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RangerMcGreggor
Joined: 12 Jan 2011
Location: Somewhere in Korea
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 Posted: Tue Jun 17, 2014 12:25 am Post subject: |
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| mr_thehorse wrote: |
| KimchiNinja wrote: |
| atwood wrote: |
| I respect the police in the U.S. Why shouldn't I? They put their lives on the line to serve and protect. |
HA! You can't possibly be serious? Did you actually say protect and serve? |
atwood is clearly not from a big city heh. |
Or hell, anywhere. I'm from suburbia and the police are notorious in those places |
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r2b2ct
Joined: 14 Jun 2013
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| Posted: Tue Jun 17, 2014 12:42 am Post subject: |
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Police can sometimes be worse in the areas of the US where they are not really needed. They have a lot of pressure to keep the place "nice" whereas other areas they have less pressure because people have accepted some crime as the norm. Or maybe they let little stupid crap slide because they are looking for real criminals. Where I am from the police are far more strict in the rich, low crime areas than elsewhere.
The US and Korea are really polar opposites in police matters. Both have faults and perhaps a happy middle is preferable to either. Overall, though, I would say Korea is more pleasant in this regard. |
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KimchiNinja
Joined: 01 May 2012
Location: Gangnam
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| Posted: Tue Jun 17, 2014 12:47 am Post subject: |
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Been harassed in the city, suburbs, country, while camping, while on a boat, when driving over boarder, when flying in/out. It doesn't matter where you are, if you are white collar straight, or a tattooed face weirdo, you are a suspect and deserve to have your rights violated, just to be safe!!!
How awesome, I guess I should respect that right? |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Tue Jun 17, 2014 1:20 am Post subject: |
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| Captain Corea wrote: |
| Steelrails wrote: |
| I dont really care about the scooter on sidewalk thing or sidewalk parking within crrtain limits (low speed, truck offloading goods). The exigencies of commerce demand it. |
I suppose the owners/managers of the Sewol felt the same way.
Gotta put laws and safety aside for the almighty won! |
Right, but allowing a truck to back onto the sidewalk to offload goods is not the same as overloading ferries. Just as wanting more stringent enforcement of parking doesnt mean you want something like the Bloomberg-NYC parking cartel.
You cam have someone drive a scooter on a sidewalk in a safe manner. At some point you have to recognize that true strict enforcement would approach logistical impossibility in a city like Seoul. A large chunk of the city would essentially grind to a halt, delivery costs would skyrocket, and working hours would increase. |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Tue Jun 17, 2014 1:30 am Post subject: |
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| atwood wrote: |
| Steelrails wrote: |
I should also add that the two times me or anyone I know has actually needed the police theyve been up to the task. One involved a B&E by a landlord on an NET. There wss no direct evidence, but the police really made the guy uncomfortable and he sold the building shortly thereafter. Another B&E on an NET involved the cops looking into it for over two months and eventually catching the guy, recovering the property and charging the offender, a Korean. As for me, the only other experience I had was being broken down roadside, and the cops helping me tell the tow truck guy where to go.
Thats not to say that there arent serious problems, but they arent total buffoons. I dont really care about the scooter on sidewalk thing or sidewalk parking within crrtain limits (low speed, truck offloading goods). The exigencies of commerce demand it. The flip side is the joke that is New York City where Coca Cola drivers will get hundreds of dollars in tickets everyday and the company has lawyers to carry baketfuls if tickets inti court everymonth to reach a settlement. The whole thing is a joke. A big shakedown.
Lastly, if the police were truly so incompetant, you'd leave. People who live in places with truly corrupt and ineffective police rapidly leave their homes and jobs. They.are called 'refugees'. |
Samsung pays the police on a monthly basis so their company buses can park illegally, run lights, speed etc. I would guess the other chaebols do the same and maybe some of the hagwons with their drivers and parking.
