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earthquakez
Joined: 10 Nov 2010
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 Posted: Fri Mar 06, 2015 3:17 am Post subject: |
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| radish kimchi wrote: |
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| I was simply saying you have no father. |
And this relates to tea in China, how? How was I born without a father?
NEXT....
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| Did the ambassador do something to this guy? |
If you are going to represent the most dangerous mob on the planet and you don't want to be attacked, then you should not take up a position titled, "Ambassador to the USA".
Next....
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| How do we stop it? That should be interesting. |
Pack up your toys and leave Korea. Don't do military exercises. Kinda simple.
Next....
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| Also you should know what embassies are for. |
What do you mean "are for"?
There are embassies for uniting countries, and there are embassies used to divide countries.
Next....
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| I know the effect of the holocaust, but I am unfamiliar with the cause. Please explain. |
Intolerance would be a big one. America is doing a holocaust on Native American Indians, Palestinians, Koreans, Hawaiians (who don't want to be a part of the 50 states), etc....
Pack up your military gear and allow other countries to exist without US influence. |
Your use of the term 'holocaust' is calculated to offend people of Jewish backgrounds. I am not one but I am sure there are Jewish café posters. I am also sure they understand what you are trying to do here by using such terminology.
For your information Palestinians have their own terms for what has happened to them. It is a word that means 'catastrophe'. Palestinians are also a mixed group with many of the Christians having fled a long time ago as their extremist brethren made life very difficult for them.
Being caught between a rock and a hard place does not make either easy and Hamas' hard place includes stringing up people from transmission towers for offences perceived and otherwise. The conflict with Israel could have been resolved some time ago had the Palestinians' autocratic/strongman dictatorship Arabic/Muslim state supporters not played the Israel card to make sure their own suppressed peoples did not rise up against them.
I doubt any Hawaiians would call being part of the USA these days a 'holocaust' unless they swill the same irrationalityade you are drinking. I am aware that the Hawaiians are concerned by their state being the preferred destination for some Japanese, Chinese and Korean businesses that are little more than tax dodges, fronts for money laundering and prostitution.
If you asked Hawaiians whether they would like to be a state of the USA, the People's Republic of China, Japan or the Republc of Korea, I am fairly certain they would opt for the status quo.
Yes the history of the USA includes many grim episodes including those to do with the native peoples there. However, there are businesses run by native American groups from which they get to keep the profit such as casinos etc. It's not the best scenario and native American realities need much,much more attention and solutions.
Korean history also includes the Paekchong who actually are a minority group ethnically. They were the untouchable caste of Korea very much like the Burakumin of Japan, and the Paekchong were discriminated against centuries before the Japanese colonised Korea. All countries today have their dirty pasts and dirty secrets.
As for the Korean situation, the USA would leave South Korea as soon as it could if North Korea were not so unstable. The unwanted US military presence is the price that Koreans, especially the young generation who like being nationalistic, pay for their image-obsessed, high consumption, nouveau professional class aspirational lifestyle.
So much for your tawdry attacks on the US Ambassador who has not fired a shot at anybody as far as is known. The assailant was typical of a type of pro North Korea 'activist' of which I met some in Japan and have unfortunately seen bullying others in Korea.
They are always promoting and defending North Korea without having the courage of their convictions to go pack up and live there.
The Korean pro-North activists are the kind of people who spit on white looking people in the hope they are American, went hysterical over 'Crazy Cow' mistaken imports which to date don't seem to have induced one case of Mad Cow Disease in the Korean population, froth at the mouth outside the Yongsan Base during demonstrations and scream at passing white/black foreigners to go back home especially ones walking on their own.
Your logic in this thread seems similar to theirs as well as your lack of knowledge. South Korea and North Korea will be divided as long as China is a player in this issue. Some Koreans and not just the idiot pro-North element are in for a huge shock if the USA does pack up its military.
When this happens there will be no reunification. China will move in and govern North Korea by effective proxy and South Korea will be left with the realisation that the absence of the USA simply cleared the way for domination by China in an extended deja vu.
