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goat
Joined: 23 Feb 2010
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 Posted: Tue Oct 15, 2013 3:51 am Post subject: |
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| jazzmaster wrote: |
| Kuros wrote: |
The policy on religion threads is posted at the top of the Current Events Forum: http://forums.eslcafe.com/korea/viewtopic.php?t=169450&sid=4a987a77776bedbd2170c68704976ebf
| Quote: |
This is what the TOS says:
20."Religion focused threads that involve bashing, flaming, trolling and endless bickering are not wanted or permitted here. Such threads will be deleted at the discretion of a Moderator." That means you can post a thread that relates to a news event, but if it degenerates or if the thread title appears to focus on bashing, then we'll take action |
Surely, you can see how a thread on Pope Francis's declaration may pass while a thread attacking Islam without relation to a current event may become deleted. |
I didn't see any bashing of Islam on the deleted thread anymore than I see bashing of Catholicism on the existing thread.
Islam seems like a touchy subject, not only on these boards but everywhere. It seems to me that people are scared to discuss it. |
Better safe than sorry. Don't want the pizza delivery boy showing up at your door with a pizza in an odd shaped box. |
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Leon
Joined: 31 May 2010
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| Posted: Tue Oct 15, 2013 4:53 am Post subject: |
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| I'm guessing that this thread is trending towards disappearing soon too. |
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CentralCali
Joined: 17 May 2007
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| Posted: Tue Oct 15, 2013 5:08 am Post subject: |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
| Religious Discussion threads are on very thin ice. As soon as it veers into the validity of the religion itself or bashing takes place, it gets shut down. |
That thread began with bashing.
| Steelrails wrote: |
Islam tends to get intertwined with racism as well.
It doesn't help that people start to blend Arabs and Muslims together. "Blow up Iran and all those other Arabs". 
The people discussing things often are hyper-ignorant of the various religions, ethnic groups, and their histories in the Islamic-area world. |
Yep. And, as you note, too many of the ignorant racists (yes, I do know that racism is ignorance) think Iranians are Arabs, that all Muslims are Arabs, etc. The ignorati are simply taking the worst people they are aware of and deciding that those people are Islam. You'll note that said ignorati don't do the same for the worst of Christianity or certain other groups. Too close to home, you see.
Fox's post upthread doesn't deserve the courtesy of a quote. He's simply incorrect on the subject. |
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geldedgoat
Joined: 05 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Tue Oct 15, 2013 6:34 am Post subject: |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
| Ways to get the thread shut down- Bash the religion. |
| The Cosmic Hum wrote: |
| Except any message from them is backed by serious delusions. |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
| Bash the people. |
| Scorpion wrote: |
Nor are they based on reality, but on the fantasies of people who believed the earth was flat and that angry deities could be comforted by animal (or as in the case of Xity, human) sacrifice. [...] So to see you battling each other over whose version of a fairytale is the true one gives me immense pleasure  I have to go now, Santa's on the phone. |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
| Make hardline, absolute claims. |
| Scorpion wrote: |
| All religion is part of the same social and psychological phenomenon. Whether you are a Scientologist, a Shiite or a Zorastrian you are participants in the same phenomenon. |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
| Make strong value judgments. |
| The Cosmic Hum wrote: |
| Those who mainline religion need help, and God/religion is not the answer. It is a nasty drug. |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
| Use racial stereotypes. |
This is the only one of your criteria that wasn't satisfied, and I can only guess that it's because Catholicism is too widespread for that kind of snark to have much appeal. Though even then, I don't recall any use of racist language in the Islam thread.
