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| Are you offended by the constant "foreigner" tag? |
| Yes |
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18% |
[ 12 ] |
| On a bad day |
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28% |
[ 19 ] |
| A little bit |
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13% |
[ 9 ] |
| No |
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39% |
[ 26 ] |
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| Total Votes : 66 |
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Qinella
Joined: 25 Feb 2005
Location: the crib
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 Posted: Sat Aug 27, 2005 2:31 pm Post subject: Do you take offense to always being called foreigner? |
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So one of my Korean co-teachers was talking on the phone the other day and I heard her refer to me several times as the "waygook sonsaengnim". The day before, I'd just experienced a bit of racism, and had read the article about foreigners in Hongdae, and decided it was time for a little chat.
I explained to her that where I come from, the US, as well as most other "western" countries, people try to refer to foreigners by what country they are from, or at least what region. So, if she came to the US, people would call her the Korean woman, or if they didn't know she's from Korea, the Asian woman. It's a small way of showing respect and awareness of the fact that the "foreigner" actually does have a home country they belong to.
She said Koreans don't mean anything offensive by it, but I suggested it engenders latent disrespect of foreigners, as demonstrated time and time again by citizens of this daehan minguk. (Actually, she was shocked to hear about the racism. I really don't think she believes me.) I told her that she knows where I'm from, and it would be nice if she'd refer to me as "miguk sonsaengnim" instead of "waygook" all the time.
Next phone call? "blah blah blah waygook blah blah" ....
It's a little offensive, yes. What do you think?
Last edited by Qinella on Sat Aug 27, 2005 8:51 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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peppermint
Joined: 13 May 2003
Location: traversing the minefields of caddishness.
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| Posted: Sat Aug 27, 2005 2:53 pm Post subject: |
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| What would actually be nicer would be if she'd referred to you the first time as Quinella, migukin songsaengnim, and after that as just Quinella. I've always preferred to be called by name when possible than by any sort of label. |
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Qinella
Joined: 25 Feb 2005
Location: the crib
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| Posted: Sat Aug 27, 2005 3:05 pm Post subject: |
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| peppermint wrote: |
| What would actually be nicer would be if she'd referred to you the first time as Quinella, migukin songsaengnim, and after that as just Quinella. I've always preferred to be called by name when possible than by any sort of label. |
Yeah, but you know that's totally out of custom in the Korean language. They don't use names usually at all. Like, neither of the K teachers I work with know the vice director's name. But it would be better, if the people she spoke with were familiar with my name.
Cheers,
Q without U~ |
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peppermint
Joined: 13 May 2003
Location: traversing the minefields of caddishness.
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| Posted: Sat Aug 27, 2005 3:43 pm Post subject: |
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| Qinella wrote: |
Yeah, but you know that's totally out of custom in the Korean language. They don't use names usually at all. Like, neither of the K teachers I work with know the vice director's name. But it would be better, if the people she spoke with were familiar with my name.
Cheers,
Q without U~ |
It's not though. Where I work, they all refer to eachother by full names and titles ie. Kim Eun Jeong Seongsaengnim. It sounds like you're working at a very small school, and perhaps there, names aren't so necessary when they're addressing eachother. That's a really isolated case though, and I'd bet the students know the teacher's names. |
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Gord
Joined: 25 Feb 2003
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| Posted: Sat Aug 27, 2005 3:47 pm Post subject: Re: Do you take offense to always being called foreigner? |
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| Qinella wrote: |
| It's a little offensive, yes. What do you think? |
No. You're a foreigner. It's not a derogatory expression in Korea. |
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pet lover
Joined: 02 Jan 2004
Location: not in Seoul
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| Posted: Sat Aug 27, 2005 4:21 pm Post subject: |
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I'm considering starting to call all Koreans waygooks. They are, after all, foreigners in my eyes just as I'm a foreigner in their eyes.  |
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Wangja
Joined: 17 May 2004
Location: Seoul, Yongsan
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| Posted: Sat Aug 27, 2005 4:27 pm Post subject: |
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| Nope: I am a foreigner here. |
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hojucandy
Joined: 03 Feb 2003
Location: In a better place
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| Posted: Sat Aug 27, 2005 4:36 pm Post subject: |
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i object to being called an amerikan! i explain to koreans that it is akin to my calling them japanese...
in emart yesterday i heard the familiar "�̱� ���" being intoned as i waited at the checkout with my basket of unhealthy bread and dairy products. i scowled at the perpetrator...
