Korean Job Discussion Forums

[skinsk05]

I was locked out of the system today for too many good grades in my reading and writing class. I have never been asked (told) to lower a grade in 10 years of teaching (6 in US, 4 in Korea) and was told that we were exempt from quotas. I have B's a few C's and a couple of F's; I'm not going easy, but this is a wonderful class of English, Korean and Chinese Education majors who have really put their heart into the class, and have shared stories, frustrations, dreams with me. I have given them praise and encouragement where deserved, and I feel the grades reflect the individuals' performances in my class.

This is killing me, as I cannot give an A student a B, a B student a C, etc; it goes against my ethics and I have told them that I wouldn't curve (I have NO problem giving a C student or a C effort a C.) There is still (but barely) time for discussion, and I am a wreck. I am hoping someone here can offer some good suggestions that would leave everyone happy.

I might add that the President of the Uni, in English, stressed the need to be committed to our students and told us to always ask ourselves, "Is it good for the students? Is it good for the community? Is it sustainable?" This resonated with me. He is not directly involved at this point.

I want to make the strongest case possible. No, these students are not all perfect, but often their writing gave me goosebumps. Most took my (often excessive) comments to heart.

I am bracing for the worst, but I do not see myself compromising my integrity, and to be honest, I don't want to leave my current position. I am otherwise very happy at the school, and in the community. There is no problem with my other classes, and if we resolve this, I will request that I only teach (the much less inspiring) conversation classes, where this would not be an issue, in the future.

I have gone through formal channels to leave early for a wedding back home (that I've known about before being hired), so time is of the essence. I have also signed on for a late-summer camp, and I plan to honor that committment and do my best (no grades!!) In every other respect, I cannot complain about the semester. Any creative ideas or logical bents I may have missed due to trying to resolve this, give the rest of my exams, pack, etc, would be greatly appreciated. Hurry!

[Ya-ta Boy]

I know it sucks but about all you can do is go by the numbers. I've seen teachers go several decimal points to find a 'winner' and 'loser'.

[weatherman]

Bump down. I will have the same problem too with one class. Use your authority properly to get around it. You really need to revalue who can communicate and who can't verus who can take a test well. Don't sweat it. What other evaluations can you use? Grade them again using something new. Back up your new grades with rational. Meaning cover your ass.

On the side, with this class, you evaluation wasn't rigorous enough for the quality of your students.

[skinsk05]

The grades are done-- the computer just won't accept them-- unless I give an A student (well, several), a B and so on. I just have a problem giving students who attend every class, complete every assignment, and communicate so openly and effectively a grade that doesn't match their efforts and results. I hadn't mentioned at the start of class that even if they attend, work hard, and produce great work, their grade might not reflect that because they have equally motivated and talented classmates.

As a teacher, I work on the assumption that all of my students can earn an A (though in reality this has never happened). How can I be an effective teacher if X number of kids are destined to fail or get a poor grade just by showing up!

I'm really hoping for are suggestions for talking to the school about an override, and how I might best make my case for this.

[Tiger Beer]

B+ always works.

I think its fair to utilize the B+.. particularly since even though all students might try hard, some obviously put in more effort than others. There are always a few cream at the top.. and to really reward them, you have to utlize the B+ option to seperate them.

[weatherman]

The school you work for has its own bell shaped curve that it uses. fudge the grades. It won't be that many on either side.

[fidel]

If they are getting bell curved in all their other subjects why should yours be any different?

Why buck the system, the students know how it works and those that want the hallowed A just need to work harder than their classmates!

[ThePoet]

[Ryst Helmut]

I agree with The Poet. C means average...anything in the A column means exceptional.

I too have worked at the univ. level for several years and have had to change my syllabus grading system (due to a mid-semester change in policy by the department)...wasn't kosher with the student body. Not to mention other times when we were not told of new policies until AFTER we assigned grades.

Well, anyway...I know that you feel that these little education majors deserve high grades. Afterall, they do in fact put more effort and creativity into their work than most majors, but sad to say...even the physical education majors have to get A's as well...while some education majors get C's...even though the latter are FAR better in ability and INFINITELY more diligent than the former.

Just let your students know that it was not your fault and that you were not told of this rule. They'll beetch to the department head and take up (I'll asume) his holiday time (we did this once....on purpose).

As for an override...take it to each department head, I did for one group, and he in turn talked to whomever and told me the next day that I could do it just this one time. I'd try this as the department head is more likely to know the students you are concerned about as well as more likely to bat for you (not mention your input is nearly moot being a foreigner...his, on the other hand....).

!shoosh

Ryst

[Hater Depot]

Our (public, middle) school had speaking tests for the the 3rd-graders last week. I had to re-test two classes so that their average scores would more closely align with the averages of the other classes. Protesting that they had simply done a, respectively, worse and better job than the other classes got me nowhere.

I was also lectured that the speaking test grades should match their midterm scores. I bit my tongue but nobody here needs to be told that regurgitating grammar points and answering "What is your favorite kind of pizza?" with a full sentence are not the same.

[gypsyfish]

Grading curves suck and I've fought the same battle several times. I've never won and, I suspect. you won't either.

It's good to get other perspectives, but in the end, you'll have to make your own decision. For me, the benefits of my job have continued to outweigh the problems of the curve, so I've stayed. I still argue against the curve - I wrote a letter to my boss this semester - but it hasn't become intolerable to me.

Good luck with your decision.

[desultude]

I was surprised with how rigid the curve is where I teach. I was fairly unhappy about it at first, but soon realized that it wasn't such a big problem. I don't love it, but it is manageable.

By the end of the semester, the grades I had given ended up conforming with the curve fairly well. Also, the students here know that they are graded on a curve, so they expect it.

The curve also helps me grade better. I hate grading, and I usually love most of my students. These two factors combined to make me an easy grader. The curve requires me to be more disciplined and discerning.

[Tiger Beer]

[OiGirl]

I don't think you'll be able to get away from grading on a curve, if it's the policy of the institution for which you work. I do like the idea of asking for a "one-time" override.

Someone had a formula you could put into your Excel spreadsheet that helped differentiate between the students better. I'll search for it later tonight if someone else doesn't drag it up first.

[OiGirl]

http://www.eslcafe.com/forums/korea/viewtopic.php?t=6066&highlight=grade+Excel