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Leslie Cheswyck
Joined: 31 May 2003
Location: University of Western Chile
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 Posted: Sat Sep 10, 2005 3:05 am Post subject: |
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| On the other hand wrote: |
| The issue is simply that a foreign contingent, from ANY country, was able to provide a service that the American government had failed to provide. The failure to provide this service is relevant in assessing the Bush adminstration's handling of the case. |
Wrong! It merely underscores the magnitude of the disaster. BTW, it was the Bush administration that allowed the Canadian rescue teams in. Anyway, read my very first post in this thread. |
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On the other hand
Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Location: I walk along the avenue
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| Posted: Sat Sep 10, 2005 3:21 am Post subject: |
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On the other hand wrote:
The issue is simply that a foreign contingent, from ANY country, was able to provide a service that the American government had failed to provide. The failure to provide this service is relevant in assessing the Bush adminstration's handling of the case.
Wrong! It merely underscores the magnitude of the disaster. BTW, it was the Bush administration that allowed the Canadian rescue teams in. |
LC:
I wrote that "the failure to provide this service is relevant in assessing the Bush administration's handling of the case". I did not say what conclusions will eventually be drawn from this assessment. Maybe Bush will be hung out to dry, maybe he'll share the blame with local officials, maybe he'll be completely exonerated. I don't know.
And even some American commentators(including the pro-American Andrew Sullivan) have mentioned the Canadian success as reflecting poorly on the Bush administration. So, yes, I don't think it's TOO controversial for me to say that this will be an issue in the aftermath. |
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Bulsajo
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Sat Sep 10, 2005 6:42 am Post subject: |
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| Tiger Beer wrote: |
| Leslie Cheswyck wrote: |
| America was overwhelmed by a great disaster. It strained our resources (This hardly constitutes "neglect"). Other nations helped out. Just leave it at that. |
Yeah, thats how I see it. Its kind of weird to hear from a bunch of ultra-nationalists about how great they are for having some fellow nationals going down there to help out.
Something more interesting.. I was reading some sources today how the Mexican government sent a 44-vehicle convoy of 200 unarmed troops filled with of thousands of ready-to-eat meals, drinking water and medical equipment for Katrina refugees in San Antonio, Texas right now. First time Mexican troops have been in the US in something like 150+ years.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/9248064/
Thats MUCH cooler than some Canadians ultra-national anti-american bashing holier and greater than thou propoganda garbage. I'm sure if I read the Mexican and Mexican-American sources on that.. they'd be saying what an honor and great feeling it is to be involved rather than how the US sucks with that self-righteous pride and disdain in their voices like that coming from the north. |
I'd just like to point out that Reuters is not Canadian. Igotthisguitar's emphasis of certain points of the article clearly shows his bias, but if anyone is really concerned about media bias perhaps they should be asking why Reuters chose the headline they did. |
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HapKi
Joined: 10 Dec 2004
Location: TALL BUILDING-SEOUL
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| Posted: Sat Sep 10, 2005 7:18 am Post subject: |
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I take the headline to read that the large distance was the news making pull of the story, not the 'surprise' of Canada's help. As in, insert "Maine" instead of 'Canada', and the story's message would not change.
As someone has pointed out, the area devasted is the size of Great Britain. Its not surprising that relief doesn't extend in an instant, blanket-like sweep. Its a non-story, save as PR fodder for Canadian natio (scratch that), anti-American instigators and fault-finders.
The dead have not been accounted for, and some posters are already demanding thank-you's. Really sad.
The good news is that early reports of 10,000 casualities look to be over-estimated. |
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Gopher
Joined: 04 Jun 2005
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| Posted: Sat Sep 10, 2005 7:23 am Post subject: |
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| I read this story and thread, and I wonder whether Canadians contributed to relief efforts because they are altruistic or merely because they wanted to snicker. |
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On the other hand
Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Location: I walk along the avenue
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| Posted: Sat Sep 10, 2005 7:37 am Post subject: |
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| I read this story and thread, and I wonder whether Canadians contributed to relief efforts because they are altruistic or merely because they wanted to snicker. |
Reading the article, I saw nothing to indicate that the rescue operation itself was motivated by a desire to snicker. |
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Gopher
Joined: 04 Jun 2005
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| Posted: Sat Sep 10, 2005 7:42 am Post subject: |
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Well, it's the combination of the article and the thread, as I said.
The Canadians here in Korea who feel this way, they can't be just an isolated group of people whose thinking isn't mirrored in, perhaps, many Canadian homes and govt offices... |
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On the other hand
Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Location: I walk along the avenue
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| Posted: Sat Sep 10, 2005 7:49 am Post subject: |
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| The Canadians here in Korea who feel this way, can't be just an isolated group of people whose thinking isn't mirrored in, perhaps, many Canadian homes and govt offices... |
No, there's a lot of cheap smugness in Canada, to be sure.
