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dbee
Joined: 29 Dec 2004
Location: korea
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 Posted: Sat Oct 15, 2005 6:22 pm Post subject: Kids being knocked down ... |
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So I was walking home the other night and I see these two kids running back and forth across the road, They seemed to be about 4 and 6 and were just let loose on a reasonably busy, unlit road. I was thinking of just dragging them off the road, I mean I was fairly shocked that they had got away from their parents supervision. I figured maybe that they had run off when their parents weren't looking or something.
Then, about 20metres down the road I see their 'parents' strolling nonchanantly along the road with a pram. Not a care in the world, completely oblivious to the fact that their kids could very easily be knocked down at any moment.
If this was at home, I would have definitely told them to 'cop themselves on'. But it isn't so I didn't.
Did you know that korea is the country with the worlds highest child mortality rate through accident or misadventure ?
I think I can see why. |
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uberscheisse
Joined: 02 Dec 2003
Location: japan is better than korea.
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| Posted: Sat Oct 15, 2005 7:04 pm Post subject: |
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i constantly see stuff like that.
the worst one was when i saw this 3 year old girl running down a street in my neighborhood... by herself.
her dad was about 100 feet away. i looked at him like "what the *beep* are you doing?" and he just laughed. |
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Return Jones
Joined: 06 Feb 2004
Location: I will see you in far-off places
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| Posted: Sat Oct 15, 2005 7:30 pm Post subject: |
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See stuff like this every day too. Everywhere I go - at work, on the sidewalk, on the subway platform, no seatbelts, etc. Sometimes I can't understand how seemingly educated and cultured people can be so oblivious to such things!
This is why I was so skeptical of the article referred to in this post:
http://www.eslcafe.com/forums/korea/viewtopic.php?t=46183 Maybe the writer was on the right track after all.
At work (elementary school) I have the reputation for being the overreacting Nervous Nelly teacher. It seems I'm the only one who thinks boys having sword fights with the pointy end of math compasses is a bad idea. I could go on (kids walking on window sills on 3rd floor with windows open - nobody cares), but you get the picture...
I predict some apologist on here will come along with some perverted wisdom and will try justify this apatheticness towards safety. It'll start by mentioning that kids get hurt back home too....  |
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dbee
Joined: 29 Dec 2004
Location: korea
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| Posted: Sat Oct 15, 2005 7:41 pm Post subject: |
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Ya, I mean it's completely insane.
I'm starting to think that this must in some way be genetic. I mean usually the strongest instinct of any parent is to protect their kids. But it seems that the koreans (or at least some koreans) don't have that 'gene'.
This is the country with historically the largest amount of overseas adoption. The largest number of kids going missing or abandoned. These are often kids that don't fit into the social norm ie. they are bi-racial or have birth defects etc ... but the same goes for the neglect of regular children.
Now that I come to think of it, this is the only thing that I definitely do NOT understand about the Koreans. Child safety here is just not a concern. |
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Hater Depot
Joined: 29 Mar 2005
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| Posted: Sat Oct 15, 2005 8:03 pm Post subject: |
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Right, Koreans don't have the gene for loving your children. That must be it.
Ever read about ancient Sparta? |
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joe_doufu
Joined: 09 May 2005
Location: Elsewhere
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| Posted: Sat Oct 15, 2005 8:07 pm Post subject: |
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| I understand this is one of the strategies whereby they subtly try to rid themselves of troublesome female children. Keep the baby boy in the pram or holding mother's hand, let big sister roam free and peek over the edge of the subway platform if her curiosity so leads her. |
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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| Posted: Sat Oct 15, 2005 8:24 pm Post subject: |
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| dbee wrote: |
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Now that I come to think of it, this is the only thing that I definitely do NOT understand about the Koreans. Child safety here is just not a concern. |
Much the same as it was in the West 50 years ago? |
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Return Jones
Joined: 06 Feb 2004
Location: I will see you in far-off places
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| Posted: Sat Oct 15, 2005 8:43 pm Post subject: |
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| Hater Depot wrote: |
Right, Koreans don't have the gene for loving your children. That must be it.
