Korean Job Discussion Forums

[TobyWhite]

So my boss caled me on Tuesday and said Thursday would be my last day of work. I said I was owed 30 days of notice (or the equivalent pay), as is stated in my contract and - so I thought - in Korean labour law. She said she doesn't have to give me notice or a release letter.

I went to the Labor Office today and they told me becuase I have been working less than six months (5.5 months) she does not have to give me notice. So I have no rights until I've finished half my contract? They wouldn't even let me fill out a complaint form. Is there anything else I can do? Can I go to another Labor Office in another city? Is there any way to get my release letter?

Thanks for the help everyone.

________________________________________________________
Burning the Morning Calm

[Austin]

You obviously made a grave miscalculation by not listening to all of the warnings given to you by your employer. No doubt the learning curve is very steep in Korea. I only hope for your sake that you gain something of value from your experience.

Why do you want to take action against your employer?

They were more than generous to both of you, but you made the decision to defy them. It is sure to be a bitter pill, but in this case all you can do is swallow it and move on.

If you remember the truth about why this happened to you, rather than blame your employer, you might prevent this from happening to you again.

Sorry to read about your parents. I hope Thailand was worth your time.

SCSA

[Circus Monkey]

My advice is check out this link:

http://efl-law.com/

CM

[Butterfly]

Dear Toby,

I can highly recommend the site provided to you by Circus Monkey.

Do bear in mind that if your boss is releasing you from your employment before six months then she is essentially forfeiting any profit she had planned to make on you. Six months is generally the break-even point for hakwon bosses, so chances are she has lost money on you, and that she wants you out so quickly does indicate that you have likely done some damage to the goodwill of the school, and the working environment within it. I however, take all this back if she is dismissing you because of poor registration and her fending off bankrupcy.

Thus my advice to you is to suggest that teaching perhaps isn't for you and maybe you should consider going home, I suspect if you take another job in Korea there is more trouble waiting for you and your prospective boss.

[TobyWhite]

[Austin]

It is regrettable that you postpone acknowledging the destructive role that you played in creating the situation that you find yourself in now.

Mrs. Choi is not withholding anything that does not rightfully belong to her. You are required to reimburse her for your airfare, since you failed to abide by the stipulations in your contract. Moreover, you are required to pay for your telephone bill and other utilities, and she is not required to provide you with a letter of release. Furthermore, because of your blatant misconduct and failure to fulfill your contractual obligations, she does not have to provide you with any notice, as she repeatedly warned you that if you went, you would be fired!

How straightforward does a person have to be with you, before you can figure out that what they are saying is the truth? Did you think she was bluffing?

When you have a contractual obligation to fulfill certain requirements, you are not free to live your own life. If you killed a person over the weekend, should your employer be required to still employ you or give you notice before you can be released?

Of course not, because you are a direct threat to the company and the school. They do not take SARS lightly, as you should have noticed with their strict travel policy.

When I stated that your boss was generous, I was referring to the fact that she provided you with an additional day off, so you could take consecutive days off together (the Friday).

The fact that you involved your students speaks to your lack of professionalism and understanding of appropriate conduct. Certainly the students are going to support you to your face, but the reality is far different.

Do you seriously think that it is appropriate behavior on your part to involve your students in a conflict between you and your employer?

You are really showing your lack of sensibility by placing other people in jeopardy by your arrogance, especially that one executive.

The assertion that you were fired because your director does not have control is profoundly unfair and inaccurate, and it shows your defiance in accepting culpability. Moreover, you are mistaken that she will lose business when you are gone, as you will soon be replaced and forgotten.

Please, I am not here to bring you down, but I want to shake up your misguided notions. You are facing culture shock these days, and it is not Mrs. Choi or Mrs. Jung that are seeking to have total control, but it is your feeling of lose of control that is feeding your need to assert more control!

The symptoms of culture shock are real, as are your feelings of helplessness from you parents divorce. You defied your employer precisely because you felt the need to gain some semblance of control in your own life that was unraveling.

Again, I hope you are able to learn from this experience. Begin with looking inward for understanding as opposed to outward to find fault in others.

SCSA

BTW, I do not smoke, so I was not smoking anything.

[Mosley]

Toby: You deserve(as far as credibility goes) the benefit of the doubt. I was convinced of that as soon as I saw the post condemning you, as issued by one "King Rat", aka Austin or SCSA. Fight your battle by all means at your disposal. But, sadly, be prepared to accept defeat. "Justice" means nothing on this peculiar peninsula....

