Korean Job Discussion Forums

[Homer]

[Kiddirts]

I really don't want to give away too many trade secrets, but I've met too many people that would like to save only $10,000 after an entire of year of teaching and will turn down work that I cannot take because it would interfere with their life of leisure. Everyone's make-up is different, so if a coasting lifestyle best suits you, so be it. Everyone has their own reason for being here.

[Dr. Buck]

I make no bones about it: I'm in Korea for the money. Always have been for six and a a half years. Matters of the heart of have kept me here and the Korean chapter of my life has been an interesting and profitable one. I'm at a time in my life where it is crucial that I play things out smart financially. Salting the treasure chest with private cashola helps meet those ends.

I don't teach privates any longer. I had a good year-long run of them and the proceeds are in a US mutual fund. Now it's break time for six months to work on other projects, and then perhaps I'll get back into the game.

Each to their own. I am a mercenary. Some people are slaves, others have themselves sorted out with financial freedom.

Education and business will always be mixed together. From day care schools, to paying money for guitar lessons, to University admissions programs that bump American students for the out-of-country higher-paying Korean students--well, it's a weird mix.

A friend of mine hasn't been paid in three months at the hogwon he works for. He wasted his savings away traveling, and he wasted the previous contract year doing pretty much nothing when he could have been building a safety nest egg via privates for the hard times. He is down to his last few won and I'm expecting a call any day now for a loan. Who's the slave?

With e-2 system, the hogwon owns your home, your primary source of income, your right to stay and work in Korea, and bans you from other sources of income. Who's the slave? When you think for a moment and add all of that together--the e-2 system has much control over your life.

Beav--same with me--almost--live comfortably, 21 hours, 4 months vaca.

Even though that's a nice deal, I think it is prudent to empower one's singular income with supplementary outside profits. My wife's income adds an additional cushion for me. With smart and simple budgeting, anyone alone can sock away a mill a month. But for some people that's not enough. It's boring. It's not going to get me where I want to be in the next ten years.

Homer--am I a slave to the dollar? Perhaps. My financial ideals are like that in the "Millionaire Next Door," by Thomas J. Stanley. Pretty simple stuff. I just want to get where I'm going, that's all.

Privates are illegal. That weighs on my conscience like a sinner's burden--hehehehe. Watching a student develop language skills because of my time and effort (and getting properly compensated for those efforts) is such a terrible thing, isn't it?

[Glad-4-Vlad]

Greetings, all!

Lurker-turned-poster, finally.


I don't think it's mercenary to do a job that you might do well, but do it for proper compensation. How many people would do it for nothing? Or, for housing/meals/incidentals paid for, but no salary? There are only so many of those lucky people who actually DO for a career what they TRULY love (and if you're one, good on ya!). The rest of us do what we can, or what we're good at, even if it's not our true passion. And, do it for the money, so we might pursue our true passion, fully funded!


By the way, I'm former EG Language Institute teacher, Kangnam (Daechi)division ('99). Anyone else an EG alum? Mr. Jung the director--good guy. Enjoyed my time there immensely, and loved the co-workers, too--all good people. I'd teach for him any time. Now back home in the US of A. . . . Go Angels!

Cheers.

[Badmojo]

[the_beaver]

[Homer]

No dumping on Dr. Buck (aptly named!).

Just responding to his money at any cost philosophy.

Also to the slave thing which is a crock of horse dung.

As for having a lot of money...well thats relative.

I have been here since 1997 and this has given me the chance to buy a house back home which is paying for itself and to start planning for my retirement (financially).
But, I also like to balance work and leisure.
I am also married to a Korean woman and we plan to stay here for a while longer. I like to spend time with my nieces too.
So loading up on pvts just to max out my buck is not something I view as positive.
Now, there is nothing wrong with making money. We all work to earn a good living.
However, there is something wrong when as a teacher making money becomes your primary goal as this all to often puts the student in second place.

A decent wage is important but there are many teachers here who are grossly overpaid and who provide sub-par services and this is sometime just the result of loading up too much.

As for privates, my view on them is that they are illegal, hence not to be done.
I have way too much to lose here to risk it to earn a few extra bucks with pvts.

[Real Reality]

Where are the salary scales for teachers, college instructors, and university professors working in Korea? Are they compensated for experience and education?

For example,
Higher education institutions throughout England, Wales, Northern Ireland, and Scotland
Association of University Teachers
salary scales from 1 August 2003
1
24,097-24,820
2
24,951-25,699
3
26,327-27,166
4
27,174-27,989
5
28,279-29,128
6
29,478-30,363
7
30,640-31,544
http://www.aut.org.uk/media/html/he2000scales.html

[Dr. Buck]

Beav--that jab wasn't intended for you specifically--it was for everyone in the esl business in Korea.

