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George W. Bush...
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cubanlord



Joined: 08 Jul 2005
Location: In Japan!

PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2005 4:13 pm    Post subject: George W. Bush... Reply with quote

First off, I am an American, love my country, and if need be, would defend it if I had to.

However, in leu of recent readings, I must say that I cannot wait until the next election. In his first running for the Presidency, I was all for him. I am a republican (in that I feel WE, the people, should have control of our money, control over what doctor's we go to, etc.), but Bush has really given The States a bad rap. (especially, recently, with the KYOTO treaty).

Although a republican and a capitalist, I am ashamed of what he has done in the past few years. I am appauled that he would considered the "bottom dollar" over the environment; dumbfounded as to how I couldn't see this before. My only hope is that the next person in office well make every God giving effort to correct the atrocities Bush has put forth.

Opinions, remarks?
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Ya-ta Boy



Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: Established in 1994

PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2005 5:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Sometimes accidents really do happen



The sad and frustrating reality is that for the rest of your life when you are in a conversation with a foreigner, you will have Bush thrown in your face. It doesn't matter what your personal views are now or in the future. You will always be guilty of being an American because it fits their agenda. To get to know your views would require analytical thinking and that does not fit the agenda.
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hypnotist



Joined: 04 Dec 2004
Location: I wish I were a sock

PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2005 5:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ya-ta Boy wrote:

The sad and frustrating reality is that for the rest of your life when you are in a conversation with a foreigner, you will have Bush thrown in your face. It doesn't matter what your personal views are now or in the future. You will always be guilty of being an American because it fits their agenda. To get to know your views would require analytical thinking and that does not fit the agenda.


Please remember that the sad and frustrating reality is that for the last five years, and the next three, we foreigners are having Bush thrown in our face thanks to the voting decisions of Americans. If you think it's frustrating getting bitched at for Bush being El Prez when you voted for the other guy, try living with the effects of Bush when you had no say in it whatsoever.

However, as long as you elect someone better next time (or if, God forbid, you elect someone worse) I don't think Bush will continue to be an issue outside the US for very long after the next election.
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laogaiguk



Joined: 06 Dec 2005
Location: somewhere in Korea

PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2005 5:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ya-ta boy, you are doing the same thing you are complaining about (it's actually pretty funny the hypocricy in that post). If you don't want the rest of the world generalizing Americans as soon as they figure out you are American (which shouldn't be done) then don't generalize all the other foreigners as always going to do that.
I never ask "where are you from?" to people I just met. I try to find out if they are cool or jerks without any stupid stereotypes getting in the way.
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Gopher



Joined: 04 Jun 2005

PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2005 6:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Good post Ya-ta.

It seems to me that W. Bush is almost totally on the defensive these days, and is increasingly viewed as a lame duck president. And I'm pretty happy with this trend.

This notwithstanding, the international community continues to scapegoat the guy for all of their problems, past and present. It's absurd. Many seem to ascribe nearly unlimited powers to the White House.

I've been in disagreement with the Iraqi War from its beginnings, for example. Still, neither Iraq nor the Middle East at large was a happy, peaceful place before W. Bush "ruined their lives."

And Hypnotist seems to forget that Great Britain and Europe had their own fair share of self-inflicted issues and problems before W. Bush was elected over here and "imposed" onto all of those civilized people who have historically got on so well with each other.

Same goes for Latin America and nearly anywhere else in the world for that matter.

I'll cite Eric Clapton's wise words: "Before you accuse me, take a look at yourself." He's a British bluesman, isn't he?
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Yu_Bum_suk



Joined: 25 Dec 2004

PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2005 7:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I can think of nothing Americans could do to raise their standing in the world more than impeaching Bush. I think that during his first term, a lot of Americans really didn't realise just how (horribly) he comes across to non-Americans. Now it seems more of them do.
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SuperFly



Joined: 09 Jul 2003
Location: In the doghouse

PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2005 7:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You guys are really going to be pissed when Condy Rice gets elected CINC! Razz Razz
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Pligganease



Joined: 14 Sep 2004
Location: The deep south...

PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2005 7:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yu_Bum_suk wrote:
I think that during his first term, a lot of Americans really didn't realise just how (horribly) he comes across to non-Americans.