[Gord]

[Hagwon Muppet]

Do you need a release letter? She has to cancel your visa anyway.

As for the notice - well the law is the law. Although you should check your contract. If the contract states you have a 30 day notice period then thats what you have.

As far as I know you cannot contract away your statutory rights but contract clauses offering you protection greater than the legal minimum SHOULD be enforceable in a court.

Do you want to pursue it that far?

[Harvard Material]

TobyWhite...I would fight like a starving cat! Regardless what your contact states, you are entitled to 30 days written notice, or 30 days salary. This 'owner' is your guardian - not your Lord Almighty! You get no notice, no letter of release? What about accomodations? You out tomorrow? I wouldn't be. Period. Your employer sponsored you to arrive in Korea, and is legally responsible for you until you are free of their 'sponsorship'.

If you don't fight you get had Toby. It's your choice. Personally, I would. You do stand to walk away with more than "King Rat" scsa, austin...who ever this individual is has stated. Garbage statements from that person, so ignore it/them...him/her. Always sounds personal between the user posting a dilema and scsa. You know this person Toby? Austin? Sounds like you owe him/her some money .

Get legal advice immediately. If the Labour Office in your area seems to do little, contact a lawyer - pay the consultation fee - and get answers to your unfortunate situation.

Good luck Toby...

[TobyWhite]

I definitely want to fight this, but I feel a little deflated after going to the labour board. I had been talking to one of the lawyers from efl-law.com and he told me we were definitely entitled to 30 days notice, and even with that the grounds for dismissal were spurious. But then when I went to the labour board they basically told me I had no rights because I hadn't been working for 6 months!

As for the accommodations, if she's not going to pay the things she owes me, she can drag me out kicking and screaming. She called yesterday and said she wants us to be out by Friday. I basically told her to piss off.

I'm not sure what the next step will be. I've been talking to some other hagweons, so finding a new job shouldn't be a problem. Looks like we'll probably have to get a lawyer to get all our things.


PS: No idea who Austin is, but I'm assuming he's a Director

[richinkorea]

Just an uneducated opinion here, but I'd say cut your losses and run.

I've followed your story, and while it does seem unfair, it does appear that they might have the law on their side.

SARS is affecting whole economies. I had to make a phone call to my HR department when I came back from Korea last month (and as far as I know it's not on anybody's SARS list). Sometimes you have to jump through hoops with employers, not just in Korea. In retrospect, the best thing you could have done is not to told them where you were going. Remember these guys are your bosses and students, not your friends.

Go back to Thailand, find a job when you run out of money, my 2 cents anyways.

[paul]

Hey Austin!

You should take a pill. A big Pill! Chill out and relax! The last thing you want to do is speak in favor of hawkwon owners on this board.

Or more specifically, to speak against your colleagues in Seoul (if you are a teacher), who are in need of friends and support is the absolute lowest! Sure Toby made some mistakes, but does he need them thrown back in his face by an ESL chat member?

My advice to you: Get off your self-righteous highhorse and join the club.

You should be ashamed of yourself If this is the way you behave at your school, I would loathe to be there with you.

[waterbaby]

I've lifted this directly from the EFL-Law site:

[Austin]

Paul:

You might need to check yourself on this one.

I am relaxed and I do not play favorites. I am more interested in the truth and an accurate depiction of what has occurred, so a helpful and just solution can be realized. If the truth is on the side of the teacher or the hagwon, it makes little difference to me. Unlike you, I can not blindly support a person that is in the wrong.

Colleagues? Are you implying that you and I have some bond? I arrived on an airplane alone, and I will leave alone. What makes you think that we are connected? My skin is white, and yours might be too, but we are far from connected.

If I were in need of friends, I would not seek to make them with people that try to harm others. Besides, if I wanted to hang with Caucasians, I would have stayed in the U.S. Moreover, I am self-righteous, and if you truly wanted to befriend me you would accept the person that I am and not try to change me!

Do you like to socialize with people you do not care for or that do not care for you?

I take offense to your charge that I was throwing anything back in Toby's face. Try reading my posts again, and explain to me what is so offensive?

Since when should there be shame in writing the truth and in posing questions?

I stated things like "I only hope for your sake that you gain something of value from your experience;" "Sorry to read about your parents;" "I hope you are able to learn from this experience. Begin with looking inward for understanding as opposed to outward to find fault in others."

If that offends you, I am curious as to what would not offend you?

SCSA