one of these days.....  |
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inkoreaforgood
Joined: 15 Dec 2003
Location: Inchon
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| Posted: Sat Aug 27, 2005 4:51 pm Post subject: |
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| hojucandy wrote: |
i object to being called an amerikan! i explain to koreans that it is akin to my calling them japanese...
in emart yesterday i heard the familiar "�̱� ���" being intoned as i waited at the checkout with my basket of unhealthy bread and dairy products. i scowled at the perpetrator...
one of these days..... |
As long as they aren't threatening you with a knife or some crazy shit, why do you care? They constantly make that same mistake with every caucasion non-American. At least they are consistent.
Are you angered by it every time? Or just scowl at strangers for no reason? |
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indytrucks
Joined: 09 Apr 2003
Location: The Shelf
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| Posted: Sat Aug 27, 2005 5:03 pm Post subject: |
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Where was that other thread about the Stupiest Thread Ever?
You're a foreigner living in Korea. What would you rather be called? Whitey? Immigrant? Honkey?
I swear to God, some people here can find anything to moan about. |
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hojucandy
Joined: 03 Feb 2003
Location: In a better place
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| Posted: Sat Aug 27, 2005 5:09 pm Post subject: |
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no - this is a valid complaint i think.
in most countries people do not call people from other countries "foreigner" to their face. it is rude. here they don;t think it is rude - but that does not stop us from being a little offended by it.
yes - i scowl at people who are rude to me. |
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desultude
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Location: Dangling my toes in the Persian Gulf
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| Posted: Sat Aug 27, 2005 5:29 pm Post subject: |
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| hojucandy wrote: |
no - this is a valid complaint i think.
in most countries people do not call people from other countries "foreigner" to their face. it is rude. here they don;t think it is rude - but that does not stop us from being a little offended by it.
yes - i scowl at people who are rude to me. |
I disagree on this one, Hoju.
Etiquette is relative. I would be very surprised to see westerners (and that is what I call all of us, because I can't really tell exactly where someone is from just by seeing them) stop blowing their big noses at the dinner table in Los Angeles because it is not polite in Korea.
It is really necessary to develop less sensitivity about yourself and more towards other cultures if you are going to be happy living abroad.
I am surprised that being called a waygook is offensive to anyone, but I can see where being called a miguk could be.  |
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hojucandy
Joined: 03 Feb 2003
Location: In a better place
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| Posted: Sat Aug 27, 2005 5:42 pm Post subject: |
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i try to be culturally sensitive des but i get worn down these days!!
i am not offended by being called foreigner... but i can understand why some people are. my scowling is a gut reaction to the assumption that i am american.
also stares... in korean culture too staring is considered very rude. moreso even than in western culture. and yet people do it. they know they are being rude.
cultural sensitivity is a two-way thing. sometimes i feel i am the only one working at it here... |
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desultude
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Location: Dangling my toes in the Persian Gulf
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| Posted: Sat Aug 27, 2005 5:53 pm Post subject: |
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| hojucandy wrote: |
i try to be culturally sensitive des but i get worn down these days!!
i am not offended by being called foreigner... but i can understand why some people are. my scowling is a gut reaction to the assumption that i am american.
also stares... in korean culture too staring is considered very rude. moreso even than in western culture. and yet people do it. they know they are being rude.
cultural sensitivity is a two-way thing. sometimes i feel i am the only one working at it here... |
I would be surprised if you weren't one of the most culturally sensitive people here, Hoju, so that part wasn't really meant for you.
The staring thing confuses me, too. I guess it could be explained by the insider/outsider ethic here, where courtesy, respect, etc. are due to people you know (part of your "village") and not much is owed to strangers.
I think I maintain some dispassion regarding this stuff because I know that I will always be a waygook here. Short of marriage and full grasp of the language, and maybe some plastic surgery  , I cannot imagine how anyone really integrates into Korean society. It is just a reality. My stint here is temporary- for how long I don't know, but certainly not for more than 3-5 more years, at the absolute outside most. So I am a foriegner, and always will be. |
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hojucandy
Joined: 03 Feb 2003
Location: In a better place
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| Posted: Sat Aug 27, 2005 6:31 pm Post subject: |
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lately des i think i am suffering from "cultural sensitivity fatigue".
Last edited by hojucandy on Sat Aug 27, 2005 6:51 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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