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12ax7
Joined: 07 Nov 2009
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 Posted: Sat Sep 07, 2013 1:49 am Post subject: |
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| Swampfox10mm wrote: |
| 12ax7 wrote: |
| Swampfox10mm wrote: |
| 12ax7 wrote: |
| Swampfox10mm wrote: |
| JMO wrote: |
| So, I guess no one actually knows if there will be a law put into place then.. |
Well, at our uni, our boss made it sound like schools are being cautioned that this will become law sometime soon, as if telling them they should not hire people without at least an MA from now. Perhaps the thought is that people currently on staff with BA'S will gain enough experience in time for the law, but any new BA hires might not have enough time to gain the required experience, and could suddenly find themselves unhireable for their next contract. |
What does that mean? That the MA requirement would be waved if a person has university experience or that they will allow people to get an MA before a certain deadline (which may be when the law comes into effect)? |
After reviewing the original e-mail from my boss, it appears my above statement may be incorrect/confusing -- meaning they are open to hire BA's with at least 4 years of uni experience. Not just MA's with 2 years exp.
At our school, we were told by our boss that we will only hire MA+2 years uni experience, or BA+4 years uni experience. |
Just as I thought: it won't change. If it did, they'd have to pay foreigners with MAs and PhDs the equivalent of what they pay their Korean colleagues, and give them the same benefits on top of that (fully paid sabbaticals, anyone?). |
Went out with some waygook coworkers last night. One is in another department. She heard that the Korean professors have had their wages frozen for some time, but that the salaries of the foreign professors need to change. She made it sound like they are going to be raised, although I shouldn't have assumed, and asked for some clarification. I'm sure she would have said so, had it been their plan to lower our pay -- that would be highly strange. I wouldn't be surprised to see them raise our wages a bit. |
And I'd be surprised if that happens at my current job. |
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Jimskins
Joined: 07 Nov 2007
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| Posted: Fri Sep 13, 2013 3:49 am Post subject: |
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| Swampfox10mm wrote: |
| Jimskins wrote: |
| 12ax7 wrote: |
| timhorton wrote: |
| Weigookin74 wrote: |
| Will they give you a big pay raise to match that education requirement? I wouldn't take on all that "Master's" debt just to make a big whopping 2.0 Mil. Seems the costs don't equal the means. But, then again, there's a sucker born every minute. |
Speaking from experience: If you are smart and find a low cost masters with flexibility...you can greatly improve your quality of life from a PS (or Hokwon) to UNI. It's not for lazy people though - it takes energy/time/initiative.
So YES a masters is VERY worth it! |
Depends which you get. You'd better skip the online only universities that spit out MAs after just 18 months of part-time study, without even requiring their students to write research papers and a thesis. They aren't good value for the money. Tuition is very high and few employers take those degrees seriously. |
Very true. At a recent department meeting at my uni we were told that the 'higher ups' do not like online or distance-learning MAs. And athough they won't fire those people at our uni who have nearly completed theirs, they shouldnt expect a payrise like other 'bricks and mortar' MAs. And this is at one of the if not the best uni jobs in Seoul. |
Funny. This is what we call "talking out of your..."
I'd like to know:
1. Which university this is.
2. Who said it, so I can verify it.
If you'd like to keep it to PM so that you can keep your privacy, I have no problems with that.
On a further note, a friend of mine used to work at Konkuk university, and years ago, the director there told him that she refused to hire bald men. They did, however, seem to find it in themselves to higher a bellhop from NY with a fake BA, a fake MA, and a fake Ph.D, who took them for in excess of 70 million won in false publishing to his own fake website. Then, when they entered his apartment, they found he was growing a great deal of weed, which was very much NOT fake. And after that situation, kiddies, we now need all of our degrees verified.
http://www.koreaherald.com/view.php?ud=20050115000034
http://www.zoominfo.com/p/Hector-Ramos/641571628
So, I wouldn't consider the individual hiring practice of a Korean university to be indicative of what happens elsewhere.
Likewise...
We see this kind of crap post (often lacking in any proof) from teachers who have a traditional MA, and are upset that their lives are being upended (or they are in fear of them being upended) because they now have much more, and often younger, competition. |
Sorry it took a bit of time to reply, I was waiting for something in writing to confirm what was said in the meeting. I have it now. Our uni has decided not to recognize any distance-learning degrees from now on. Those already in / completing an online/distance degree are now asking if this means that they wil not be renewed. No answer yet. |
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Swampfox10mm
Joined: 24 Mar 2011
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| Posted: Fri Sep 13, 2013 5:45 am Post subject: |
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Please send me a name or two behind this. I would like to publish some articles about it, both locally and abroad, and will be asking them to go on-record about why they chose to go this route.
