Korean Job Discussion Forums

[Mickey]

A word of warning about this school.

My problem is not big by hogwan standards but I am posting it for general information and will blacklist the school and continue to broadcast their failings until they cough up. Why ? Because I have given them every chance to be reasonable and they have failed. And when we let hogwans get away with it even on a moderate scale they will continue to make life difficult for other people. And in the power imbalance between hogwan/employee the internet is an equaliser that should be used.
My Korean partner will also broadcast their failings on Korean language sites and we will complain to the Ministry of Labor for breach of the Labor Standards Act.

I resigned from this school about two years ago after seven months cos of breach of contract by the school. A family member died and I was entitled to emergency leave to attend the funeral. Rather than doing their best to help me they made my leave conditional upon paying a W1,000,000 bond to the school (in breach of my contract, cos emergency leave was unconditional) which at the time almost made it impossible for me to attend the funeral in New Zealand. I was dissatisfied with this so when I returned I gave them the required 2 months notice in my contract. (Unlike three other dissatisfied teachers who did the midnight run during my time there.)

When I finished at this hogwan they took W300,000 out of my last pay to cover any outstanding bills and then pay the balance to me. Well, I settled all my apartment bills with my roomate before I left and left my room in immaculate condition. All that had to be paid was one cellphone bill by Director Hong Jae Hwa, probably about W 50,000.

But that was the last I saw of my W300,000 and Hong Jae Hwa. Hong Jae Hwa gave me the standard run around after I left. I call him, he promises to pay the money owing into my account asap, I wait, nothing happens. I Repeat this process half a dozen times over the next few months and he stops answering my phone calls and doesn't return my messages. When I do catch him out by phoning from a different number I get the same promise followed by failure to pay, again.

I tried calling him at SLP Ilsan. But he wasn't there because he was working at another SLP hogwan, though still a Director at SLP Ilsan. So I visited SLP Ilsan twice but on both ocassions he wasn't there, the other directors couldn't speak english, and the academic supervisor refused to translate. Instead she fobbed me off, telling me to phone Hong Jae Hwa because she said only he knew about my money. So I telephoned him again and he didn't answer or return my messages.....

Of course the school cancelled my visa when I finished and Mr Hong may have been hoping I would just leave and he could pocket my cash. Well, I came back and got a good job at a great school. And I'm not leaving till I get my money.

I was going to put it down to experience, not a bad option depending on circumstances, but since decided why should I let them keep my hard earned cash ?

So I e-mailed the school a week ago, sent a follow up e-mail, and they didn't answer...So that's my experience and given their continued failure to pay me I would have to recommend against working there.

[email protected]

[rudyflyer]

sorry this happened to you but I think its time to write this one off. If they haven't come up with the money after 2 years then they'll never fork it over.

blacklist the school and move on

[dutchman]

The sickness and death of a family member is one of the biggest nightmares for us expats. Unfortunately, some of our cowardly 'colleagues' have lied about such things in order to escape their hagwon and/or Korea without a big conflict. I don't think it was unreasonable for the hagwon to ask for some kind of bond. They invested a lot of money in you and you had only worked there for a short time.

[Skippy]

Good Post Mickey - Lots of detail.

Well Mick I think you just have to give up getting the cash. Likely the manager is gone. And it is only 300,000 in the end you got of ok.

As to paying a bond to go to a Funeral - Bullsh)t. IF the bond was to a third party maybe I would but not for a Funeral. And that bond I am guessing was not refundable. Ya Mickey comes back after a month say OK I am ready to work can I have my money please. "What money?"

Yes people do abuse this as an excuse - "My Grandma died". It is much better and less confrontational then - "I Hate you - I want you to die, you make my life hell".

Skippy the Evil Twin

[Harvard Material]

WOW! "Well Mick I think you just have to give up getting the cash."Skippy.
"Sorry this happened to you but I think its time to write this one off." Rudyflyer.

Hard to believe. When will esl teachers begin helping one another instead of saying '...well, you got burned. better luck next time...'? Regardless how you say it, that's what is being said here.