BTW, how about some evidence for the Coke story? I worked at Samsung and saw the payoffs. |
http://www.nbcnews.com/id/14602712/ns/business-us_business/t/delivery-firms-big-ticket-item-parking-fines/
Its a shakedown racket. Just like the difference between 'campaign contributions' and bribes. |
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atwood
Joined: 26 Dec 2009
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| Posted: Tue Jun 17, 2014 1:38 am Post subject: |
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| mr_thehorse wrote: |
| KimchiNinja wrote: |
| atwood wrote: |
| I respect the police in the U.S. Why shouldn't I? They put their lives on the line to serve and protect. |
HA! You can't possibly be serious? Did you actually say protect and serve? |
atwood is clearly not from a big city heh. |
I lived in NYC for a few years. Is that big enough for you?
You know those guys who went into harm's way on 9/11? How soon they forget.
And don't forget who was in charge of the Korean Coast Guard, which did such a bang-up job getting passengers off the Sewol--the Korean National Police.
Boy and girls, can you spell incompetent? |
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nicwr2002
Joined: 17 Aug 2011
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| Posted: Tue Jun 17, 2014 1:46 am Post subject: |
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| atwood wrote: |
| Weigookin74 wrote: |
| Fox wrote: |
| jvalmer wrote: |
| At least Korean cops don't have quotas to fill. As, for speeding, you know some of the speed camera boxes on the highways do have cameras in them. A few of my ct's have been nailed with a ticket in the mail. |
I've gotten a ticket in the mail as well, but it was ridiculously cheap compared to what you'd get in America. I've got no problem at all with the Korean road camera system: they generally put them in places where speeding could be potentially dangerous, and the fine if you get caught is usually pretty trivial. When contrasted to American-style speed traps there's really no contest. Once back in the States a cop caught me a bit over the speed limit on a road at midnight, going down a steep hill. "You didn't quite push the brakes hard enough on this deserted road, give us 250 dollars." The guy was literally getting paid with taxpayer dollars to sit in a car, at night, on the side of a hill, hoping to extract money from passersby. A legally-sanctioned highwayman, nothing more.
I don't know how things are in the UK, Australia, Canada, and so forth, so perhaps complaints from people of those nationalities may be more legitimate, but I'll happily take Korean police over American police. |
They're called 'speed traps' and Canadians do receive regular warnings about them if they are members of an auto club like CAA when driving through the States. I think it's mostly an American thing. Some towns fund themselves as towns when they should be villages or rural counties by use of these speed traps. I had seen something on the news about one towns speed trap getting ruled illegal by the State or the courts and they had to get rid of their town status as they couldn't fund it anymore without that ticket money.
But, in Canada, like Korea, you are allowed to be 10 KM over before they pull you over. Though speeding fines are ridiculously high for some types of speeding in Canada, at least within the past 10 years or so. Before this, it wasn't to bad. I drove 80 km in a 50 zone and the cop gave me an 80 dollar fine. It might be double or triple that nowadays. (He was even nice enough to let me off with the lower fine as 25 km over the speed limit was 125 bucks at the time. I was 5 km over that so he let me off with the cheaper fine.)
http://autos.ca.msn.com/specials/road-trip-guide/gallery.aspx?cp-documentid=24319270&page=1 |
So you saw something on the news, stayed at a Holiday Express and now you're an expert on U.S. traffic cops.
There's almost always a cushion of 5 to 10 mph--not your wimpy kph--before you get pulled over unless it's a school zone or an area where they've had lots of accidents.
But you are FREE--the word of the day on this thread--to go as fast as you like as long you pay the fine if you get caught. You're also free to go the speed limit or under on a major U.S. interstate, but you'll have to deal with the angry motorists you're holding up, grandma.
Don't do the crime if you can't do the time. |
You are free to speed if you are willing to pay the fine? That doesn't mean he is free. Being free would be being able to speed and not getting a fine. Anyways, you are not free to speed over a certain limit because if you do your license can be revoked. Also, State Patrol Police Officers can pull you over for going just 1 MPH over the speed limit. That is up to the discretion of the officer.
