Site Search:
 
Speak Korean Now!
Teach English Abroad and Get Paid to see the World!
Korean Job Discussion Forums Forum Index Korean Job Discussion Forums
"The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Teachers from Around the World!"
 
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

Cohiba's rule, revisited
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Korean Job Discussion Forums Forum Index -> General Discussion Forum
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Otherside



Joined: 06 Sep 2007

PostPosted: Wed May 29, 2013 7:24 pm    Post subject: Re: Cohiba's rule, revisited Reply with quote

Underwaterbob wrote:
toby99 wrote:
I, unfortunately, live near Seoul where the FFF factor
is almost in the negative range. I know!"


I've always been confused by this. Isn't it the nearer you are to Seoul, the higher the FFF factor? Also, an inverse equation (1/distance) never goes negative unless you are an actual negative distance (impossible) away from Seoul. The sad math was really unnecessary.

But yeah, this was only slightly more relevant fifteen years ago, and still then only applied to those who absolutely require immediate access to western amenities to get by: People who probably shouldn't have left their home country to begin with.


True, the math is faulty, but the rule never was really about the math.

Having lived in a few major cities in Gyeonggi as well as Seoul there is quite a difference. There's always a reason to go to Seoul, not so much to go elsewhere.
Would like a choice of more than 3 expat bars/clubs/hangout - need to go to Seoul.
Want to try some different food - need to go to Seoul.
Want to join that club that's focused on some obscure interest? - Need to go to Seoul.
Want to join pretty much any club (in English) - need to go to Seoul.
Want to go for a big night on the town? - Need to go to Seoul.

Depending on you, these may or may not be important. For me, living in Suwon was just fine, and everything was just a short trip away. The only time living outside of Seoul was a major hassle, was to go out at night. Having a "curfew" or being forced to pay a big amount wasn't great.

That being said, Seoul offers more than anywhere else in Korea (ignoring nature, and things like the beach etc), most Koreans would live there if they had the choice, as would most foreigners. If I was offered the same job, with the same salary, and the same quality of housing at the same price, I'd move to Seoul tomorrow, I'd wager most others would do the same.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
ttompatz



Joined: 05 Sep 2005
Location: Kwangju, South Korea

PostPosted: Wed May 29, 2013 7:49 pm    Post subject: Re: Cohiba's rule, revisited Reply with quote

Otherside wrote:
If I was offered the same job, with the same salary, and the same quality of housing at the same price, I'd move to Seoul tomorrow, I'd wager most others would do the same.


Given all... Bundang (Seohyun) is nicer than most of Seoul, has virtually all the amenities one could want and with transportation what it is.. not that inconvenient.

The biggest problem for most newbs (and even those who have been here a while and haven't learned to read yet) is that they don't know what they are missing locally and unless they have a great connection to a Korean, never do figure out what is on their doorstep.

.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Otherside



Joined: 06 Sep 2007

PostPosted: Wed May 29, 2013 8:02 pm    Post subject: Re: Cohiba's rule, revisited Reply with quote

ttompatz wrote:
Otherside wrote:
If I was offered the same job, with the same salary, and the same quality of housing at the same price, I'd move to Seoul tomorrow, I'd wager most others would do the same.


Given all... Bundang (Seohyun) is nicer than most of Seoul, has virtually all the amenities one could want and with transportation what it is.. not that inconvenient.

The biggest problem for most newbs (and even those who have been here a while and haven't learned to read yet) is that they don't know what they are missing locally and unless they have a great connection to a Korean, never do figure out what is on their doorstep.

.


Yes, Seohyun is very nice. Younger folks might prefer closer access to Itaewon or Hongdae, but I see where you're coming from. But we're talking very broad generalizations here, so there may be a few exceptions. In my case, I would take living in Suwon (by the station and a 20minute train ride to Seoul) over living in say Dobong-gu. But ignoring a few cherry-picked locations (a single dong in a single gu, of an otherwise very average place), the value of Seoul still stands.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
atwood



Joined: 26 Dec 2009

PostPosted: Wed May 29, 2013 8:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ttompatz wrote:
I have lived in Seohyun (Bundang-gu, Seongnam and communted to Gwangju, Gyeonggi for work) and Northern Suwon (about 750 yards from Namun) and have never lacked for western amenities, conveniences or nightlife.

