Korean Job Discussion Forums

[schwa]

Teaching english isnt brain surgery but having a handle on immigration laws isnt rocket science either.

[ifa79]

The ESL teachers who forge documents to become criminals in a foreign country are at fault and should at minimum be deported.

The bigger problem lies with a culture that believes (or once believed) that any native teacher can teach English. The Korean government instituted the 4-year degree minimum in anything as the only filter to try to sift out any undesirables.
I'm not saying someone without any post-secondary education is a bad teacher or a bad person, this is just done to reduce the number of applications and ensure that the teachers coming in have written some essays. This is only a filter, but it is not an ideal filter. The first year I came here, I could write 20 pages about World War 2 but I couldn't explain why we use the past perfect tense. I had kids walking all over me for six months. I wasn't a great teacher. I should have at least taken a TESOL course, but I did know English and have accomplished some things.

The Korean government is doing the right thing by kicking out anyone without the basic qualifications. This is a start. If they really want to solve the problem, then they should shut down or investigate the hagwons that are hiring any old foreigners they can find. As long as these owners are putting out the bait, native teachers will continue to be lured into Korea.
Hopefully the natives in the public schools help shut down the sketchy hagwons.

[JongnoGuru]

[Homer]

While I think that teaching illegaly is not some horrible capital offence it does not mean that it is not a crime here in Korea. It is not a question of comparing the gravity of the crime only to then excuse it. The teachers getting arrested committed fraud. They used fake credentials or no credentials at all and came to Korea to teach illegally. The fact they know if this was illegal or not is not relevant. They broke the law, got caught and now have to deal with the consequences. I do not think that these teachers should face any sort of real jail time. A hefty fine and deportation seems like a reasonable punishement. The consequence has to fit the crime. Here this is mostly fraud and miss-representation. Some illegal teachers who have been arrested in the past have spent time in jail because they refused or could not pay the fine and air ticket out of Korea. Thats a completely different issue and here jail time or simply detention is a normal consequence of not paying a fine.

This crackdown on illegal teachers is legitimate in the sense that Korea is enforcing its laws. They should however also go after those that encourage the illegal teaching. This means some of the hakwon owners who break the law as well by bringing in illegal teachers. This already happens as a school that is caught with illegal teachers is heavily fined. This needs to continue.

What Korea requires to obtain a teaching visa is quite reasonable. We are not talking Degree in Education here. A simple legitimate University Degree in anything allows you to obtain an E-2 visa here providing you find a job. This is a very reasonable pre-requisite considering that the job is teaching. I do not believe that a degree automatically makes for a better teacher. Teaching is about more than a degree. But, there has to be some minimum qualifications required to get a teaching visa. That is just common sense.

If teachers come here illegally, they are taking a chance and breaking the law. If they get caught they have no one to blame but themselves. They do not deserve to be jailed but the rules are clear: it will earn you a fine and most of the time a deportation. Why shouldn't it?

I do not doubt that some illegal teachers were doing a great job and that some legal teachers are complete failures as teachers. However this does not excuse or erase committing fraud.

[Korea Newfie]

So here it is, my first post since August 13, 2004 (I just looked it up). Since I've been home I've considered visiting and commenting on things I've seen in the news regarding teaching in Korea but, remembering how annoyed I was when I posted here, I thought better of it.

However, flying home last night from a wedding in Halifax, I read this article in the Globe. (As I may be the only one on here who read it in the actual paper, I'll point out that it made the front page. Down at the bottom, but front page nontheless.) I laughed when I read it, predicting what would be said here. I laughed again today when proven correct.

Anyway, a couple of quick comments, then I'm off again for another year. Maybe.

[cruisemonkey]

Hopefully, a university degree has some conection with the ability to exercise critical analysis. If one doesn't have a degree, one may not have the 'smarts' to figure out that committing fraud to enter and work in a foreign country is a serious crime. This does not excuse the crime.

[some waygug-in]

Cool post there Mr. Korea Newfie.

I salutes ya.

You brought up some very important points, ones that nobody else wants to talk about, or at least not as frankly as you have done.

Good onya mate.

Cheers

[plato's republic]

All illegals should be burnt at the stake!
No seriously, if you're caught teaching illegally with or without fake documents then you should face the music. Nobody forces someone to teach illegally or go to Khao san road in Bangkok to pick up a fake degree. Most people do it because they think that they can get away with it and the risks are worth it. Why should 'we' legal teachers have any sympathy for them? Some of them may be good teachers but that doesn't change the fact that they are breaking Korean Law. To teach legally in Korea you need a degree from a REAL university. If you don't have one then don't come here. Plain and simple. The problem with this is that many Koreans will just lump the rest of us in the same boat and think that we are all illegal and uneducated. It's a no-win situation.

[Hollywoodaction]

[billybrobby]

Everybody knows that forging a photcopy of a college degree is practically impossible. The geniuses in the Korean government have wisely decided that a photocopy of a degree is much more secure than a sealed college transcript. I commend their good judgement.

Anyways, I'm glad I have my degree. (the typesetter was a little drunk)

[JongnoGuru]

[Manner of Speaking]

[STP]

This is just 2 funny --loser ESL teachers (wetbacks of Asia)

[capebretoncanadian]

SIX MONTH TOURIST VISAS that about sums up South Koreans attitude to Canadians on tourist visas teaching......they don't endorse it, but unless the public raises a stink about foreigners they pretty much turn a blind eye towards it.....I know a handful of people that have been here for years on tourist visas, both teaching at Hagwons and privately.........obviously the demand is there.....everybody should just chill out and you haters with masters degrees or doctorates or whatever is the most pompous sounding probably have better jobs than the tourists and sociology majors anyway so whatever.

[lastat06513]

All I can say is; The government can do all it can to eradicate the illegal teaching phenomenon by getting rid of those with tourist visas or getting rid of those with fake qualifications.
But what about those who are here and who have visas that exempt them from Korean jurisdiction (such as SOFA, diplomatic dependants, etc.)?

How can immigration stop them from doing this kind of conduct.

Case in point;

I was in Kangnam Station when I witnessed what I think was an on-spot immigration inspection. The agent asked the guy for his ARC and the guy took out a DoD ID card and said "F^^k off!!!". The immigration officers were helpless to do anything since illegal teaching is not covered in the list of crimes in the SOFA agreement---smart move