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In short, the TOS seems to have little bearing on whether insults to Catholicism survive or those to Islam perish, and whether or not the offenders receive any kind of warning or suspension for their comments. |
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Fox
Joined: 04 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Tue Oct 15, 2013 4:12 pm Post subject: |
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| CentralCali wrote: |
Yep. And, as you note, too many of the ignorant racists (yes, I do know that racism is ignorance) think Iranians are Arabs, that all Muslims are Arabs, etc. The ignorati are simply taking the worst people they are aware of and deciding that those people are Islam. You'll note that said ignorati don't do the same for the worst of Christianity or certain other groups. Too close to home, you see. |
Although as a self-declared "Christian" himself I doubt CentralCali (whom I am using to make a point, not addressing; I don't like passive-aggressiveness and I am explicitly not inviting it) is spending much time attacking Christianity, the attitude on display here is actually somewhat of a kind with the type I was speaking of previously. Opposition to Islam is attacked as "ignorant" and "racist," while opposition to Christianity is treated as more tolerable and not automatically and reflexively demonized. A hypocritical complaint against people identifying Islam with its worst practitioners is launched while at the same time identifying opposition to Islam with it's own worst practitioners. It's all ultimately wrapped up in the neurotic dynamics of racial guilt, and it's tiresome.
The emphasis on the Persian/Arab divide is especially to the point here. Yes, Persians and Arabs are different, and yes, many people in the world (opposed to Islam or not) do not realize that, but that tangential to broader western opposition to Islam, and is simply being grasped upon to equate opposition to Islam to ignorance (in the general, non-pejorative sense: simply being unaware of a particular fact) to "ignorance" (in the specifically pejorative, insulting sense which means one denies current egalitarian orthodoxy) to racism for the sake of making a general case against certain parties. Not realizing Persians and Arabs are distinct is not "hyper-ignorance," it's just basic ignorance, and it's only the American government's meddling in the Middle East that makes it salient in the average American citizen at all. |
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bigverne
Joined: 12 May 2004
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bigverne
Joined: 12 May 2004
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| Posted: Tue Oct 15, 2013 4:28 pm Post subject: |
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More random peacefulness....
British law enforcement agencies averted a plot to orchestrate a large-scale terror attack similar to the assault on Kenya's Westgate mall, an official said Monday.
Police were questioning four men in their 20s on suspicion of terrorism after they were detained Sunday in pre-planned, intelligence-led raids.
A British security official said the men were planning a shooting spree akin to the Westgate attack in Nairobi, in which at least 67 people died.
The official - who spoke on condition of anonymity because he was not authorized to speak to the media on the record - said it was not clear how advanced the planning was but that any attack was not imminent.
Metropolitan Police did not identify the suspects or say what, if any, charges, they may face. But in a series of statements, the force said the men were all British nationals between the ages of 25 and 29, with roots in Turkey, Pakistan, Algeria and Azerbaijan.
http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-202_162-57607488/british-authorities-break-up-terror-plot/
'British nationals'....gotta love that word. Another point for team diversity! |
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CentralCali
Joined: 17 May 2007
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| Posted: Tue Oct 15, 2013 6:14 pm Post subject: |
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| Fox wrote: |
| CentralCali wrote: |
Yep. And, as you note, too many of the ignorant racists (yes, I do know that racism is ignorance) think Iranians are Arabs, that all Muslims are Arabs, etc. The ignorati are simply taking the worst people they are aware of and deciding that those people are Islam. You'll note that said ignorati don't do the same for the worst of Christianity or certain other groups. Too close to home, you see. |
Although as a self-declared "Christian" himself I doubt CentralCali (whom I am using to make a point, not addressing; I don't like passive-aggressiveness and I am explicitly not inviting it) is spending much time attacking Christianity, the attitude on display here is actually somewhat of a kind with the type I was speaking of previously. Opposition to Islam is attacked as "ignorant" and "racist," while opposition to Christianity is treated as more tolerable and not automatically and reflexively demonized. A hypocritical complaint against people identifying Islam with its worst practitioners is launched while at the same time identifying opposition to Islam with it's own worst practitioners. It's all ultimately wrapped up in the neurotic dynamics of racial guilt, and it's tiresome.
