people off as well. |
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cj1976
Joined: 26 Oct 2005
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| Posted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 8:06 pm Post subject: |
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| I wonder how many of these netizens complaining over the handshake with Park Geun-Hye actually voted for her? I seem to remember her being quite unpopular. |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 8:26 pm Post subject: |
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| Smithington wrote: |
Forget about the handshake. I want to know what Gates thought about Park's table manners (not to mention the snorting, hacking and grunting made by her male cabinet members.) Now that's something I'd be interested in hearing about. Koreans lecturing others about their 'bad manners' always makes me cringe. Are they so unaware of how primitive and vulgar their manners appear to others?
Oops, have to go. Eating lunch; need to go empty my nostrils into the nearest ashtay. |
Dude, there's a difference between the political classes and Kim 6 Pack who is at the local greasy chopstick.
Most of my Korean friends who were born in Korea that I knew in the States (and thus came from more well-to-do sectors of Korean society had vastly different manners and customs and were rather keen about minding local manners as well. A Koreatown might be a bit different as you are apt to get more shopkeeper types. A great many of them had lived from country to country and would put you to shame in a French restaurant. Eating Korean meals is similar, much more formal and sterile than over here.
Seriously, I love the NETs who come here and act like Emily Post when they have a chance to critique Korean manners, but if anyone points at them or their boss asks them to tuck their shirt in or not chew a pencil, they moan about how uptight the place is. Clearly its not about casual vs. formal, it's about whether the party involved is Korean, in which case, they are wrong because they are Korean.
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| That doesn't seem to offend any section of Korean society. |
Do you really think that's what Korean society thinks of us and you? Please. That's like saying that every white person thinks black people are all gang-bangers who go home and listen to rap, eat fried chicken, and have spent time in jail.
The overwhelming majority of white people don't think all black folks are like that and the overwhelming majority of Koreans don't think you're a pedophile on drugs. They just want to be very vigilant at keeping that small minority out.
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| Now back to composing my 'white face only' ad for my new hogwan. |
The hagwon you own? Or work for?
============================================
In the end though, the bottom line is Bill Gates didn't mean to do crap. He's a nerd. What do you expect? Spit & Polish? Let a nerd be a nerd.
That and bring back some manners into all society and culture. Greater standards, more formality. Respect royalty and heads of state. Don't boo Maggie Thatcher's hearse no matter how much you disagree with her. Act with dignity. |
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KimchiNinja
Joined: 01 May 2012
Location: Gangnam
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| Posted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 8:26 pm Post subject: |
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| cabeza wrote: |
| Its says he greeted Kim Dae jung with the double hander, but Lee Myung Bak with a single hander. Which apparently pissed people off as well. |
Oops, double hand for the man-leader, but woman-leader gets the single hand. That's a double insult. |
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Fox
Joined: 04 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 8:42 pm Post subject: |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
| Respect royalty and heads of state. Don't boo Maggie Thatcher's hearse no matter how much you disagree with her. Act with dignity. |
Let's hold on here. I think there needs to be a clear dividing line between royalty and heads of state. Royalty serves as a kind of reification of the broader culture into a concrete human being, while elected heads of state are generally almost the opposite: a manifestation of the lowest common denominator in society's broader culture, the person least disliked out of the choices available by 50% + 1 of the population. To simply lump these two groups together seems absurd. Sure, be polite to the Queen of England, because for better or worse she is a manifestation of broader British culture. Margaret Thatcher, on the other hand, was a petty elected official seeking to use majority support to strong-arm specific societal policies, so she deserves whatever treatment she earns in pursuit of those policies, be it applause or spittle. |
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Died By Bear
Joined: 13 Jul 2010
Location: On the big lake they call Gitche Gumee
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| Posted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 9:03 pm Post subject: |
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| Well at least he didn't slap her head with a magazine and demand a better bowl of ramen. |
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