Korean Job Discussion Forums

[some waygug-in]

After reading about the hot spoon incident, I thought I would relate something I witnessed in Busan last weekend.

I was headed to Young Kwang book store in Seomyeon. On the way,there is a small kind of park (not a park really but a small area with a few trees and some benches)
I decided to buy some lunch and sit quietly by myself.

A few feet away at the next bench were 3 Koreans. 2 were well above retirement age, one was in his 40's.
One guy looked like a street bum, he was dressed in filthy clothes and looked like he needed a shave and perhaps a shower. He had a cart with puppies in a cage. I think there were about 5 or 6 dogs in the cage.
I am not sure exactly what was going on, as my Korean is not that great, but I think it had something to do with the dogs in the cage.

Anyway, what happened next was that one of the older Koeans walked up to the bum guy and started hassling him about the dogs. He seemed to be threatening to let them all go or something, but I'm not sure. Then they started arguing, pushing, shouting.

The weird part was that eventhough I felt sorry for the dogs, I felt even more sorry for the poor old man who had them in the cage. The othe guy was well dressed, and seemed pretty well off....... but I could tell he was drunker than a skunk.

After a few minutes of hassling this old bum, finally the bum gets up and buys some soju and offers everyone a drink .... even me. Then the well dressed guy got even angrier, because the bum hadn't bought the right brand of alcohol. He called the bum a few names, jerked one of the bottles of soju out of his hands and went back to the store and exchanged it for whatever kind he wanted. Then he returned and handed the bottle to the 40 year old guy and proceeded to yell, push, slap, and hit the bum.
He pushed him to the ground several times, slapped him across the head and all the while hurled insults at him.

I wanted to step in, but I really didn't understand what was going on, so I thought it best to just stay out of it. What I found strange was that all around Koreans were standing around laughing, nobody would lift a finger.

I finally just walked away in disgust.

I don't care what the bum did, he really didn't deserve that kind of treatment.

[Demophobe]

There's always a story behind things...

Perhaps the "bum" was the "well-dressed" dude's brother who stole his wife, money and car a few years back and then fell on hard times. The "well-dressed" brother was asked for forgiveness, but he said he would only put up with "bum" brothers presence if he could berate him publicly for "X" years.

Maybe it was street theater?

A new reality show called "inhumane" in which the players do despicable acts to the less fortunate. This is most plausable, with the digression of TV and "entertainment" and the rise of "let's watch someone lose something important" reality programming.

Perhaps it was a carefully orchestrated show just for you.

[squat toilet]

[khyber]

howsabout some guy was getting treated like fucking shit. Couldn't THAT be enough reason to step in?

I was on public transit last year....taking the bus from my small city into busan. A guy got on the bus at the last stop before we got on the expressway. Him and the driver started arguing: I also couldn't tell what it was about but the rider didn't put money in. So i would assume it was about that. The driver took off while he and the rider were screaming at each other. Once we'd been on the highway for about 5 mins, cruising at around 90km, it had been calm for about 10 seconds and the rider REACHED around and started to choke the fucking bus driver. And this guy wasn't even drunk. So he's choking the bus driver. Now the bus is full. We swerve across a lane and bounce off the guard rail that seperates the two directions of traffic. I grab the woman and child beside me. A group of 5 or 6 middle school girls are screaming and freakin out. Everyone on the bus is really scared but the driver manages to slow down and get us under control (pretty amazing really).
Than the fucking loser has the GALL to yell at the bus driver MORE!!! An older man FINALLY puts his hand on the guys shoulder to calm him down and move him away. It doesn't matter.
Now if someone had stepped in earlier, the situation could have been averted. But we both know that Koreans are not as outgoing with strangers as people back home. If Koreans can feel uncomfortable helping people who are kind, how well do you think they're gonna do with someone who is yelling and screaming. Claiming that a bunch of koreans were sitting watching don't mean shit. of COURSE they were, it's not a part of what they know to confront a situation like that.

AFter driving another few minutes the route happenned to go past a police station. we let him off there. No telling what kind of payment he had to make to escape justice there. :roll:

This is a thing i'm just starting to get into...but there has to be physical violence for me to step in and i'll tell you, even just watching the verbal fights i've seen (few though they have been) 9x outta 10 it is someone with an obvious advantage (height, age, strength, gender) who is the abuser. Do you think that is a coincidence almost EVERY SINGLE time?

[Demophobe]

"Stepping in" really isn't an option in Korea. No matter how well-intentioned you may be, you will not succeed in what you believe to be the right thing.

Unless one can speak Korean well enough to 1. undestand the screaming and thus really know what's going on past the "look" of it, and 2. speak well enough to explain your intentions to the "offending" party or the police, then one had best just keep to themselves in these matters.