The rule might be relevant out in places that are truly rural (the southwest or north east coast) but not in the majority of the satellite cites of any of the major cities in Korea.

Even at that, transportation in Korea is excellent and you are never more than 90 minutes from a major center. It often takes longer to commute across Seoul (even by subway) than it takes to get into central Seoul from some outlying districts. Learn to read the sides of buses.

.

Bundang may as well be Seoul. It's an expensive suburb of Seoul which Koreans used to describe as the place in Korea closest to heaven.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
bossface



Joined: 05 Aug 2006

PostPosted: Wed May 29, 2013 8:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I agree on the Bundang stuff. I lived there for a month, and it was way easier to get to Gangnam or even Itaewon than when I lived in Nowon.

People keep missing the point on this Caffe Bene Factor. I am in no way praising Caffe Bene itself, I am just saying that it stands as a harbinger of civilization. If you live near a Caffe Bene, there will be interesting bars and restaurants near you. If not, there probably won't be.

I live in Cheonan now, yes, near a Caffe Bene, which means I live in one of the more interesting parts of Cheonan. My hood is Wehgook dull compared to the cool parts of Seoul, but it is a more interesting and convenient place to live than some of the outer gu in Seoul.


figshdg - what city were you just outside?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
3DR



Joined: 24 May 2009

PostPosted: Thu May 30, 2013 12:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have lived in Suwon and Incheon, and visit Seoul pretty frequently. Couldn't live there though.

I have friends from Daejeon and could easily live there.

Seoul does have mostly everything one could want, but if what you need are western restaurants, good supermarket like homeplus, electronics markets, etc, you can find those in pretty much every medium to large city in Korea now.

Only visit Seoul for the museums, big events, etc.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
dairyairy



Joined: 17 May 2012
Location: South Korea

PostPosted: Thu May 30, 2013 12:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Things are clearly better than they once were, that's for sure. Having a store like Costco in some locations outside of the Seoul area does make a big difference in certain places. Plus, the larger outlets around Korea do help with shopping choices. But when you get down to it, for shopping, it's still the Seoul area that is the clear winner.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
yellowdove



Joined: 19 Aug 2009

PostPosted: Thu May 30, 2013 4:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Every place in Korea has its pros and cons. I've lived in three different cities (clearly listed under my username) and I've liked each one of them for different reasons.

Daejeon is great if you want to see the country because it's smack in the middle. A wonderful transportation hub. Really great expats as well, with a very active facebook group (perfect for noobs).

Masan was nice because it was quieter, had a decent expat community, and attached to two different cities, each having its own flavour. Plus, its super close to Busan, and nice and close to a fairly major airport.

Seoul has many things to keep you busy, and nice shopping, but unless you manage to find a decent group of friends here you're going to be lonely. I know plenty of people who have left Seoul because they found the expat community to be cold and unwelcoming.

I have a difficult time trying to pick my favourite place to live out of the three. Masan would probably be my least favourite, just because it is so small, but between Daejeon and Seoul it really is a toss-up.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
PatrickGHBusan



Joined: 24 Jun 2008
Location: Busan (1997-2008) Canada 2008 -

PostPosted: Thu May 30, 2013 5:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That rule may have had partial validity 10 years ago and even then it was kind of dumb.

Now with the KTX, online access to almost everything (ex: gmarket) Costco and the diversification of other cities in terms of offerings, that rule has become a sad little joke.

I for one would choose to live in Busan everytime over Seoul. No contest.

Seoul does have a lot to offer but other areas of Korea too and this all depends on each person and their preferences I think. A couple we know just bought an apt in Jeju and are moving there. It suits them. I would not move there but visiting is a lot of fun.

Busan has everything I need and living there again would be no problem.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
dairyairy



Joined: 17 May 2012
Location: South Korea

PostPosted: Thu May 30, 2013 5:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

PatrickGHBusan wrote:
That rule may have had partial validity 10 years ago and even then it was kind of dumb.

Now with the KTX, online access to almost everything (ex: gmarket) Costco and the diversification of other cities in terms of offerings, that rule has become a sad little joke.

I for one would choose to live in Busan everytime over Seoul. No contest.