I respect police officers, but they don't know restraint and think that they are above you in some way. They have this guilty until proven innocence mentality. It is no surprise to me that they act this way when you can enter the police force at 18 with no tertiary education. |
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atwood
Joined: 26 Dec 2009
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| Posted: Tue Jun 17, 2014 2:06 am Post subject: |
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| nicwr2002 wrote: |
| atwood wrote: |
| Weigookin74 wrote: |
| Fox wrote: |
| jvalmer wrote: |
| At least Korean cops don't have quotas to fill. As, for speeding, you know some of the speed camera boxes on the highways do have cameras in them. A few of my ct's have been nailed with a ticket in the mail. |
I've gotten a ticket in the mail as well, but it was ridiculously cheap compared to what you'd get in America. I've got no problem at all with the Korean road camera system: they generally put them in places where speeding could be potentially dangerous, and the fine if you get caught is usually pretty trivial. When contrasted to American-style speed traps there's really no contest. Once back in the States a cop caught me a bit over the speed limit on a road at midnight, going down a steep hill. "You didn't quite push the brakes hard enough on this deserted road, give us 250 dollars." The guy was literally getting paid with taxpayer dollars to sit in a car, at night, on the side of a hill, hoping to extract money from passersby. A legally-sanctioned highwayman, nothing more.
I don't know how things are in the UK, Australia, Canada, and so forth, so perhaps complaints from people of those nationalities may be more legitimate, but I'll happily take Korean police over American police. |
They're called 'speed traps' and Canadians do receive regular warnings about them if they are members of an auto club like CAA when driving through the States. I think it's mostly an American thing. Some towns fund themselves as towns when they should be villages or rural counties by use of these speed traps. I had seen something on the news about one towns speed trap getting ruled illegal by the State or the courts and they had to get rid of their town status as they couldn't fund it anymore without that ticket money.
But, in Canada, like Korea, you are allowed to be 10 KM over before they pull you over. Though speeding fines are ridiculously high for some types of speeding in Canada, at least within the past 10 years or so. Before this, it wasn't to bad. I drove 80 km in a 50 zone and the cop gave me an 80 dollar fine. It might be double or triple that nowadays. (He was even nice enough to let me off with the lower fine as 25 km over the speed limit was 125 bucks at the time. I was 5 km over that so he let me off with the cheaper fine.)
http://autos.ca.msn.com/specials/road-trip-guide/gallery.aspx?cp-documentid=24319270&page=1 |
So you saw something on the news, stayed at a Holiday Express and now you're an expert on U.S. traffic cops.
There's almost always a cushion of 5 to 10 mph--not your wimpy kph--before you get pulled over unless it's a school zone or an area where they've had lots of accidents.
But you are FREE--the word of the day on this thread--to go as fast as you like as long you pay the fine if you get caught. You're also free to go the speed limit or under on a major U.S. interstate, but you'll have to deal with the angry motorists you're holding up, grandma.
Don't do the crime if you can't do the time. |
You are free to speed if you are willing to pay the fine? That doesn't mean he is free. Being free would be being able to speed and not getting a fine. Anyways, you are not free to speed over a certain limit because if you do your license can be revoked. Also, State Patrol Police Officers can pull you over for going just 1 MPH over the speed limit. That is up to the discretion of the officer.
I respect police officers, but they don't know restraint and think that they are above you in some way. They have this guilty until proven innocence mentality. It is no surprise to me that they act this way when you can enter the police force at 18 with no tertiary education. |
And other than being able to use words like tertiary, what exactly has your education gotten you? 
Obviously, you don't understand, for instance, freedom and its relationship to money in a capitalistic society.
Has a state trooper ever pulled you over for being one MPH over the speed limit? What do you think are the chances of that happening? Use some of that tertiary thinking you're so proud of. |
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KimchiNinja
Joined: 01 May 2012
Location: Gangnam
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| Posted: Tue Jun 17, 2014 2:16 am Post subject: |
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| atwood wrote: |
| You know those guys who went into harm's way on 9/11? |
That they actually did their job ONCE, does not excuse their day to day behavior. |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Tue Jun 17, 2014 2:28 am Post subject: |
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| atwood wrote: |
Obviously, you don't understand, for instance, freedom and its relationship to money in a capitalistic society.
Has a state trooper ever pulled you over for being one MPH over the speed limit? What do you think are the chances of that happening? Use some of that tertiary thinking you're so proud of. |
DWB? My ex-roommate, a Detroit firefighter (with union decal on his rear window) was pulled over every time he drove into Rochester Hills to party at our friend's house. The cops were polite enough but everyone knew what the deal was. Show em your shield and then you'll be on your way unmolested, but it still sucks to have to go through that.