Last edited by earthquakez on Fri Mar 06, 2015 3:31 am; edited 1 time in total |
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atwood
Joined: 26 Dec 2009
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| Posted: Fri Mar 06, 2015 3:21 am Post subject: |
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This thread is going nowhere fast.
I'll just say good on Lippert for staying positive and not turning this into something more than what it was. |
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radish kimchi
Joined: 20 Mar 2014
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| Posted: Fri Mar 06, 2015 4:11 am Post subject: |
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| Your use of the term 'holocaust' is calculated to offend people of Jewish backgrounds. |
So, the H word is to jews as the N word is to blacks? If you are not a jew you can't say it, but jews can build a holocaust museum?
I didn't initiate using the word, so I wasn't trying to do anything. If you look, I quoted another poster. America did remove substantial regions where native Indians lived. The comparison is not far fetched, and relating it to a holocaust should show I acknowledge jews had horrendous things happen in their history. While I can't claim to be a survivor, I am not any different in this respect with a person who is a jew living today who also wasn't a victim.
So, unless you have a real point to make, let's ignore you threw out the H or J card.
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| So much for your tawdry attacks on the US Ambassador who has not fired a shot at anybody as far as is known. |
He represents the USA. Come on now, this isn't that difficult. He wasn't attacked because of who he is. He was attacked because of who and what he represents.
Your knowledge about the Palestinian cause and Hawaiians is lacking badly. Israel has a state Palestinians don't. their land was taken from them and now they live in 2 regions policed by a government very much like the USA, military based. Should there be an Israel and USA? Yes, but not one at the cost of lives.
Hawaiians want independence, I wasn't stating they were a holocaust. Make sure your reading comprehension is up to snuff.
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| They are always promoting and defending North Korea without having the courage of their convictions to go pack up and live there. |
Maybe they want a 1 Korea, there is no "living there".
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| When this happens there will be no reunification. China will move in and govern North Korea by effective proxy and South Korea will be left with the realisation that the absence of the USA simply cleared the way for domination by China in an extended deja vu. |
Better China than USA.
Why should USA be allowed to go across an ocean and control a country heavily influenced by China? Do other countries do this?
Your replies are biased and favor holocaust thinking. Jews are not the only ones allowed to use this word. |
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SHGator428
Joined: 05 Sep 2014
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| Posted: Fri Mar 06, 2015 4:54 am Post subject: |
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Officials at Seoul's Jongno police station said they were aware of Kim's violent history, but did not consider the possibility that he would show up at the breakfast meeting, despite his ties to the group that hosted it.
When Kim Ki-jong entered the hall where the attack happened, a police officer asked one of the event organizers whether Kim should be allowed to enter, Yun, the Jongno district police chief, said. The organizing official answered that Kim could enter because he was associated with an organization that had been invited to the meeting.
A security expert called the police inept.
"There is no excuse for allowing a blacklisted person to enter the venue for an event like this," said Yu Hyung-chang, a professor at the Kyungnam University in Changwon who served in South Korea's presidential secret service for 20 years until 2000. "If you are going to let him enter, then the very basic thing to do is to have an officer stay close to him at all times."
Pathetic. |
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earthquakez
Joined: 10 Nov 2010
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| Posted: Fri Mar 06, 2015 5:24 am Post subject: |
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| radish kimchi wrote: |
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| Your use of the term 'holocaust' is calculated to offend people of Jewish backgrounds. |
So, the H word is to jews as the N word is to blacks? If you are not a jew you can't say it, but jews can build a holocaust museum?
I didn't initiate using the word, so I wasn't trying to do anything. If you look, I quoted another poster. America did remove substantial regions where native Indians lived. The comparison is not far fetched, and relating it to a holocaust should show I acknowledge jews had horrendous things happen in their history. While I can't claim to be a survivor, I am not any different in this respect with a person who is a jew living today who also wasn't a victim.
So, unless you have a real point to make, let's ignore you threw out the H or J card.