Seoul does have a lot to offer but other areas of Korea too and this all depends on each person and their preferences I think. A couple we know just bought an apt in Jeju and are moving there. It suits them. I would not move there but visiting is a lot of fun.

Busan has everything I need and living there again would be no problem.


It all depends on what you are looking for and if you are married to a Korean and have a car. Those who claim that it's all the same are more likely to be married to a Korean and also are more likely to own cars. They are not typical teachers. Their situation is different and, obviously, they should be more able to adapt to living in 100% Korea.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
cdninkorea



Joined: 27 Jan 2006
Location: Seoul

PostPosted: Thu May 30, 2013 7:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I suppose this isn't an issue for most on this forum, but cost of property is a major consideration for people like me (married, planning on being here for the medium term at least). In Busan, a Xii apartment (with an ocean view) sells for around 300 million won. By contrast, 300 million isn't even nearly enough for jeonsae at a Xii apartment anywhere in Seoul, let alone in the city centre (we looked long and hard for a decent place with a 100 million won jeonsae).

If 300 million buys you an apartment in one of the nicest apartment complexes in Busan, a decent apartment must be downright affordable. And that's Korea's second largest city, by no means a backwater country town. Imagine what a luxury apartment in Daegu or Gwangju goes for!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
12ax7



Joined: 07 Nov 2009

PostPosted: Thu May 30, 2013 7:34 am    Post subject: Re: Cohiba's rule, revisited Reply with quote

ttompatz wrote:


The biggest problem for most newbs (and even those who have been here a while and haven't learned to read yet) is that they don't know what they are missing locally and unless they have a great connection to a Korean, never do figure out what is on their doorstep.

.



Bingo! When friends from Seoul come over for a visit, they are baffled by the exquisite dining experiences available to us. How many restaurants in Seoul grow their own ingredients?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
12ax7



Joined: 07 Nov 2009

PostPosted: Thu May 30, 2013 7:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

dairyairy wrote:
PatrickGHBusan wrote:
That rule may have had partial validity 10 years ago and even then it was kind of dumb.

Now with the KTX, online access to almost everything (ex: gmarket) Costco and the diversification of other cities in terms of offerings, that rule has become a sad little joke.

I for one would choose to live in Busan everytime over Seoul. No contest.

Seoul does have a lot to offer but other areas of Korea too and this all depends on each person and their preferences I think. A couple we know just bought an apt in Jeju and are moving there. It suits them. I would not move there but visiting is a lot of fun.

Busan has everything I need and living there again would be no problem.


It all depends on what you are looking for and if you are married to a Korean and have a car. Those who claim that it's all the same are more likely to be married to a Korean and also are more likely to own cars. They are not typical teachers. Their situation is different and, obviously, they should be more able to adapt to living in 100% Korea.


Actually, I've been to Busan as a visitor and I thought it was far nicer than Seoul.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
12ax7



Joined: 07 Nov 2009

PostPosted: Thu May 30, 2013 7:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

dairyairy wrote:
Things are clearly better than they once were, that's for sure. Having a store like Costco in some locations outside of the Seoul area does make a big difference in certain places. Plus, the larger outlets around Korea do help with shopping choices. But when you get down to it, for shopping, it's still the Seoul area that is the clear winner.


I've been here so long that I remember when even the grocery stores in Seoul were nothing to get excited about. So, I laugh when people here try to pretend that their inability to adapt to life in Korea outside of Seoul is anything but their own fault.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Died By Bear



Joined: 13 Jul 2010
Location: On the big lake they call Gitche Gumee

PostPosted: Thu May 30, 2013 7:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cohiba's Rule T-Shirts now available. 100% Dry Fit soft cotton material with a shillouette of Cohiba hitting the ball out of the park, very nice soft grey or darker grey colors on red lettering. 21.99 includes shipping, order now before we run out.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Korean Job Discussion Forums Forum Index -> General Discussion Forum All times are GMT - 8 Hours
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6  Next
Page 2 of 6

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


This page is maintained by the one and only Dave Sperling.
Contact Dave's ESL Cafe
Copyright © 2018 Dave Sperling. All Rights Reserved.

Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2002 phpBB Group

TEFL International Supports Dave's ESL Cafe
TEFL Courses, TESOL Course, English Teaching Jobs - TEFL International