Besides, we all know that imposing our ideas on this place just doesn't work, no matter how "universal" we think our attitude may be.

The above bus story is extreme. I still wouldn't have stepped between them, unless I knew that their yelling would end in a near multiple-fatality choking of the driver. However, how could anyone know it would come to that? Like I said, it's extreme; enough so to be out of the statistically useful margins.

For the most part, gettting into these things is just pointless, useless, damaging to ourselves and percieved as "being a nosey foreigner".

If I were arguing/fighting in the street back in Canada, and some non-English speaking dude ran up and started bellowing in an unknown language, attepting to break up whatever we had going on, my attention may quickly shift away from the previous issue and on to the new one; who on earth does this guy think he is?! He has no idea of the situation, can't understand the problem, can't explain what he's doing....a long list of not good things being done by the "good guy".

These are not my personal views, nor are they probably the majority of users here on Dave's. Apathy is a bad thing. These are however, my Korean views; I have no place in the middle of 2 Koreans having it out.

It isn't about heart, it's about self-preservation. If you want to go the police box for a few hours, pay "pain" money, do a night in the can or at worst, all of the above plus deportation, then by all means, step in. I know my place in this society....well on the outside.

JMHO. Flame away.

[khyber]

i'm not about to flame. those are my opinions...i was just a bit passionate about them.

to put it more simply, frankly, I am not too concerned what one or two koreans think... or even the groups watching us.
I am not going to be malicious about my help; just step in, not even to protect, just to help escape, or at best, divert, which isn't an option cause my korean ain't quite that good. But even if you just step in and pay attention to the reciever of the blows and try to comfort. If he doesn't accept, i don't push it. But damn, you gotta do SOMETHING don't you? Do you feel good about the idea of someone getting the absolute shit pummelled outta them right there on the street? .

Besides that, you can sometimes tell in body language the seriousness of the argument...and the context (if it's in a dark alley in the middle of night in some tucked away dong, i prolly wouldn't help, but if it's on a street corner.

I just can't imagine that so many people in this country have so many grievances with so many other people who have wronged them in so many ways. And as noted, there is almost always some sort of advantage had by the accuser.

[Daechidong Waygookin]

Sparkx..I mean squat toilet is trying to become the new DW?

I agree with ST. Its not your friggin place to step in hagwon boy. This isnt your country, you understand what, 3% of whats being said? How the hell can you even contemplate stepping in when you havent even got a clue what is going on? Realize its not your place to step into anything but dog poo in this country. Not a dispute between two strangers, a family dispute or the Dokdo thing. ITS NOT YOUR PLACE. Your niche is to teach english at a haggie and get drunk in Itaewon. Nothing else.

Stepping in? WTF are you? Bruce Lee or Superman?

[squat toilet]

[Daechidong Waygookin]

You gotta stop trying to invade my niche as the sole non b.s.-er.

[squat toilet]

[some waygug-in]

I really have to wonder about some of you.

I said I didn't step in (for all the above mentioned reasons) but I also said I wanted to.

No, they did not know each other. I may not be a genius, but I could tell that much.

The bum was just sitting there minding his own business when the drunk adjoshi came up and started hassling him.

As far as I could tell, it was a case of some rich *beep* picking on the guy because he was poor, defenseless and a street bum.

I may not have understood the exact details of everything, but that much was pretty clear.

Why is it my business? Obviously it isn't.

Why is it America's business what happened in Iraq? (I'm not saying I agree with the Iraq war by any means either)

Why did anyone bother fighting in WWII, for that matter? It was none of our business.

Why did we bother to send peace keepers to trouble spots around the world? It's none of our business.

Why did you even bother to respond to my post? It's none of your business.

[VanIslander]

I saw a middle-aged guy slapping around, even punching, a woman several times, yelling at her. Others just walked by, averting their eyes or looking at the scene. I, the only waygook around, stopped and proceeded to stare at him in a pretty expressionless Clint Eastwood sort of way. When he saw me he said something loud, hit her one more time, then looked at me again, paused, said something more, then walked away, leaving the woman to sob next to the curb. I called a taxi and handed the driver a 10,000 w and directed her into the cab. I have no idea where she told the driver to go. Could've been back to the abuser's place for all I know.

But sometimes you just gotta do something, for your own sake. I can tolerate many differences in Korea, I even appreciate many things other foreigners find annoying, but there's no way in hell I will tolerate a bigger guy beating up a small woman while I do nothing. One has to draw one's own line somewhere. That's where mine is.

[Daechidong Waygookin]

[khyber]

[Barking Mad Lord Snapcase]