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| Is the US Winning 'The War on Terror'? |
| Yes |
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35% |
[ 6 ] |
| No |
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52% |
[ 9 ] |
| Unsure - Please explain why you are unsure |
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11% |
[ 2 ] |
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| Total Votes : 17 |
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bignate
Joined: 30 Apr 2003
Location: Hell's Ditch
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 Posted: Thu Jun 23, 2005 2:26 pm Post subject: Is 'The War On Terror' in Trouble? |
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An interesting article that examines the idea that the Bush Regime's tactics against terrorists may actually be counter-productive to say the least - that instead of fighting terrorists, they are in fact training them to be much better at what they do. However, such is the consequence of trying to use force as an agent of change without putting the essential and necessary effort into understanding your "enemy"
Afghanistan bleeds
Paul Rogers
23 - 6 - 2005
An upsurge in violence in the first post-9/11 theatre of the ��war on terror�� presents severe problems for United States military forces.
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| The United States ambassador to Kabul, scheduled for transfer to a similar post in Baghdad, escaped assassination by a whisker this week. As Iraq��s insurgents respond to the international conference in Brussels on 22 June with a coordinated series of assaults in Baghdad killing up to forty people, and a leaked CIA report warns that the war in Iraq is creating a new generation of militants trained in sophisticated techniques of guerrilla warfare, Zalmay Khalilzad��s near-escape highlights the wider problems the US faces in its prosecution of President George W Bush��s ��war on terror��. |
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Now, in mid-2005, US military commanders lead a force of nearly 20,000 troops in Afghanistan, and are consolidating the major military bases at Bagram and near Kandahar into centres for renewed operations. These combat troops are separate from the several thousand troops attached to the International Security Assistance Force (Isaf), which was developing more of a peacekeeping and peace-enforcing role in Kabul and some other major centres of population.
The absence of a major Taliban offensive in 2004 may partly have been averted by military operations conducted by Pakistani and American forces on either side of the Pakistan-Afghanistan border (see two columns in this series from March 2004, ��Into the Afghan fire�� and ��A war of shadows��). At that time, the US military was hopeful that its sustained pressure would definitely end the Taliban threat.
A neglected war
It is now becoming clearer by the week that the resurgence of violence observers expected a year ago is at last occurring in much of the south and southeast of the country. Three weeks ago, a column in this series (��Bush��s credibility gulf��) reported the many attacks across the country in April; two weeks ago, another column (��Between Iraq and Afghanistan��) described the wave of incidents at the end of May. In the past week, the pace has accelerated further, with major encounters pitting Taliban and other guerrilla movements against Afghan police and army units as well as United States forces. |
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| Meanwhile, the new CIA report leaked to the New York Times confirms the view that Iraq is replacing Afghanistan as the main training-ground for Islamist paramilitaries – and potentially offers an even more effective one because of its urban warfare environments. Militants have been returning from Iraq to fight in Afghanistan, and it is possible that the manner in which Iraq insurgency tactics are now being adopted there owes much to this experience. |
Stretched too thin, and putting less and less effort into actually solving the problem in Afghanistan, the US is actually making ripe a breeding ground for more hardened and experienced terrorists. These new and "cutting edge" terrrorists will most likely be the cause of the continuation of the hatred towards the West and all things Western, because they have learned how to fight against the best, and have learned that only violence can solve the world's problems.
They are turning out to be quite apt pupils - and their hatred will only increase now that they see that the US isn't the power that it thinks it is. How can there be an end to such a problem, when we, who are ostensibly the one's who are "morally correct" are showing the "enemy" how to solve our problems? |
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Wangja
Joined: 17 May 2004
Location: Seoul, Yongsan
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| Posted: Thu Jun 23, 2005 3:07 pm Post subject: |
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As soon as they made state-sponsored terrorism a US export business they made it much harder for themselves.