The emphasis on the Persian/Arab divide is especially to the point here. Yes, Persians and Arabs are different, and yes, many people in the world (opposed to Islam or not) do not realize that, but that tangential to broader western opposition to Islam, and is simply being grasped upon to equate opposition to Islam to ignorance (in the general, non-pejorative sense: simply being unaware of a particular fact) to "ignorance" (in the specifically pejorative, insulting sense which means one denies current egalitarian orthodoxy) to racism for the sake of making a general case against certain parties. Not realizing Persians and Arabs are distinct is not "hyper-ignorance," it's just basic ignorance, and it's only the American government's meddling in the Middle East that makes it salient in the average American citizen at all. |
What are you on about, Fox? Also, why do you put Christian in quotes about my self-declaration? |
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Fox
Joined: 04 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Tue Oct 15, 2013 6:37 pm Post subject: |
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| CentralCali wrote: |
What are you on about, Fox? |
I thought I made it pretty clear that post was not addressed to you and not inviting your response? I know full well when someone is unwilling to engage in serious discussion, so you can be a prop, but not an interlocutor.
| CentralCali wrote: |
| Also, why do you put Christian in quotes about my self-declaration? |
I didn't describe you as a Christian, you described yourself as one. Is using quote marks when quoting someone suddenly so mysterious and impenetrable? |
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CentralCali
Joined: 17 May 2007
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| Posted: Tue Oct 15, 2013 6:57 pm Post subject: |
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| Fox = disingenuous |
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Titus
Joined: 19 May 2012
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| Posted: Sat Oct 19, 2013 11:28 pm Post subject: |
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Too bad.
Kuros was comparing the violent tendencies of islam to USG. I wanted to talk about why democracies are so prone to war. Now the thread is gone.
Allow me to try. Kuros, why do you think democracy is as or more violent than an expansionist religion. Please don't cite The Atlantic, as my brain works. Why? Tommy Friedman says McDonald's prevents war, but he's an idiot. What's your position? Best, describe the similarities between expansionist islam and expansionist Americanism. Thanks. |
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Nowhere Man
Joined: 08 Feb 2004
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| Posted: Sun Oct 20, 2013 8:12 am Post subject: ... |
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Bear in mind: there is a current events board out on the main forum where, maybe, just maybe, teachers in the ME might participate and shed light on a great many things in a very meaningful and pragmatic way.
Actually living and working in the Middle East vastly altered my notions of what was Islam, Arabic culture, and the muslim global community.
For me, reading what the uninitiated/prejudiced have to say about it is like chewing on tin foil.
And, I have to wonder why certain "scholars of the hadith" have to hang around Korea current events telling everyone what muslims think. |
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Titus
Joined: 19 May 2012
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| Posted: Sun Oct 20, 2013 8:15 am Post subject: |
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| A weak ass attempt to shame individuals out of discussing something. |
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Titus
Joined: 19 May 2012
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| Posted: Sun Oct 20, 2013 8:52 am Post subject: |
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| bigverne wrote: |
[i]British law enforcement agencies averted a plot to orchestrate a large-scale terror attack similar to the assault on Kenya's Westgate mall, an official said Monday.
Police were questioning four men in their 20s on suspicion of terrorism after they were detained Sunday in pre-planned, intelligence-led raids.
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Shopping malls and similar are high value targets for jihadi groups wanting to maximize social chaos. Imagine an attack similar to Westgate in the USA and how the government would respond. The political class would use such an attack to further remove freedom of movement and privacy. We're 5 minutes from Orwell already. It's embarrassing.
There are 80,000 Somalians living near the Mall of America. |
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The Cosmic Hum
Joined: 09 May 2003
Location: Sonic Space
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| Posted: Sun Oct 20, 2013 11:16 pm Post subject: |
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| jazzmaster wrote: |
| But there's a thread about the Catholic Church directly below this thread? |
It was supposed to be about the Pope and the kind of advice he likes to give up.
As usual, some took it upon themselves to discuss other topics.
As usual, some felt slighted when others criticized their special status.
Par for the course.
All kinds of posters on this board can't stand to have their religion criticized and cry to the moderators about it.
The mods usually just delete the thread.
Most every thread about religion gets deleted eventually.
Some posters just can't seem to resist the urge to proselytize.
It burns inside them...perhaps some kind of glorious suffering is involved...who knows. |
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