Ever read about ancient Sparta? |
It has nothing to do with DNA, but I would guess rather a naive outlook that comes from a culture where contigency planning is ignored in favour of crisis management. Instead of telling little Jaewon to look both ways before crossing the street, they surrender to "Oh crap, Jaewon got hit! Quick! Hospital!" Why is it so? Again, I don't know. Let's talk intelligently about it. Perhaps we can make a bit of a difference as teachers.
Spartans
I can tell you that in 26 years of living in various mid-big cities in North America (Halifax, Ottawa, Washington DC, Baltimore, Toronto, Vancouver) I only knew of one person personally that got hit by a car. He was a friend of my sister. He was actually about 18 years old and ran in front of a bus to catch another one. Ouch! He was OK though. Broken leg.
Contrast that to my four years in Korea. Off the top of my head I can come up with FIVE, yes FIVE, children that were either seriously injured or killed by being hit by a car. Fortunately, none we my students, but rather students of my friends, etc. That's one kid per year.
Following your dismissive attitude and logic towards the issue, you should have known 18 kids killed by cars by the time you finished high school.
Bring up the Spartans again. That'll help.
Last edited by Return Jones on Sat Oct 15, 2005 8:55 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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Barking Mad Lord Snapcase
Joined: 04 Nov 2003
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| Posted: Sat Oct 15, 2005 8:50 pm Post subject: |
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| TheUrbanMyth wrote: |
| dbee wrote: |
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Now that I come to think of it, this is the only thing that I definitely do NOT understand about the Koreans. Child safety here is just not a concern. |
Much the same as it was in the West 50 years ago? |
Exactly. As you have just implied, this is a backward culture. |
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Return Jones
Joined: 06 Feb 2004
Location: I will see you in far-off places
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| Posted: Sat Oct 15, 2005 8:54 pm Post subject: |
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| TheUrbanMyth wrote: |
| dbee wrote: |
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Now that I come to think of it, this is the only thing that I definitely do NOT understand about the Koreans. Child safety here is just not a concern. |
Much the same as it was in the West 50 years ago? |
No, not at all. I doubt that when my parents were in school they were allowed to flick rubber bands at each other's faces or swipe at each other with knives (pencil sharpeners as they're considered here) only to have all the other teachers tell the only concered teacher that "They're just boys play fighting".
HEY APOLOGISTS: I ALREADY STOLE YOUR THUNDER IN MY FIRST POST. CONTRIBUTE SOMETHING INTELLIGENT OR GET OUT OF THS THREAD. AS A TEACHER, THIS CHILD SAFETY ISSUE WEIGHS ON MY MIND.
Ok, while I'm at it, let me pre-empt: no seatbelts in old cars back home, no helmets on bicycles until the 80s, no lifejackets when waterskiing until the 80s. |
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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| Posted: Sat Oct 15, 2005 8:54 pm Post subject: |
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| Barking Mad Lord Snapcase wrote: |
| TheUrbanMyth wrote: |
| dbee wrote: |
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Now that I come to think of it, this is the only thing that I definitely do NOT understand about the Koreans. Child safety here is just not a concern. |
Much the same as it was in the West 50 years ago? |
Exactly. As you have just implied, this is a backward culture. |
If the West had been flattened in a huge civil war oh say about 50 years ago it would probably be regarded as backwards too. We've had a lot more time to focus on social and personal development (which has not always been positive). Ever teach in a Western high school? The worst behaviour of Korean kids doesn't come close to the normal behaviour and disrespect of Western students. |
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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| Posted: Sat Oct 15, 2005 9:03 pm Post subject: |
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| Return Jones wrote: |
| TheUrbanMyth wrote: |
| dbee wrote: |
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Now that I come to think of it, this is the only thing that I definitely do NOT understand about the Koreans. Child safety here is just not a concern. |
Much the same as it was in the West 50 years ago? |
(1) No, not at all. I doubt that when my parents were in school they were allowed to flick rubber bands at each other's faces or swipe at each other with knives (pencil sharpeners as they're considered here) only to have all the other teachers tell the only concered teacher that "They're just boys play fighting".