The hakwon owners love that attitude; they prey on it. I swear, 90% of the foreign teacers here give up on such financial issues because they are so quickly discouraged, feel that they have no recourse, and any attempt at collecting money owed is futile. I disagree. I know it isn't an easy task. What Rudyflyer and Skippy - I think - are trying to say is that there will be a fair bit of frustration involved, and it may be worth considering dropping the issue.

If this 'Mickey' individual has proof of his/her statements I believe he/she can/will be compensated; if he/she is willing to but up a bit of a fight for it. I certainly would, and I have had to here in Seoul before. I also collected what was owed to me.

Mickey worked for 7 months, so forget about the recruiting fee and/or airfare to Korea. He/She provided the conditional notice, and left. Didn't run like other's did, and probably regrets it.

Maybe I am wrong Skippy, but I understood the oustanding amount was 1,000,000won in form of a retainer for the funeral leave, plus the 300,000 residence deposit for outstanding bills.
Forgive me if I am wrong (and please clarify this for us Mickey), but I read the total deduction as being 1.3 million won (not including the money apparently left with the roomie).

Mickey! Keep e-mailing. Telephone. Fax. Drop by the office, and if you have the time watch and wait for the owner to arrive. Make it very clear that you want what was promised originally. IF YOU CAN PROVE IT. You need documents showing the full amounts, and nothing less.

I wonder how much money is witheld from esl eachers on a yearly basis here...it must be a staggering figure. Especially when individual's just leave and let the owner prosper. slp eh? Sound familliar to anyone else?

I mean no disrespect to Rudyflyer or Skippy, but I must disagree with their advice. Your choice Mickey. Let us now if it is worth the fight, if you collect, or if you give up.

[Mickey]

Thanks for the responses guys .

The advice to give up on the cash might be good advice for most people in a similar situation who have far more pressing issues to cope with in Korea, and might fairly consider I got off lightly compared to their troubles! But as I find myself in a comfortable situation with some time available I find I am able to revisit the issue at least as far as blacklisting the school and formalising my complaints so I will do so. Though now its as much a matter of principle as cash. There's a couple of general issues..First its good to know Korean law gives us up to three years to claim unpaid wages. Second, if people always give up when they receive the run around, then it will remain entrenched in hogwan culture. I guess I'm not counting on getting my cash back...but at least I will get some satisfaction.

As for the bond. I was not concerned with the reasonableness of it but the legality. In my view the school had compromised my contractual rights, and the imposition of a bond was illegal contra the Labor Standards Act as prescription of penalty.

As to reasonableness, maybe some people abuse the 'family funeral' xcuse to get out of the country, but in my case I don't think it was at all likely. If I was not intending to return it would have made sense for me to wait for payday (I left mid month with two weeks pay owing to me) and just disappear as other teachers had done, rather than notify the hogwan owner, buy a return ticket through him and pay for my re-entry visa. From my point of view I felt I was punished for being honest, my integrity was insulted, and by the school squabbling with me over the bond I missed the early flight and missed the actual funeral service.

AS another aside, when I handed in my resignation upon my return to Korea, as per my contract giving 60 days notice. The same Director Hong Jae Hwa who later did the runner with my cash accused me of breaking the contract by resigning..I tried to explain to him that the contract itself provided for the twelve month term to be shortened by proper notice, so what I had done by giving notice was to comply with the contract...Like talking to a brick wall !

[Mickey]

To clarify, the amount I am after is the 300,000. I got the other amount back.

The funeral bond issue, and I will spare you the details of the arguments before they would let me leave, was the reason I decided to resign. Though they did refund that amount when I came back to Korea the fight over it and having to find it on top of buying my airfare when I had shipped my cash back to NZ...well, it made me late for my family obligations.

[Harvard Material]

...OK. If it is only 300,000 I wouldn't press for it. I am in areement with Rudyflyer and Skippy now. I wasn't sure if you were paid the 1,000,000 retainer.

