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Alias
Joined: 24 Jan 2003
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 Posted: Wed Nov 02, 2005 5:08 am Post subject: Canadian politics- Gomery Report |
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So Martin has been cleared and Chretien caught(although not implicated). Chretien plans on taking Gomery to court Article saying that the Gomery was biased against him.
The Conservatives and the Bloc want to call an election now. I can understand why the Bloc does but I don't think this will help the Conservatives any. Then again it might not matter when the election is called because the Liberals will form the government again. |
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Bob O.
Joined: 20 Oct 2005
Location: The 'San
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| Posted: Wed Nov 02, 2005 7:06 am Post subject: |
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I think the Gomery Report made Jack Layton the happiest man in the world. The balance of Parliament now rests completely in his hands with only 18 seats. Gotta love the minority government.
http://www.cbc.ca/story/canada/national/2005/11/02/layton-gomery051102.html
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| We will assess whether we can accomplish something positive out of this parliament...If [Martin is] willing to take action on a few key issues over the next few weeks, then perhaps we can wait until the election in the winter. If not, then clearly the parliament serves no positive purpose. |
I don't see why the election can't wait... Martin has already promised to call one within 30 days of the delivery of the final report (Feb. 1). |
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Alias
Joined: 24 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Wed Nov 02, 2005 7:17 am Post subject: |
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My guess is that the Conservatives think that this is their best chance. In the spring the liberals might be stronger.
However if they wait until the spring there just might be another scandal.  |
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Bulsajo
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Wed Nov 02, 2005 8:42 am Post subject: Re: Canadian politics- Gomery Report |
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| Alias wrote: |
Chretien plans on taking Gomery to court Article saying that the Gomery was biased against him.
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"It was all of my closest friends, business associates, and aides, but it wasn't ME."  |
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Moldy Rutabaga
Joined: 01 Jul 2003
Location: Ansan, Korea
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| Posted: Wed Nov 02, 2005 6:38 pm Post subject: |
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"Prime Minister" Martin, then one of the senior ministers in the government, knew nothing. How convenient. Chretien is not directly implicated. Crooks and thieves exonerate other crooks and thieves.
Martin promises to call an election after the second Gomery report is released, right after the Liberal government gets around to abolishing the GST as promised. What's to stop him from "calling" the election for a year later?
Canada's Watergate. I feel so proud.
Ken:> |
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Octavius Hite
Joined: 28 Jan 2004
Location: Househunting, looking for a new bunker from which to convert the world to homosexuality.
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| Posted: Wed Nov 02, 2005 8:38 pm Post subject: |
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Ken, buddy, the GST is not going anywhere. As for the Liberals, they aren't my favorite party but the reason the always win and will win again in the new year is because there is no real opposition party that Canadians trust. Steven Harper???? Not in this lifetime. The Gomery report comes out and since it doesn't attack Martin what does he do, Harper aatacks the RCMP! Dumb, dumb, dumb!
http://www.metronews.ca/news_detail.asp?id=11941 |
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Bulsajo
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Wed Nov 02, 2005 9:15 pm Post subject: |
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| Moldy Rutabaga wrote: |
| "Prime Minister" Martin, then one of the senior ministers in the government, knew nothing. How convenient. Chretien is not directly implicated. Crooks and thieves exonerate other crooks and thieves. |
Are you serious? If so, I can't think of anyone who *apparently* misunderstands what's happening more than you, Moldy. I guess you haven't been paying attention to Canadian Federal Politics for the last 5 years?
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| Martin promises to call an election after the second Gomery report is released, right after the Liberal government gets around to abolishing the GST as promised. What's to stop him from "calling" the election for a year later? |
Nothing except the polls and election laws. |
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Bob O.
Joined: 20 Oct 2005
Location: The 'San
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| Posted: Thu Nov 03, 2005 1:47 am Post subject: |
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| Octavius Hite wrote: |
| the reason the always win and will win again in the new year is because there is no real opposition party that Canadians trust. |
Yeah, I'd have to agree with you on that one... The Libs are definitely the lesser of the evils. It's frightening to think what the Conservatives would do in power. Especially with someone like Harper at the helm. Scary stuff.
I think a possible solution to this whole situation (being stuck with corrupt Liberals because the Conservatives are too far right; heading for an election less than 2 years later, likely with the same results) lies in an overhaul in out electoral system. It's time to get rid of the old 'first-past-the-post' system and introduce some sort of proportional representation. Personally, I'm not a big fan of the Liberals (and have never voted for them), but if I was in a riding where it was a tight race between the Liberal and the Conservative candiates, you can bet that I would be voting for the Liberal. That's a sh-ite electoral system, if you ask me. |
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Alias
Joined: 24 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Thu Nov 03, 2005 4:19 am Post subject: |
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| Moldy Rutabaga wrote: |
Canada's Watergate. I feel so proud.
Ken:> |
Nothing to be proud of for sure. Nothing to be ashamed of either. Considering this type of conduct goes on in other countries as well. Just makes one more cynical of politicians. |
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Moldy Rutabaga
Joined: 01 Jul 2003
Location: Ansan, Korea
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| Posted: Sat Nov 05, 2005 4:27 am Post subject: |
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Moldy Rutabaga wrote:
"Prime Minister" Martin, then one of the senior ministers in the government, knew nothing. How convenient. Chretien is not directly implicated. Crooks and thieves exonerate other crooks and thieves.
Are you serious? If so, I can't think of anyone who *apparently* misunderstands what's happening more than you, Moldy. I guess you haven't been paying attention to Canadian Federal Politics for the last 5 years? |
How so? I wrote his name in italics because he does not hold a majority government and doesn't deserve the title. I do not believe that a senior minister could possibly know nothing about what was happening. The government stole tax money and funneled it to the party. How is this a misunderstanding?