I don't know anyone in Korea who has gotten pulled over for Driving While Waygook. I do know a bunch of times people have played the foreigner card and regulatory-type people giving them a pass. |
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Mix1
Joined: 08 May 2007
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| Posted: Tue Jun 17, 2014 2:38 am Post subject: |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
| Captain Corea wrote: |
| Steelrails wrote: |
| I dont really care about the scooter on sidewalk thing or sidewalk parking within crrtain limits (low speed, truck offloading goods). The exigencies of commerce demand it. |
I suppose the owners/managers of the Sewol felt the same way.
Gotta put laws and safety aside for the almighty won! |
Right, but allowing a truck to back onto the sidewalk to offload goods is not the same as overloading ferries. Just as wanting more stringent enforcement of parking doesnt mean you want something like the Bloomberg-NYC parking cartel.
You cam have someone drive a scooter on a sidewalk in a safe manner. At some point you have to recognize that true strict enforcement would approach logistical impossibility in a city like Seoul. A large chunk of the city would essentially grind to a halt, delivery costs would skyrocket, and working hours would increase. |
Riiiight.
Yes, it's "impossible" to enforce the laws here.
As if not allowing scooters on sidewalks or stopping cars from constantly running red lights would cause some sort of societal breakdown.
All it would mean is a few people have to wait a bit longer. (Granted, Koreans tend not to be very good at waiting, but they could learn.) |
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KimchiNinja
Joined: 01 May 2012
Location: Gangnam
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| Posted: Tue Jun 17, 2014 2:42 am Post subject: |
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| Mix1 wrote: |
| All it would mean is a few people have to wait a bit longer. (Granted, Koreans tend not to be very good at waiting, but they could learn.) |
...or we could keep getting our chicken dinner delivery on time.
I vote for that option, as do all the Koreans. You guys lose. |
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jazzmaster
Joined: 30 Sep 2013
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| Posted: Tue Jun 17, 2014 3:21 am Post subject: |
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| The US police departments actions have no bearing on the Korean police department. To excuse the impotency of the Korean police force by comparing them with the US police department is the equivalent of comparing two turds and arguing that one stinks less. Korea should aim higher than the US. It's sad that many posters here are so mentally stunted that all they can do is compare two turds. |
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Captain Corea
Joined: 28 Feb 2005
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Tue Jun 17, 2014 3:43 am Post subject: |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
| Captain Corea wrote: |
| Steelrails wrote: |
| I dont really care about the scooter on sidewalk thing or sidewalk parking within crrtain limits (low speed, truck offloading goods). The exigencies of commerce demand it. |
I suppose the owners/managers of the Sewol felt the same way.
Gotta put laws and safety aside for the almighty won! |
Right, but allowing a truck to back onto the sidewalk to offload goods is not the same as overloading ferries. Just as wanting more stringent enforcement of parking doesnt mean you want something like the Bloomberg-NYC parking cartel.
You cam have someone drive a scooter on a sidewalk in a safe manner. At some point you have to recognize that true strict enforcement would approach logistical impossibility in a city like Seoul. A large chunk of the city would essentially grind to a halt, delivery costs would skyrocket, and working hours would increase. |
Sorry, man. We disagree on this - and if you had a toddler at your side, you'd probably look at it differently too.
This city would not grind to a halt, there are many workarounds that are very feasible - and have been discussed in previous threads.
Instead of a motorcycle driving down the side walk to deliver goods (and lets be honest, they also drive down the sidewalk to circumvent traffic/lights), they could park against the curb. Heck, in major commercial areas, a 1/2 meter indent could be made in the curb to allow parking for them.
You see a truck backing down a sidewalk as having no relationship to the sinking of the ferry. I see them as practically the same thing - putting aside safety for ease of business.
How many pedestrians are killed here each year? How many traffic accidents are there? How many times have you seen someone zipping down a sidewalk and hope to hell no one walked out from around the corner?
I forget though. You're the same guy that figures "good" drivers should be able to go through red lights. You seem to have this fallacy that "good" drivers will drive safely on sidewalks as well - sorry, man. But that does not jive with what I see every day. "Good" is not rewarded. Fast is. |
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atwood
Joined: 26 Dec 2009
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| Posted: Tue Jun 17, 2014 4:03 am Post subject: |
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