But don't let it get you down, Gopher. After all, this forum must be one of the few places in the world where non-Canadians actually care what Canadians think about anything. |
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BigBlackEquus
Joined: 05 Jul 2005
Location: Lotte controls Asia with bad chocolate!
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| Posted: Sat Sep 10, 2005 8:14 am Post subject: |
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I would also like to mention that Fox News did a pretty incredible about-face to make up for Riley's not-so-friendly Canada comments and this tragedy.
The network dedicated a full five minutes to interviewing Canada's ambassador to the US, and pointed out more positive things that Canada has done for this tragedy than he did. You guys should watch it. It's really a good piece, and you can see it in video online. I had no idea Canada has done so much, and I'm sure many Americans are appreciative of that. They even poked fun at the fact that the Canadian rescue team got there first. , although we all pretty much know it's because they probably didn't get the warnings not to go in there that were given to everyone else. Just guessing on that, though. |
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Cthulhu
Joined: 02 Feb 2003
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| Posted: Sat Sep 10, 2005 8:31 am Post subject: |
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Ah, one of the things I don't miss about living in Korea--these fishbowl Can/Am dick measuring contests. I'm amazed no one has mentioned the War of 1812 yet.
Related to this issue--last year my home town in Ontario (Peterborough) went through a major flood and was declared a disaster area. Help came from as far away as Florida but I don't recall any Americans making a big deal about that. Disaster aid between advanced Western countries is usually not an issue of dire need as much as its a symbolic show of support. During a major distaster with chaos all around there are bound to be logistical screw-ups. There's not much point harping on it. |
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Bulsajo
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Sat Sep 10, 2005 8:36 am Post subject: |
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| On the other hand wrote: |
No, there's a lot of cheap smugness in Canada, to be sure. |
This is true.
This forum is the single largest pool of cheap smugness that exists on the planet, regardless of nationality, ethnicity, gender, & political orientation.
Is there really any Current Events regular here who ISN'T surprised by this thread?
I've been watching the news and reading the newspapers regularly and I wouldn't have even heard about this particular article if it hadn't been posted here.
Certainly none of my coworkers, friends, and family are discussing this.
It's a non-issue everywhere else in the world but this forum.
And everyone who has participated in this thread is not a hypocrite, right? Because we've all already donated to Katrina Hurricane relief in some form or another, right?
Regardless of nationality, right?
I certainly like to think so, but I doubt it. |
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Yu_Bum_suk
Joined: 25 Dec 2004
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| Posted: Sat Sep 10, 2005 4:40 pm Post subject: |
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Talking to some friends last night I found that most non-Canadians aren't at all familiar with the Hip's earliers stuff. I think this is from 1989.
New Orleans is Sinking
Alright!
Bourbon blues on the street, loose and complete
Under skies all smoky blue green
I can't forsake a dixie dead shake
So we danced the sidewalk clean
My memory is muddy
What's this river that I'm in?
New Orleans is sinking man
And I don't wanna swim
Colonel Tom, what's wrong? what's going on?
You can't tie yourself up for a deal
He said, Hey north you're south; shut your big mouth,
You gotta do what you feel is real
Ain't got no picture postcards, ain't got no souvenirs
My baby, she don't know me when I'm thinking bout those years
Pale as a light bulb hanging on a wire
Sucking up to someone just to stoke the fire
Picking out the highlights of the scenery
Saw a little cloud that looked a little like me
I had my hands in the river
My feet back up on the banks
Looked up to the lord above
And said, hey man thanks
Sometimes I fell so good, I gotta scream
She said Gordie baby I know exactly what you mean
She said, she said, I swear to god she said
My memory is muddy
What's this river that I'm in?
New Orleans is sinking man and I don't wanna swim
Swim! |
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Pyongshin Sangja
Joined: 20 Apr 2003
Location: I love baby!
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| Posted: Sat Sep 10, 2005 6:29 pm Post subject: |
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| Ok, that's just sick. Go back to Canada. |
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Bulsajo
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Sat Sep 10, 2005 6:41 pm Post subject: |
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Yu Bum Sik, you may not have heard this, but all radio stations that I am aware of in Canada have taken that song out of rotation out of respect.
I can only guess that the Hip won't be playing it live either (but I wouldn't know- nothing against them really but I've never seen them live and have no plans to in the forseeable future). |
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On the other hand
Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Location: I walk along the avenue
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| Posted: Sat Sep 10, 2005 6:47 pm Post subject: |
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This forum is the single largest pool of cheap smugness that exists on the planet, regardless of nationality, ethnicity, gender, & political orientation.
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Yep. And, it should be pointed out that there's also a small contingent of American posters who take every opportunity to engage in gratuitous Canada-bashing. Not that this justifies USA-bashing, just puts things in context.
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It's a non-issue everywhere else in the world but this forum.
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Well, like I mentioned earlier, Andrew Sullivan picked it up, and included it in his extensive and ongoing list of FEMA screw-ups. But yeah, he doesn't have an entire chat room dedicated to it. |
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