Much safer, and as effective as making people take their shoes off before boarding a plane, would have been to introduce the political equivalent of commercial protectionism. |
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Ya-ta Boy
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: Established in 1994
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| Posted: Thu Jun 23, 2005 3:51 pm Post subject: |
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| In my view, the War on Terror isn't meant to be won. It is meant to be a wedge issue to divide the US public, keep liberals on the defensive and make it easier to push the conservative agenda (which is to recreate the world of 1890) by diverting money into defense and out of social programs. |
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bignate
Joined: 30 Apr 2003
Location: Hell's Ditch
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| Posted: Thu Jun 23, 2005 4:08 pm Post subject: |
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| Ya-ta Boy wrote: |
| In my view, the War on Terror isn't meant to be won. It is meant to be a wedge issue to divide the US public, keep liberals on the defensive and make it easier to push the conservative agenda (which is to recreate the world of 1890) by diverting money into defense and out of social programs. |
That is an excellent point - one of the major points that we focused on in our critical issues class in Teacher's College was how the main sources of American Capitalistic expansion (outside of other country's nationalized resources  ) were social programs that were still protected - ie education, welfare, and medical. In order to exploit these areas and reduce the responsibility and liability placed on the government - deregulation became en vogue, and thus opened up historically protected resources to exploitation and profit making. |
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Bulsajo
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Thu Jun 23, 2005 6:49 pm Post subject: |
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| By the by, how's the War on Drugs going these days? |
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dulouz
Joined: 04 Feb 2003
Location: Uranus
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| Posted: Thu Jun 23, 2005 7:50 pm Post subject: |
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| they are in fact training them |
This assertion is over the top. The US isn't training these people. They may take the innitiative and take advantage of the opportunities made available now but the claim that The US is training these people is not true.
So much credibility to a CIA report when so often The CIA is often accused of having faulty intelligence and being either wrong or out of touch.
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| That is an excellent point - one of the major points that we focused on in our critical issues class in Teacher's College was how the main sources of American Capitalistic expansion (outside of other country's nationalized resources ) were social programs that were still protected - ie education, welfare, and medical. In order to exploit these areas and reduce the responsibility and liability placed on the government - deregulation became en vogue, and thus opened up historically protected resources to exploitation and profit making. |
This too, is suspect. Welfare - outsourcing , medical - private insurance vs state insurance, education - you mean vouchers et al?
These things were always on the block. [/url] |
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Kuros
Joined: 27 Apr 2004
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| Posted: Thu Jun 23, 2005 9:26 pm Post subject: |
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| I'm voting yes, on no other criterion than how many successful major terrorist attacks have occurred in the United States since 9-11. |
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Wangja
Joined: 17 May 2004
Location: Seoul, Yongsan
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| Posted: Thu Jun 23, 2005 9:28 pm Post subject: |
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| Kuros wrote: |
| I'm voting yes, on no other criterion than how many successful major terrorist attacks have occurred in the United States since 9-11. |
How many were there before? |
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Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee
Joined: 25 May 2003
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| Posted: Thu Jun 23, 2005 9:38 pm Post subject: |
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Iraq has become a place where terror groups can exchange skills and specialites, bombmakers get to learn how to kidnap and vis -versa.
On the other hand does anyone think these guys would be minding their own business were it not for Iraq?
Do mideast nations have terrorist problems?
I notice that Saudi Arabia put an end to Al Qaida attacks in their nation pretty quick.
Al Qaida doesn't mess with mideast governments cause it is afraid of them. |
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Kuros
Joined: 27 Apr 2004
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| Posted: Thu Jun 23, 2005 9:50 pm Post subject: |
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| Wangja wrote: |
| Kuros wrote: |
| I'm voting yes, on no other criterion than how many successful major terrorist attacks have occurred in the United States since 9-11. |
How many were there before? |
I hope this doesn't come off as rude, but I don't expect non-American arm-chair generals to fully appreciate the vulnerability of the homefront. I have a 100 criticisms of the Bush administration itself, but some things are just difficult, whether or not its Bush handling the situation or someone else. Afghanistan has always been a mess. Always. Iraq was a thug's paradise when Saddam was in power, its just the big fish has been pulled out of the pond.
