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Grotto
Joined: 21 Mar 2004
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 Posted: Sat Jul 31, 2004 9:36 am Post subject: contracts |
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I give advice on contracts as many people come over here, sign crappy contracts and then get screwed around for a year. If by giving some advice...ie: pointing out the truly stupid and outrageous items in the contracts at least I can give them a heads up.
If a hogwan is unwilling to negotiate its contract chances are it will be unwilling to be flexible in any way and possibly demanding.
My personal favorite is the 30 hours a week. What constitutes an hour? During which hours do the classes fall? Is it splits?
All of these questions should be addressed in the contract before you sign it.
Also many of the people coming over here are fresh out of college or uni and have very little backbone(standing up for themselves) or knowledge of how the world works. They come in innocent and get taken advantage of they should have some idea that not all hogwan owners are on the up and up. |
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trevorcollins
Joined: 02 Jul 2004
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| Posted: Sat Jul 31, 2004 5:59 pm Post subject: |
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| Sure, why not ? Just as long as it's made perfectly clear to them that a contract is only as reliable as the director that signs it. Don't come to Korea under any circumstances without the ability to buy a plane ticket and leave as soon as you get jerked around too much. The contract is a good start, but it's not legally binding so in the end nit picking over the wording on certain clauses is no substitute for actually talking to teachers on the ground at the school. |
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Grotto
Joined: 21 Mar 2004
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| Posted: Sat Jul 31, 2004 6:35 pm Post subject: what?! |
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| trevorcollins wrote: |
| but it's not legally binding so in the end nit picking over the wording on certain clauses is no substitute for actually talking to teachers on the ground at the school. |
Okay the contract is legally binding  A contract is a contract Just because there are directors and owners that violate the contract does not mean the contract is at fault
If you sign a vague ambiguous contract full of stupid clauses then you deserve to get jerked around. A contract that protects both you and the school is a good idea. I have pointed out many times that the requested work is not in my contract.
Contracts are legally binding in Korea...but like many legalities they are not often enforced |
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prosodic
Joined: 21 Jun 2004
Location: ����
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| Posted: Sat Jul 31, 2004 6:57 pm Post subject: Re: what?! |
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| Grotto wrote: |
| Contracts are legally binding in Korea...but like many legalities they are not often enforced |
Yes, they are legally binding as long as they're written well. They are not legally binding when they are written in violation of Korean law. In that case, the minimum standards in Korean law overrule the contract. Contracts are most important for salary and benefits that go beyond those mandated by Korean law.
Most of the contracts that I have seen violate Korean law. When I'm asked to sign a contract, I always make sure to demand that any clauses that violate Korean law get rewritten. Sometimes that results in the employer looking for somebody more naive. Sometimes the employer didn't know it violated Korean law, gets embarrassed, and corrects it. I've experienced the latter situation very recently. It helps to be able to refer to the exact Act, Article, and paragraph of Korean law. For me, part of the contract negotiation is a test of the employer. If an employer reacts poorly when I point out that a contract clause violates Korean law, then I feel like that employer fails my test. If an employer reacts well, then I feel like that employer passed my test. |
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trevorcollins
Joined: 02 Jul 2004
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| Posted: Mon Aug 02, 2004 9:23 am Post subject: Re: what?! |
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| Grotto wrote: |
| trevorcollins wrote: |
| but it's not legally binding so in the end nit picking over the wording on certain clauses is no substitute for actually talking to teachers on the ground at the school. |
Okay the contract is legally binding A contract is a contract Just because there are directors and owners that violate the contract does not mean the contract is at fault
If you sign a vague ambiguous contract full of stupid clauses then you deserve to get jerked around. A contract that protects both you and the school is a good idea. I have pointed out many times that the requested work is not in my contract.
Contracts are legally binding in Korea...but like many legalities they are not often enforced |
With the amount of horror stories I know of people who've been screwed by the Department of Justice, Department of Labor, whatever when they try to fight for what their contract says they are "legally" entitled to I'd say that by legally binding you mean um, optional. Don't just base your assesment on how the world should be, like a John Lennon song. Base it on experience and reality.
In a way you're right, a good contract is a good start, but in no way close to the job security that comes with advance research about the hagwon and maintaining a good relationship with your director to make yourself indispensible.
Ironically an EPIK contract I almost signed a few years ago violated Korean labor law itself. And this is effectively the government recruiting agency. A government department breaking the labor law haha why wouldn't some seedy little hagwon boss feel he's able to do the same ? |
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