Seeing as I do not work for your school, I may be able to dig deeper, and without fear of retribution.
Very interesting, as they seem to be going against what is accepted by higher-ranked schools, here and abroad.
I have a strong suspicion that this "policy" will disappear very quickly, with a little press.
Last edited by Swampfox10mm on Fri Sep 13, 2013 5:52 am; edited 1 time in total |
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I'm With You
Joined: 01 Sep 2011
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| Posted: Fri Sep 13, 2013 5:46 am Post subject: |
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| Jimskins wrote: |
| Our uni has decided not to recognize any distance-learning degrees from now on. Those already in / completing an online/distance degree are now asking if this means that they wil not be renewed. No answer yet. |
Excellent news!
Please convey my support of this to your dept. head. I hope the next step now is for the ministry of education and govt. to issue certificates of lectureship to all foreign teachers who meet the new guidelines.
Good bye B.A. holders and those with online degrees! |
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12ax7
Joined: 07 Nov 2009
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| Posted: Fri Sep 13, 2013 5:51 am Post subject: |
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| Jimskins wrote: |
| Swampfox10mm wrote: |
| Jimskins wrote: |
| 12ax7 wrote: |
| timhorton wrote: |
| Weigookin74 wrote: |
| Will they give you a big pay raise to match that education requirement? I wouldn't take on all that "Master's" debt just to make a big whopping 2.0 Mil. Seems the costs don't equal the means. But, then again, there's a sucker born every minute. |
Speaking from experience: If you are smart and find a low cost masters with flexibility...you can greatly improve your quality of life from a PS (or Hokwon) to UNI. It's not for lazy people though - it takes energy/time/initiative.
So YES a masters is VERY worth it! |
Depends which you get. You'd better skip the online only universities that spit out MAs after just 18 months of part-time study, without even requiring their students to write research papers and a thesis. They aren't good value for the money. Tuition is very high and few employers take those degrees seriously. |
Very true. At a recent department meeting at my uni we were told that the 'higher ups' do not like online or distance-learning MAs. And athough they won't fire those people at our uni who have nearly completed theirs, they shouldnt expect a payrise like other 'bricks and mortar' MAs. And this is at one of the if not the best uni jobs in Seoul. |
Funny. This is what we call "talking out of your..."
I'd like to know:
1. Which university this is.
2. Who said it, so I can verify it.
If you'd like to keep it to PM so that you can keep your privacy, I have no problems with that.
On a further note, a friend of mine used to work at Konkuk university, and years ago, the director there told him that she refused to hire bald men. They did, however, seem to find it in themselves to higher a bellhop from NY with a fake BA, a fake MA, and a fake Ph.D, who took them for in excess of 70 million won in false publishing to his own fake website. Then, when they entered his apartment, they found he was growing a great deal of weed, which was very much NOT fake. And after that situation, kiddies, we now need all of our degrees verified.
http://www.koreaherald.com/view.php?ud=20050115000034
http://www.zoominfo.com/p/Hector-Ramos/641571628
So, I wouldn't consider the individual hiring practice of a Korean university to be indicative of what happens elsewhere.
Likewise...
We see this kind of crap post (often lacking in any proof) from teachers who have a traditional MA, and are upset that their lives are being upended (or they are in fear of them being upended) because they now have much more, and often younger, competition. |
Sorry it took a bit of time to reply, I was waiting for something in writing to confirm what was said in the meeting. I have it now. Our uni has decided not to recognize any distance-learning degrees from now on. Those already in / completing an online/distance degree are now asking if this means that they wil not be renewed. No answer yet. |
That's awfully ignorant and lazy of them if that's the case since some distance education degrees, especially those that have a dissertation requirement, are incredibly demanding, maybe even more so than the on campus degrees your university offers.
PS. How does the university you work at ranks in the world?
Last edited by 12ax7 on Fri Sep 13, 2013 5:57 am; edited 2 times in total |
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12ax7
Joined: 07 Nov 2009
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| Posted: Fri Sep 13, 2013 5:54 am Post subject: |
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| I'm With You wrote: |
| Jimskins wrote: |
| Our uni has decided not to recognize any distance-learning degrees from now on. Those already in / completing an online/distance degree are now asking if this means that they wil not be renewed. No answer yet. |
Excellent news!
Please convey my support of this to your dept. head. I hope the next step now is for the ministry of education and govt. to issue certificates of lectureship to all foreign teachers who meet the new guidelines.
