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lissie05
Joined: 04 Jan 2012
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 Posted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 4:32 pm Post subject: Pension |
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| At my hagwon my employer has us as Business Income Earners and doesn't pay into the national pension. Is this correct? |
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Allthechildrenareinsane
Joined: 23 Jun 2011
Location: Lost in a Roman wilderness of pain
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| Posted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 8:52 pm Post subject: Re: Pension |
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| lissie05 wrote: |
| At my hagwon my employer has us as Business Income Earners and doesn't pay into the national pension. Is this correct? |
Does your contract refer to you as an "employee," a "business income earner" or an "independent contractor"? If either of the latter two, then the hagwon won't pay pension. If you're not enrolled in the national pension scheme, then you're also not enrolled in the national health insurance plan either.
Some hagwons will intentionally classify positions in contracts as something other than "employee" in order to avoid having to pay into the pension and health insurance systems. If you do a search on Dave's for "hagwons and pension" you'll find other threads on the topic. |
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nicwr2002
Joined: 17 Aug 2011
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| Posted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 10:14 pm Post subject: |
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| I thought it didn't matter what they said in the contract. The law is they have to pay into the pension plan and national healthcare if you are on an E-2 visa. I even received a letter in the mail about it when my previous employer didn't pay into it. |
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Allthechildrenareinsane
Joined: 23 Jun 2011
Location: Lost in a Roman wilderness of pain
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| Posted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 11:19 pm Post subject: |
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| nicwr2002 wrote: |
| I thought it didn't matter what they said in the contract. The law is they have to pay into the pension plan and national healthcare if you are on an E-2 visa. I even received a letter in the mail about it when my previous employer didn't pay into it. |
As I understand it, it IS illegal under the E-2 visa regulations for a hagwon to not pay pension/insurance. However, the Korean tax office will often allow hagwons to classify E-2 visa holders as independent contractors, thereby allowing the hagwon to circumvent the regulations. Immigration and the tax office don't seem to communicate w/ one another, so wiggling out of their obligations is still something hagwons will continue to do. See this thread here: http://forums.eslcafe.com/korea/viewtopic.php?t=218431
The OP's only recourse if they want their pension and national insurance coverage is to contact the pension office and let them know that their employer has not been paying into the scheme. This has some repercussions, though, not the least of which is jeopardizing your employment status by angering your employer for reporting them.
OP: There have been tons of threads on this issue -- you can do a Google search for "site:forums.eslcafe.com dave's esl cafe pension contractor" to view some of them. |
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lissie05
Joined: 04 Jan 2012
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| Posted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 2:10 am Post subject: Pension |
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| My contract says full-time English instructional staff |
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Porksta
Joined: 05 May 2011
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| Posted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 2:17 am Post subject: |
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| So in your contract it says "the full-time English instructional staff" will work from 9-5 and the "full-time English instructional staff" will earn 2.1 million a month? Or does it say employee? |
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lissie05
Joined: 04 Jan 2012
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| Posted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 3:54 am Post subject: Pension |
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| At the beginning of the contract it says hereafter referred to as "The Instructional Staff." The only section of the contract that uses the word employee is the Transportation and Travel expenses provision. |
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ontheway
Joined: 24 Aug 2005
Location: Somewhere under the rainbow...
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| Posted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 6:59 am Post subject: |
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| nicwr2002 wrote: |
| I thought it didn't matter what they said in the contract. The law is they have to pay into the pension plan and national healthcare if you are on an E-2 visa. |
Unfortunately in your case, it does matter what it says in the contract. Many Dave's posters have been giving misinformation about the Independent Contractor status in Korea and you and others have been misled into wrong assumptions and wrong expectations.
1) It is legal to be an IC in Korea, even on an E2 visa. This policy is under the jurisdiction of the Tax Office. Immigration cannot make policy regarding IC status, it is not under their purview, it is out of their jurisdiction.
Immigration requires you to have a sponsor and your sponsor guarantees that you will have adequate financial resources to live on while you are in Korea. That does not mean that the E2 visa holder will qualify as an employee under the rules set by the tax office.
2) You can be an IC even if you only have one contract and even if you perform your duties at a single location provided by your boss with hours assigned by your boss; this is true even in the US, which has much stricter IC rules than Korea. Plumbers, for example, often find themselves in exactly this situation - one long term contract, one location, assigned hours, as legal ICs.