But, when it comes down to it, once again, how many terrorist attacks have occurred inside the US since 9-11? Discounting ELF, its a very low figure. The war on terror may be a stupid and in some ways insidious name, but I can appreciate the lack of it in the US. |
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Wangja
Joined: 17 May 2004
Location: Seoul, Yongsan
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| Posted: Thu Jun 23, 2005 9:53 pm Post subject: |
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No, it didn't come over as rude.
But there weren't many, were there?
So the question as to whether it was the cost so far is worthwhile is a valid one. |
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Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee
Joined: 25 May 2003
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| Posted: Thu Jun 23, 2005 9:57 pm Post subject: |
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| Al Qaida is afraid of mideast regimes. |
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mithridates
Joined: 03 Mar 2003
Location: President's office, Korean Space Agency
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| Posted: Thu Jun 23, 2005 10:22 pm Post subject: |
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| One reason for that is because it doesn't take Saudi Arabia weeks to get through critical documents written in Arabic. |
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bignate
Joined: 30 Apr 2003
Location: Hell's Ditch
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| Posted: Fri Jun 24, 2005 2:15 am Post subject: |
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| dulouz wrote: |
This assertion is over the top. The US isn't training these people. They may take the innitiative and take advantage of the opportunities made available now but the claim that The US is training these people is not true. |
They are using, and improving their skills in a situation in which the US is providing a source of regimen that is being used as a mode of training. They are not in the literal sense setting out to train them, but since the US's goals and objectives are so vauge and ambiguous - who is to say? An anology would be two people meeting in a park to run against each other, or two opposing teams that meet each other in competition. Each side is training each other. So perhaps I mis-spoke and should have said they are in fact training each other.
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| So much credibility to a CIA report when so often The CIA is often accused of having faulty intelligence and being either wrong or out of touch. |
So, you don't agree with the source? Sure, any Intelligence Agency has been known to have faulty intelligence, however, many of the points that are being argued can be seen on the ground - everyday, it seems, there is a new attack or kidnapping etc. These are things that we know about, without having to rely on intelligence. Do you think that those who are fighting against the occupation in Iraq are becoming better terrorists, or is the occupation causing them to reduce their abilities and/or tendencies to lean toward terror?
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This too, is suspect. Welfare - outsourcing , medical - private insurance vs state insurance, education - you mean vouchers et al?
These things were always on the block. |
Why is it suspect? Subsequent administrations have shown varying levels of deregulation in their actions. However, they haven't had such widescale and far reaching military operations to draw attention away from problems on the homefront. Neither, I think, have they been such open attacks upon regulated industries, or support of privatization. |
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bignate
Joined: 30 Apr 2003
Location: Hell's Ditch
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| Posted: Fri Jun 24, 2005 2:33 am Post subject: |
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| Kuros wrote: |
Afghanistan has always been a mess. Always. Iraq was a thug's paradise when Saddam was in power, its just the big fish has been pulled out of the pond. |
Is the occupation there, making it better? I do not think it is. Just like after the Soviets pulled out, the tribal wars will return and once again, all the efforts of the occupying forces, all the lives lost - will go to waste. As for Iraq, who can tell, a parallel may be drawn with Iran, in some respects. I hope that it will become the seed for a more democratic Middle East, however, I have my doubts.
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| But, when it comes down to it, once again, how many terrorist attacks have occurred inside the US since 9-11? Discounting ELF, its a very low figure. The war on terror may be a stupid and in some ways insidious name, but I can appreciate the lack of it in the US. |
But, what it also comes down to, is that all this time that an attack is not being perpetrated, one is being planned. And since the events of 9-11, terrorists everywhere have seen that bigger is better. In order to hurt America - there needs to be a spectacular event - and of all those that are being planned, for their cause, they only need to succeed with one. Those fighting against the occupation in Iraq are only becoming better and more knowledgable about insurgencies and how the US battles an insurgency. They are learning about how to attack infrastructures and how to become better at terrorizing a populous.
As you mentioned before, it is such a difficult thing.... |
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