HEY APOLOGISTS: I ALREADY STOLE YOUR THUNDER IN MY FIRST POST. CONTRIBUTE SOMETHING INTELLIGENT OR GET OUT OF THS THREAD. AS A TEACHER, THIS CHILD SAFETY ISSUE WEIGHS ON MY MIND.
(2) Ok, while I'm at it, let me pre-empt: no seatbelts in old cars back home, no helmets on bicycles until the 80s, no lifejackets when waterskiing until the 80s. |
numbers are mine
1. Funnily enough back in the early 80's students (in my school) used to do that every now and then (usually before class would start). Most teachers didn't bat a eye (or even seem to notice). And take a look at some U.S. schools where they have metal detectors and guards. A lot worse stuff goes on there than shooting rubber bands at each other. I guess by Mr. Snapcase's standards that the U.S. is a backwards culture.
2. Like I said (and it wasn't even 50 years ago) that parents in the West took a MUCH more relaxed view of their children's safety. As in the West things will change in Korea. |
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Return Jones
Joined: 06 Feb 2004
Location: I will see you in far-off places
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| Posted: Sat Oct 15, 2005 9:11 pm Post subject: |
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Number one: When I was in school in the 80s-90s we got in crap for such stuff. I went to school in Canada and the US. We fortunately didn't need metal detectors but it shows that some schools are keeping students' safety in mind.
Number two: Did you read my examples? Hmm..I didn't think so.
Also, for those that are bothered by this issue, don't bother teaching in China. It makes Korea look like Podori Safetyland! |
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Hater Depot
Joined: 29 Mar 2005
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| Posted: Sat Oct 15, 2005 9:53 pm Post subject: |
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| Return Jones wrote: |
Let's talk intelligently about it. Perhaps we can make a bit of a difference as teachers.
[snip]Following your dismissive attitude and logic towards the issue, you should have known 18 kids killed by cars by the time you finished high school.
Bring up the Spartans again. That'll help. |
Yes. You're right. I confess. Your incisive logic has shredded the facade of decent humanity I present to the world and revealed me for the cold, heartless man that I am, one who doesn't care about children being hit by cars. I suppose this is the time to admit that I have also torn the tags off of my mattresses.
My point was that this is hardly limited to Korea; concern for child safety, as others have pointed out, is a recent phenomenon in the west. dbee's post was typical of how foreigners criticize Korea in a vacuum, and bordered on racism besides.
I will agree with you that Koreans generally ignore "contingency planning in favor of crisis management." |
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Barking Mad Lord Snapcase
Joined: 04 Nov 2003
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| Posted: Sat Oct 15, 2005 10:42 pm Post subject: |
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| TheUrbanMyth wrote: |
| And take a look at some U.S. schools where they have metal detectors and guards. A lot worse stuff goes on there than shooting rubber bands at each other. I guess by Mr. Snapcase's standards that the U.S. is a backwards culture. |
Every culture is guilty of being "backwards" in one sense or another. I get pretty embarrassed myself when hearing about violent drunken hooligans on Australia Day. And yes, if I were a schoolteacher in one of those American schools, I'd be pretty embarrassed too.
However, my previous comment was nothing more than holding up a mirror to your post. You said that Korea is like the West 50 years ago. We know that in many respects, this is true. It strikes me as ironic, then, that you should be taken aback when people agree with you in a roundabout, individualized way. Would you rather they agree with you in a Homer-style "Good post, UM! Well done!  " 1950's-boy-scout-manual pat-on-the-back sort of way? |
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