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| So much for your tawdry attacks on the US Ambassador who has not fired a shot at anybody as far as is known. |
He represents the USA. Come on now, this isn't that difficult. He wasn't attacked because of who he is. He was attacked because of who and what he represents.
Your knowledge about the Palestinian cause and Hawaiians is lacking badly. Israel has a state Palestinians don't. their land was taken from them and now they live in 2 regions policed by a government very much like the USA, military based. Should there be an Israel and USA? Yes, but not one at the cost of lives.
Hawaiians want independence, I wasn't stating they were a holocaust. Make sure your reading comprehension is up to snuff.
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| They are always promoting and defending North Korea without having the courage of their convictions to go pack up and live there. |
Maybe they want a 1 Korea, there is no "living there".
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| When this happens there will be no reunification. China will move in and govern North Korea by effective proxy and South Korea will be left with the realisation that the absence of the USA simply cleared the way for domination by China in an extended deja vu. |
Better China than USA.
Why should USA be allowed to go across an ocean and control a country heavily influenced by China? Do other countries do this?
Your replies are biased and favor holocaust thinking. Jews are not the only ones allowed to use this word. |
According to your worldview if the USA ceases to have a military presence in Korea and elsewhere all will be well.
You are sounding like the irrational anti-USA, pro-North Korean regime that starves its own people (to mention just one aspect) SK university students with whom I tried to enter into a logical discussion at a demo against the US military to no avail. When people deal in absolutes then there can never be solutions to such problematic issues. Power and its vaucum are what the history of our world has been and is about.
A power falls or decides to take itself away from somewhere, a new one will take its place. There is no natural progression to a better situation under a new power. That depends on what kind of power is replacing the previous one. There is no indication that China would be remotely better than the USA given its grisly track record that in some instances matches that of North Korea. Harvesting organs from live political prisoners is one instance, dragging back North Korea refugees over the border to their deaths is another, there are other examples.
China is adept at ruling over billions of people who live subsistence lives while the politico-military-industrial establishment enriches itself and sends money offshore to be laundered in the west. This is no alternative to the USA where at least better living standards, income and human rights compensate for its own establishment's problems.
North Korea will be better off without the despotic Kim dynasty under Chinese rule and more people will be fed but China taking over North Korea is hardly the dreamed for reunion that Koreans both rational and irrational want.
You obviously don't understand South Koreans at all if you think they will be happy at the idea let alone the practice of one Korea under the Chinese thumb as that is the only way it will happen if the USA leaves.
Chinese influence in the traditional sense dwindled in Korea with the advent of Japanese colonisation. Yes there is a cultural inheritance but the China of Mao onwards with such destructive episodes as the Cultural Revolution and the descent of what was supposed to be a Peoples' Revolution into the usual cronyism and material privileges of elites and the crushing of democratic movements is hardly compatible with post USA aspirations in Korea.
There are other points you make that are just as invalid but it's time to stop bothering with them as you were given a serve the first time I replied to one of your posts. |
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radish kimchi
Joined: 20 Mar 2014
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| Posted: Fri Mar 06, 2015 5:43 am Post subject: |
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| According to your worldview if the USA ceases to have a military presence in Korea and elsewhere all will be well. |
No. They will have to solve their problems without USA.
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| You are sounding like the irrational anti-USA, pro-North Korean regime |
You didn't see 1 Korea before? This has nothing to do with North and South.
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| There is no indication that China would be remotely better |
There is also no indication China or Russia shouldn't control USA either. However, USA has the right to control their country. If an issue involved Canada or Mexico, I wouldn't look to China to intervene. You are not using common sense to address this. Maybe you are conditioned to spout American rhetoric and ignore location. Allow Asia to solve their problems. Allow the Middle East to solve their problems. USA has medical, health, economic and political issues they need to address before they go around telling other countries what to do.