Homer--I don't think that comparing the E-2 visa system to slavery is so far fetched. We're just one step up from the 3D workers here. Let's say you're a good person that gets caught in a bad scenerio:

you get fired for arbitrary reasons . . . your school is bankrupt and no salary is coming your way . . . you're stuck in a situation where you must leave like a "prisoner of wonderland" sort of deal . . . you get beaten up by your boss like that recent thread here . . . you're getting farmed out against visa rules to some local kiddie school . . . do I need to go on?

So there you are in this crapola situation even though you played the Korean game to your utmost--polite and understanding, organized and teaching well, going with the flow of weirdness as life in Korea dictates . . .

And in an instant upon your firing or resignation:
You have no home. You must do something with all of your personal items. You have no income. You must leave the country very soon or face some sort of fine. What do you do with your stuff? Your car? You have to leave the country. Sometimes, any money that is owed to you does not appear.

If you're in a situation where you want that--you want to quit and move onto something better . . . you can't because of the letter of release . . . and if the act of asking for a letter of release does not resemble slavery then I don't know what does. "Please, master wonjangnim, will ya let me go, will ya let me be free! Will ya give me the letter of release so I can pursue other things?"

They way I see it, the only edge a waygook teacher has here is to load up on some privates to develop a cash cushion against those inevitable weird turns to bad situations. Have enough finances built-up (via privates) to walk away from bad situations and not be desperate. Yo be able to hop on a visa run flight and have no worries about financing the transition. Too many times I've seen teachers simply depending way too much on their primary school for their income--the school starts losing students, teacher's salaries arrive later and later, bills back home are missed, etc. Often these types are fresh off the plane with $300 to their name and they get the first two million won and blow it, and another month later, the hogwon is bankrupt. This board is a testament to those sorts of things happening.

No, Homer, you don't have much to lose by teaching privates other than opportunity cost. Please stop perpetuating the myth that the immigration gestapo is right around the corner. If you're on a F-2 its a slap on the wrist. If you're on an E-2, its a reasonable business risk. If you're on an E-2 and work for a jaebol or a government agency--no worries.


June 15, 2000
You'll Never Guess What South Korea Frowns Upon

by Casey J. Lartigue Jr
Casey Lartigue, who is now at the Cato Institute, returned from teaching in South Korea two years ago.

"Although I generally consider myself to be a law-abiding citizen, I don't mind admitting that I engaged in illegal work in South Korea for the better part of six years. My clients were more than willing to pay under the table for the illicit services I provided. And, for the right price, I was more than happy to render that service: teaching their children English."
http://www.cato.org/dailys/06-15-00.html

[Homer]

Buck,

Interesting take on things.

However, the slave comparison still does not hold up and we are a heck of a lot better off then 3D workers

You can walk away from your job if you wish and if you know how to stand up for yourself.

You do not have to depend on your school for housing as no housing contracts are available....then again that requires some initiative.


As for privates while on an E-2...the deportation is not a
myth. It is something I personnaly withnessed a few times since I arrived. There are also fines and other measures.
Its not a high risk mind you but it is a risk.
In the end it is also illegal which may not mean a lot to you but does mean something to me.
There is more then money to a job or a life.

You will only find yourself in the dire stituation you mentionned if you let yourself be placed there.
Enough of this its all them and poor us crap. In every situation responsibility is not limited to one side.

If your school goes bankrupt: find other work in Korea (quite easy), go somewhere else (not that hard), go back home (always an option).


The beaten up by your boss story was posted on here a while back and reeked of B.S..
Even if it was true, you cannot in good conscience say that this is a common occurence.

You only get farmed out if you allow that to happen.

In short, enforce your rights (you have many) and show some initiative.

You can look for better work and get it if you inform yourself properly.
However, just dumping a job where you were well treated to move to something else is a crap thing to do but lets not mention that after all its all about freedom right?

[VanIslander]

[Real Reality]

ANYBODY have a legitimate salary scale for teachers, college instructors, and university professors working in Korea? Where are the salary scales for teachers, college instructors, and university professors working in Korea? Are they compensated for experience and education?

For example,
University of Alberta
Assistant Professor: 47,184 -- 66,816
Associate Professor: 58,636 -- 83,860
Professor: 72,990 -- 82,877
ESL Employees: 35999 -- 53071
http://www.hrs.ualberta.ca/Salaries/index.aspx?Page=443

Higher education institutions throughout England, Wales, Northern Ireland, and Scotland
Association of University Teachers
salary scales from 1 August 2003
1
24,097-24,820
2
24,951-25,699
3
26,327-27,166
4
27,174-27,989
5
28,279-29,128
http://www.aut.org.uk/media/html/he2000scales.html

[TheUrbanMyth]

[kiwiboy_nz_99]

[Homer]

Indeed kiwi.

That was a good take on one side of things.

Busy people do tend to get more done...however tired people tend to slack off in certain areas to compensate. If this "area" becomes their legal job (hakwon, uni..ect) that is where the problem can start.

I also know of may people here doing pvts that get paid 40 000W or more per hour and see these pvts as just sitting there with the students (usually kids) and play games.

The very fact that pvts are not very well regulated leaves the door open for this on many occasions.

There are of course many teachers doing pvts who do an excellent job.