3) As a worker in Korea you must register for and pay into the National Health Insurance and National Pension:
i. If you are an employee, your employer must register their employees, pay at least half, collect each employee's share and remit the payments when due to the appropriate office.
ii. If you are an IC, then essentially you are your own employer, and you must register yourself and remit the full payments yourself - if you maintain yourself as a legal IC.
4) For most E2 teachers, working as an IC is a bad idea and, unless you are paid a substantially higher wage, you will make less as an IC. As a general rule I always recommend turning down IC contracts by E2 teachers (there are rare exceptions).
5) If your contract says that you are an "employee," then you are, and you will usually be able to secure the assistance of the labor, health ins and pension offices if your employer does not register and pay propertly.
6) If your contract says that you are an "Independent Contractor" or "Business Income Earner" or some other phrase that clearly indicates such status, then you will be required to register and pay yourself.
7) Some conracts are badly written or unclear and subject to interpretation.
8.) Teachers should have a clear choice between IC and Employee contracts and be able to choose in an informed manner. If the school has written the contract, there should be a general presumption that unclear and misleading language is interpreted in favor of the teacher.
9) Teachers should understand that the words in the contract they sign have meaning:
It is legal to be an IC as an E2 teacher in Korea.
If you don't want to be an IC, and the contract makes it clear that you will be an IC, don't sign the contract.
The law will not bail you out from your bad decisions.
| lissie05 wrote: |
| At the beginning of the contract it says hereafter referred to as "The Instructional Staff." The only section of the contract that uses the word employee is the Transportation and Travel expenses provision. |
In your case you have a mixed contract, according to what you wrote. It sounds like someone tried to modify an existing "employee" contract and register new teachers as ICs, but they missed at least one section or they had a lapse of thought when writing. This could interpreted either way - that you are an IC or an employee.
It seems fairly clear (I'd need to see the entire contract) that the intent of the contract was to make you an IC,. However, if they never used specific words stating that you are an IC, using instead "full time instructional staff, and since they did use the word "employee" in at least one section of the contract, administrators or courts could (should IMO) rule that since the school wrote the contract, they had a duty to make it clear, and that a worker could reasonably construe the use of the word "employee" in some part of the contract as applying to the whole contract in the absence of any specific language to the contrary.
| nicwr2002 wrote: |
| I even received a letter in the mail about it when my previous employer didn't pay into it. |
So, what happened when your previous employer didn't pay into it? Were you contracted as an Independent Contractor? Did you or your school eventually pay National Pension and National Health Insurance?
more:
relevant Threads:
http://forums.eslcafe.com/korea/viewtopic.php?t=210465&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0
http://forums.eslcafe.com/korea/viewtopic.php?p=2687780&highlight=#2687780 |
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morrisson
Joined: 02 Nov 2012
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Fri Feb 14, 2014 6:54 am Post subject: |
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| Has anyone successfully fought to get their pension after being told that they're an IC? My contract says "employee" all over it, yet we don't get pension and I've heard that we're filed as ICs. My contract is nearly up, so I'm considering kicking up a fuss. |
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Stain
Joined: 08 Jan 2014
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| Posted: Fri Feb 14, 2014 7:10 am Post subject: |
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| morrisson wrote: |
| Has anyone successfully fought to get their pension after being told that they're an IC? My contract says "employee" all over it, yet we don't get pension and I've heard that we're filed as ICs. My contract is nearly up, so I'm considering kicking up a fuss. |
Are you with a hagwon or public school? I know at a public school we are considered IC, but they pay into the pension. It only matters in tax matters. So, you have a case there. However, if you work for a hagwon, then the labor board might help you, but I don't know if they will succeed. |
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morrisson
Joined: 02 Nov 2012
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Fri Feb 14, 2014 7:18 am Post subject: |
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| I'm at a hagwon, and plan to stay another year - at a different job. They're trying to stiff us on orientation money that was never paid, and I figure if I go to the labor board, I may as well go big. After collecting my LOR... |
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Stain
Joined: 08 Jan 2014
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| Posted: Fri Feb 14, 2014 8:21 am Post subject: |
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| morrisson wrote: |
| I'm at a hagwon, and plan to stay another year - at a different job. They're trying to stiff us on orientation money that was never paid, and I figure if I go to the labor board, I may as well go big. After collecting my LOR... |
Man, hagwons suck. And now, due to government bs, I'm about to be dropped into the fry cooker again. |
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