Most Americans don't give a rat's ass what non-Americans think. Haven't you figured that out yet?
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hypnotist



Joined: 04 Dec 2004
Location: I wish I were a sock

PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2005 7:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gopher wrote:
And Hypnotist seems to forget that Great Britain and Europe had their own fair share of self-inflicted issues and problems before W. Bush was elected over here and "imposed" onto all of those civilized people who have historically got on so well with each other.


Hey, hey, wait a mo. That's reading into my words a hell of a lot more than I said!

Bush has been a disaster for any supporter of multilateral, consensus-led international politics. That much is clear. The RoW has to live with his environmental scepticism, his devaluing of the NPT, his marginalising of the UNSC, and his failure to properly engage his Government in the Middle East (and it takes some humble pie for us Europeans to admit that realistically only the US is going to drive progress there).

I really don't understand the kind of bunker mentality on display here. You guys freely criticise the current US administration, and yet somehow it's none of our business?
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EFLtrainer



Joined: 04 May 2005

PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2005 8:37 pm    Post subject: Re: George W. Bush... Reply with quote

cubanlord wrote:
First off, I am an American, love my country, and if need be, would defend it if I had to.

However, in leu of recent readings, I must say that I cannot wait until the next election. In his first running for the Presidency, I was all for him. I am a republican (in that I feel WE, the people, should have control of our money, control over what doctor's we go to, etc.), but Bush has really given The States a bad rap. (especially, recently, with the KYOTO treaty).

Although a republican and a capitalist, I am ashamed of what he has done in the past few years. I am appauled that he would considered the "bottom dollar" over the environment; dumbfounded as to how I couldn't see this before. My only hope is that the next person in office well make every God giving effort to correct the atrocities Bush has put forth.

Opinions, remarks?


Welcome to the bandwagon. The more the merrier. However, the damage already wrought by actions past and present, and the failure to act on Kyoto, have already done their damage. We are now in a defensive posture with regard to the environment and the best we can hope for is urgent action to limit those long-term effects.

Ya-ta: Little harsh on the entire rest of the planet, don't you think, with regard to the use of logic?

Gopher: welcome back. I wonder if I shall ever see a post from you in response to any negative statement about the US that doesn't go off-topic into defensiveness... Not that it matters; just curious.
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Satori



Joined: 09 Dec 2005
Location: Above it all

PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2005 9:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pligganease wrote:

Most Americans don't give a rat's ass what non-Americans think. Haven't you figured that out yet?

Yes, I think the rest of the world has got that pretty much figured out now. You seem like you feel that is something to be proud of, you great pillock...
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bucheon bum



Joined: 16 Jan 2003

PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2005 9:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

new posters arise... cool.
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Pligganease



Joined: 14 Sep 2004
Location: The deep south...

PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2005 9:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Satori wrote:

Yes, I think the rest of the world has got that pretty much figured out now. You seem like you feel that is something to be proud of, you great pillock...
Laughing Does it bother you? I wasn't entirely proud of that fact, but maybe I should be? Should I curl up and cry like a baby that no one likes Bush, yet Brits still support Blair? Should I cringe at the fact that Canadian politicians scream profanities about the leaders of the United States?

Sorry to disappoint, but it ain't happening.

Hasn't anyone realized that non-Americans' screaming the evils of George Bush is what got him elected again? When Farenheit 911 came out, all it did was put the "red state" voters into a defensive position and make them turn out at the polls in droves? The French? Well, all I can say is that for most "red state" voters, whatever they say means they should say the opposite.
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hypnotist



Joined: 04 Dec 2004
Location: I wish I were a sock

PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2005 10:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pligganease wrote:
Satori wrote:

Yes, I think the rest of the world has got that pretty much figured out now. You seem like you feel that is something to be proud of, you great pillock...
Laughing Does it bother you? I wasn't entirely proud of that fact, but maybe I should be? Should I curl up and cry like a baby that no one likes Bush, yet Brits still support Blair? Should I cringe at the fact that Canadian politicians scream profanities about the leaders of the United States?

Sorry to disappoint, but it ain't happening.


I wouldn't care so much if Americans really didn't care (with the exception of one particular American, of course, who bloody well should care but doesn't). What gets me is when Americans are offended that those from outside would dare criticise their country - as if only Americans are allowed to criticise America.

Blair's approval rating is at -20% (% satisfied - % unsatisfied), by the way.
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Pligganease



Joined: 14 Sep 2004
Location: The deep south...

PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2005 11:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If your sister was a complete *beep*, and someone called her that, would you be offended?
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