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Martin promises to call an election after the second Gomery report is released, right after the Liberal government gets around to abolishing the GST as promised. What's to stop him from "calling" the election for a year later?
Nothing except the polls and election laws. |
How so? There is no obligation to call an election before 2009, and there's no legal necessity for Martin to keep his promise. The Liberals are unlikely to care what polls say. As Octavius pointed out, there is hardly an effective opposition to face against, unless the Conservatives get their act together, or Quebecois separatism heats up again, as it apparently is-- see, I do know something about what's happened in five years.
Ken:> |
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Bob O.
Joined: 20 Oct 2005
Location: The 'San
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| Posted: Sat Nov 05, 2005 8:20 pm Post subject: |
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| Moldy Rutabaga wrote: |
Martin promises to call an election after the second Gomery report is released, right after the Liberal government gets around to abolishing the GST as promised. What's to stop him from "calling" the election for a year later?
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The fact that he's the leader of a minority government... that's what's to stop him. He has to keep at least one of the oppositon parties happy in order to keep his government. I suspect if he tried to renege, the opposition would hold him to his promise. |
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Bulsajo
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Sat Nov 05, 2005 10:22 pm Post subject: |
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| Bob O. wrote: |
| I suspect if he tried to renege, the opposition would hold him to his promise. |
They might not let him have a chnce to keep his promise...
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| How so? I wrote his name in italics because he does not hold a majority government and doesn't deserve the title. I do not believe that a senior minister could possibly know nothing about what was happening. |
It's entirely believable and even likely, given they way the people in the PMO were running the operation. You think because he was a finance minister he should have seen what was going on? and because he was a finance minister? Again I say- you're missing a fundamental dynamic of the liberal party and the cabinet. Gomery agrees, but I guess Gomery is just a stooge would be your answer. Obviously you're going to believe what you're going to believe. |
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Moldy Rutabaga
Joined: 01 Jul 2003
Location: Ansan, Korea
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| Posted: Sun Nov 06, 2005 1:04 am Post subject: |
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| You think because he was a finance minister he should have seen what was going on? and because he was a finance minister? |
Yes. I do believe that a competent (or honest) finance minister would notice millions of dollars disappearing from public accounts.
Nevertheless, you're right-- I'm not a finance minister, I wasn't there, and I don't know the full story. Martin may have been innocent. I'm simply skeptical of that, is all. I have no idea whether Gomery is also hiding the full story, or doesn't know, or if he's truthful.
Again, I think we're trusting souls, though, if we think the Liberals have no way out of keeping their election promise. They can make another deal with the NDP; some MPs can pull a Belinda Stronach to jig the numbers. But more realistically, I think they will simply delay as much as possible without antagonizing the opposition parties in hopes that the scandal will be forgotten, in hopes of reattaining a majority.
Ken:> |
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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| Posted: Sun Nov 06, 2005 3:25 am Post subject: |
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| Bob O. wrote: |
| Octavius Hite wrote: |
| the reason the always win and will win again in the new year is because there is no real opposition party that Canadians trust. |
Yeah, I'd have to agree with you on that one... The Libs are definitely the lesser of the evils. It's frightening to think what the Conservatives would do in power. . |
They've been in power before (70's and 80's). What did they do then that was so scary? The Liberals have been succesful because this is the kind of fearmongering that they have spread among the voters. "Vote for us, because the other guys are so bad." It's so sad to think that people keep voting PROVEN corrupt and money-wasting (think gun control program anyone) crooks back into power, because they are scared about what the other party MIGHT POSSIBLY do. The Charter of Rights and Freedoms is there to protect us. Anyway the Conservatives can't be possibly worse than the Liberals. They might even turn out to be better. One can only hope that the voters are finally tired of the Liberal arrogance.
What's to stop them doing it again and again if they keep being voted back into power? That's not democracy that's one party-rule. |
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mithridates
Joined: 03 Mar 2003
Location: President's office, Korean Space Agency
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| Posted: Sun Nov 06, 2005 6:52 am Post subject: |
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| TheUrbanMyth wrote: |
| Bob O. wrote: |
| Octavius Hite wrote: |
| the reason the always win and will win again in the new year is because there is no real opposition party that Canadians trust. |
Yeah, I'd have to agree with you on that one... The Libs are definitely the lesser of the evils. It's frightening to think what the Conservatives would do in power. . |
They've been in power before (70's and 80's). What did they do then that was so scary? The Liberals have been succesful because this is the kind of fearmongering that they have spread among the voters. "Vote for us, because the other guys are so bad." It's so sad to think that people keep voting PROVEN corrupt and money-wasting (think gun control program anyone) crooks back into power, because they are scared about what the other party MIGHT POSSIBLY do. The Charter of Rights and Freedoms is there to protect us. Anyway the Conservatives can't be possibly worse than the Liberals. They might even turn out to be better. One can only hope that the voters are finally tired of the Liberal arrogance.
What's to stop them doing it again and again if they keep being voted back into power? That's not democracy that's one party-rule. |
All true. I think it's funny too that people are afraid of a party that's been in power before and really didn't do anything extreme. Anybody who knows Canada knows that anything even remotely resembling the extreme right wing is political suicide.
Last election:
Conservative party: We believe in a woman's right to choose!
Liberal party: He thinks you should never ever get an abortion! Just because I say so!
Conservative party: Er, I said that a woman should be able to-
Liberal party: To not choose?! That's crazy right-wing talk! Don't vote for them!
Canadians:  They're so scary! Let's not vote for them! |
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