Good bye B.A. holders and those with online degrees! |
Whatever. The decision was made out of laziness and ignorance. Read my previous comment. |
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some waygug-in
Joined: 25 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Fri Sep 13, 2013 5:54 am Post subject: |
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Well, I'm sure glad I didn't go that route. I figured it wouldn't pan out in the
long run. |
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Swampfox10mm
Joined: 24 Mar 2011
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| Posted: Fri Sep 13, 2013 6:51 am Post subject: |
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Jim, is S.J. Lee in the office of Academic Affairs the first individual I should be contacting with questions for my article about Hongdae's verified non-acceptance of online degrees? Would she be up-to-speed about the situation? I see she has been the one receiving the online job applications for the school. I'm assuming she's an office worker, but she seems to be the one involved in responding to job questions posted on their website.
Feel free to PM, if you are more comfortable with that.
Thanks.
With that said... I'm really curious why Hongik offers more money to people who work at the Sejong campus? Are they having a harder time getting people to locate there, or is it more expensive? |
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Jimskins
Joined: 07 Nov 2007
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| Posted: Fri Sep 13, 2013 7:38 am Post subject: |
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| PM sent Swampfox |
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IPayInCash
Joined: 27 Jul 2013
Location: Away from all my board stalkers :)
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| Posted: Fri Sep 13, 2013 3:38 pm Post subject: |
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LOL...
People wih online degrees s**tting their pants right now.
I knew these people would eventually be axed out. ROFL@ thinking you can just get a degree online from a crappy school and continue to teach at a uni. Cant wait to see all the whiners that got screwed. |
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edwardcatflap
Joined: 22 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Fri Sep 13, 2013 4:41 pm Post subject: |
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It's funny that they seem to be so bothered by what types of bits of paper people have got rather than whether they're doing a good job or not. Most universities don't seem to have a clue about what makes a good EFL teacher. You see adverts listing an MA in English as a desirable qualification, as if that was any kind of preparation for facing a EFL class of teenage beginners. Presumably an onsite one of those or linguistics Masters will trump an online TESOL MA. at that university which has decided to get snobby about such things.  You don't need any kind of MA to be a good EFL teacher. You just need practical training experience and on the job development. They should know that. |
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Jimskins
Joined: 07 Nov 2007
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| Posted: Fri Sep 13, 2013 5:00 pm Post subject: |
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| edwardcatflap wrote: |
| It's funny that they seem to be so bothered by what types of bits of paper people have got rather than whether they're doing a good job or not. Most universities don't seem to have a clue about what makes a good EFL teacher. You see adverts listing an MA in English as a desirable qualification, as if that was any kind of preparation for facing a EFL class of teenage beginners. Presumably an onsite one of those or linguistics Masters will trump an online TESOL MA. at that university which has decided to get snobby about such things. You don't need any kind of MA to be a good EFL teacher. You just need practical training experience and on the job development. They should know that. |
^ Absolutely spot-on. |
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Makoli Mark Mark
Joined: 11 Aug 2013
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| Posted: Fri Sep 13, 2013 10:21 pm Post subject: |
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I've been thinking about doing an online masters, but I'm curious about what is better to study in for a master's degree, ESL, English, or education?
USC has a Master's program, but it's expensive, and a coworker told me about the Anaheim University which has an online master's program that's affordable. I'm curious about getting the stafford loan and other things.
I want to travel and make the good money, and to specialize more.
It would be good to have a six year plan in Saudi Arabia or the middle east with a Master's and buy a condo or apartment to rent out and help with the bills.
Any insight? |
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12ax7
Joined: 07 Nov 2009
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| Posted: Sat Sep 14, 2013 3:31 am Post subject: |
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| IPayInCash wrote: |
LOL...
People wih online degrees s**tting their pants right now.
I knew these people would eventually be axed out. ROFL@ thinking you can just get a degree online from a crappy school and continue to teach at a uni. Cant wait to see all the whiners that got screwed. |
Go back under your bridge, troll.
Fact is, a great deal of universities that offer distance education programs are far better ranked in than some of the top Korean universities.
The highest ranked Korean university in linguistics doesn't even appear in the top 50 on the latest rankings...and amongst those in the top 50 there are several who offer distance learning programs in that subject and/or in related fields, such as teaching ESL/EFL.
http://www.topuniversities.com/university-rankings/university-subject-rankings/2013/linguistics
So, the notion that all distance education degree holders aren't sufficiently qualified is laughable. |
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some waygug-in
Joined: 25 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Sat Sep 14, 2013 9:34 am Post subject: |
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| No matter how well ranked your on-line or distance program may be, if Korean unis won't hire you, where are you? |
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