For 300,000won? Go ahead and post what you like. I think it's your right to explain for future teacher's applying at that branch (in my opinion the majority of that very chain), what happened during your time there. slp's have a wicked reputation. Some stories are made up, I know, but a very small percentage I think.

You may not (most likely), see another dime from the owner, but you won't have to see him either! I could be a lot worse Mickey. Some people? It's worth a few hundred bucks to have them out of your life, and it's taxfree!!

[jajdude]

Yep. Had a few bad ol' nites worth more than 300,000 won, lol

[The Great Wall of Whiner]

Oh Mickey (you're so fine) wrote:

[rapier]

I think the key to making sure you're paid in the first place is to make sure that the boss doesn't hold much power over you, so he can't s***w you. My boss was holding myoriginal certificates as some sort of insurance against my leaving...and then was slow in paying me..he held all the cards. I kept asking for them back, but to no avail. one day i just raided his office and took them back myself. We argued, but next day he paid me, afraid that I could leave anytime with no worries. Likewise he wanted to keep hold my passport, but i made sure i got the reciept off him and picked it up in person from immigration.. just don't let them hold anything of yours, or have anything on you...they can be very manipulative.

[Lost Seoul]

Mickey

You might want to post your story on the guestbook at this site

http://www.geocities.com/slphell/

[Slinky]

i kinda know how you feel, i'm still owed over 2.5 million and still no-one in korea will help!! whyyyyyyyyyyyy? (go on then, i'll say that's a typo)

[Harvard Material]

Hey Slinky...from who? What hakwon?? Same one this thread is about? How long has it been, and how can you prove what you are owed? You have proof in document form?

[Slinky]

ECY Kidsland in Chungju-Si. "Mr Koo" (has a real name but dodgily didn't want me to know it) ripped me off completely. Long story but the greedy boss wanted one of the teachers to leave as the hagwon was losing students to the newly opened hagwons down the road. He guaranteed in front of English and Korean witnesses in a meeting that if one of the teachers chose to leave instead of him firing one of us then there woudn't be any charges for doing so and the flights would still be paid. I wasn't happy there anyway so chose to leave instead of him firing my colleague who he knew was crap at teaching English (that's what the manager had told me he was going to do if neither of us decided). I asked for the conditions to be set out properly on paper and was told not to worry - "You can trust me! I not been bad hagwon boss have I?" When I wasn't paid at the middle of the next month I got worried. I had never been given a pay slip or evidence of tax paid anyway even when I repeatedly asked for one - it's supposedly required by law. When he had a chat with my recruiter they decided between them that they would get as much out of me as possible and told me they would be keeping all my accrued pay and bonuses - I would have to pay the return flights which were World Cup time so amounted to over 1 million - in the contract this is stated but I stupidly listened to "his word" saying that I wouldn't have to pay. Plus a recruiter's fee of 1 million for the pleasure of finding another teacher to replace me (which they weren't going to do and never did do after all, I've since found out). In the contract this fee is to be decided by ECY headquarters themselves only if me leaving was one-sided (which it obviously wasn't - the director asked for one of us to leave!!). ECY hq were never involved even when I pleased with them to help me - my emails are still unanwered and my phone calls were ignored. They also wouldn't pay my bonus which was in my contract to amount up even if I left early or would have been fired - this was nearly 500,000. Meanwhile I was still teaching and demanding to be paid - and wasn't paid for that either. In the end the boss threatened me with his big friends, tried to punch me for being an ignorant foreigner who disagreed with having to leave with nothing and lied about what he had told me in the meeting - I said there were witnesses including a respectable manager and an English teacher - he said "Prove it bitch". Nice man!! Before I was beaten to death by some crazy soju-laden friends of his (I had met them - they were nasty) I packed my bags in 4 hours flat, left my furniture and so many belongings there and went to the airport. I intended on returning to get my stuff but I've been ill for months so haven't been able to do. In the meantime I've tried every avenue of getting my pay back as it was illegally witheld, I know this now by reading reports and info - this wasn't available to me at the time and if it had been I would have contacted the Labor Board straight away. Burned and wary now. I want to go back to Korea but there's so many reasons not to.