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| This is no alternative to the USA where at least better living standards, income and human rights compensate for its own establishment's problems. |
I have lived 30 years in the USA and 10 in Asian countries. I personally don't see how living standards are bad here. Chinese homeless people sell things in the street to survive. When I see the homeless in the USA, they are in parks and usually have a bottle of liquor with them.
China has a much longer history than America which isn't even 100 years old if you consider the year the 50th state was established. Chinese don't seem have the complaints westerners think they do. There is a rich section of people living in Beijing (and probably Shanghai too) that feel they have extra rights to things other Chinese don't. That is not a sign of the government but of those with money.
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| You obviously don't understand South Koreans at all if you think they will be happy at the idea let alone the practice of one Korea under the Chinese thumb as that is the only way it will happen if the USA leaves. |
South Koreans have already talked to me about this. They come to China to study because it is cheaper and they go back to Korea to take tests. They also take HSK tests which are Chinese tests.
You obviously don't understand how some Koreans view the USA. Listen to only one side if you want, but there is another side that wants America out. I don't see anything you stated so far that provides an argument for Korea to be run under USA rule.
Instead of posting these long diatribes of nonsense, try typing 4 sentences or less which explain why the USA should be allowed to do what other countries aren't. They are allowed to have nuclear weapons, military bases in other countries, and pick and choose when sanctions will be applied against countries that disagree with them. How about the USA have sanctions against them for human rights violations?
Right now they are keeping the North Koreans starving while supporting the South Koreans. This should be a crime against humanity and the leaders should be sent to the Hague. |
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hogwonguy1979
Joined: 22 Dec 2003
Location: the racoon den
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| Posted: Fri Mar 06, 2015 6:56 am Post subject: |
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MODS PLEASE LOCK THIS THREAD!!!! It's turning into a pissing contest again
Glad to see the Ambassador is doing ok
Hopefully the Korean government will learn its lesson and stop giving suspended sentences to people with a known history of violence. First the guy who burned down Namdaemun, now this. |
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catman
Joined: 18 Jul 2004
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| Posted: Fri Mar 06, 2015 7:42 am Post subject: |
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| radish kimchi wrote: |
Right now they are keeping the North Koreans starving while supporting the South Koreans. This should be a crime against humanity and the leaders should be sent to the Hague. |
Nope. They are responsible for their own misery. North Korea has not been food self-sufficient since the collapse of the Soviet Union. Are you going to blame the gulags on the US as well? |
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radish kimchi
Joined: 20 Mar 2014
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| Posted: Fri Mar 06, 2015 8:37 am Post subject: |
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| catman wrote: |
| radish kimchi wrote: |
Right now they are keeping the North Koreans starving while supporting the South Koreans. This should be a crime against humanity and the leaders should be sent to the Hague. |
Nope. They are responsible for their own misery. North Korea has not been food self-sufficient since the collapse of the Soviet Union. Are you going to blame the gulags on the US as well? |
Hopefully, there will be a 1 Korea again. US, pack up your military presence and leave. |
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catman
Joined: 18 Jul 2004
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| Posted: Fri Mar 06, 2015 10:24 am Post subject: |
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| radish kimchi wrote: |
| catman wrote: |
| radish kimchi wrote: |
Right now they are keeping the North Koreans starving while supporting the South Koreans. This should be a crime against humanity and the leaders should be sent to the Hague. |
Nope. They are responsible for their own misery. North Korea has not been food self-sufficient since the collapse of the Soviet Union. Are you going to blame the gulags on the US as well? |
Hopefully, there will be a 1 Korea again. US, pack up your military presence and leave. |
You obviously have an inability to debate. |
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joelove
Joined: 12 May 2011
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| Posted: Fri Mar 06, 2015 10:32 am Post subject: |
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http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-31743055
This is the only news I've looked at. It gives some details of the guy's "militant past":
In 1985, was part of a group that cut and burned a US flag on the embassy grounds in Seoul, according to South Korea's Yonhap news agency
Visited North Korea at least six times in 2006-07, reportedly planting trees near the border city of Kaesong
In 2007, set himself on fire in front of the presidential office in Seoul, asking for an inquiry into a rape that had allegedly taken place at his office in 1988 (Yonhap)
When in 2010 he hurled concrete at the then Japanese envoy, Toshinori Shigeie, it was the first assault on a foreign ambassador in South Korea; he received a suspended jail term
In 2011, he tried to erect a memorial altar for the late North Korean leader, Kim Jong-il, in the heart of Seoul (Yonhap)
Has also staged one-man protests against Japan over an island dispute (Reuters) |
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catman
Joined: 18 Jul 2004
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| Posted: Fri Mar 06, 2015 10:46 am Post subject: |
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| joelove wrote: |
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-31743055
This is the only news I've looked at. It gives some details of the guy's "militant past":
In 1985, was part of a group that cut and burned a US flag on the embassy grounds in Seoul, according to South Korea's Yonhap news agency
Visited North Korea at least six times in 2006-07, reportedly planting trees near the border city of Kaesong
In 2007, set himself on fire in front of the presidential office in Seoul, asking for an inquiry into a rape that had allegedly taken place at his office in 1988 (Yonhap)
When in 2010 he hurled concrete at the then Japanese envoy, Toshinori Shigeie, it was the first assault on a foreign ambassador in South Korea; he received a suspended jail term
In 2011, he tried to erect a memorial altar for the late North Korean leader, Kim Jong-il, in the heart of Seoul (Yonhap)
Has also staged one-man protests against Japan over an island dispute (Reuters) |
It is one thing to be an apologist for North Korea. It is another to be a supporter of Pyongyang. The man is a nutjob. |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Fri Mar 06, 2015 4:17 pm Post subject: |
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| EZE wrote: |
| Korea doesn't owe any thanks to our generation of Americans (and I agree, by the way), but the current generation of Japanese owes Korea another apology. That's a one way street. Complaining about racism back home and then being an apologist for racially discriminatory policies when they benefit ethnic Koreans is a one way street. |
First, on the Japan issue I made a clear distinction between a personal "owing" and a governmental one. I specifically mentioned that because it is an important situation. I also mentioned someone's estate being different than the individual. The OP didn't say "The Korean government should be eternally grateful". He said Koreans, people and individuals, should be on bended knee. He further explained that he felt that if he were the descendent of slave holders that he would be on bended knee. I disagree with this. He was consistent though.
As far as I know, the only policy which is in question are the CBCs, Drug Tests, and HIV screening. I'd be in favor of those back home if you were going to immigrate. If I went to another country for work and they asked for that, I wouldn't see the request as unreasonable.
Besides, the policy does NOT discriminate on the basis of race. E-2 Korean-Americans/Canadians/etc. are treated the same way. F-series Non-Koreans might be exempt in the same way. It is a question of visa status and nationality, NOT race and ethnicity, contrary to Dave's hysteria and poor understanding of the regulations. |
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earthquakez
Joined: 10 Nov 2010
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| Posted: Fri Mar 06, 2015 5:09 pm Post subject: |
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| hogwonguy1979 wrote: |
MODS PLEASE LOCK THIS THREAD!!!! It's turning into a pissing contest again
Glad to see the Ambassador is doing ok
Hopefully the Korean government will learn its lesson and stop giving suspended sentences to people with a known history of violence. First the guy who burned down Namdaemun, now this. |
No it's not. Whether I agree with them or not other posters are debating the issues and political context of the attack on the Ambassador. This is not the job forum and the fact that the assailant was a fanatical pro North Koreean ROK is quite fairly up for discussion. Why don't you turn your attention to other threads and let people discuss this topic? |
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jcd
Joined: 13 Mar 2012
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| Posted: Fri Mar 06, 2015 5:13 pm Post subject: |
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| Rhetorical . there is no good justification for some things, you can get their reasoning, and try to figure out their story. But seeing things a crazy persons way or groups way is usually pointless. Even large mobs are wrong and crazy often; they usually want more for themselves because they are hopeless and desperate so they create a big straw man. |
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