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On the other hand
Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Location: I walk along the avenue
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 Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2006 6:04 am Post subject: US kidnapping insurgents wives |
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http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory?id=1550378
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WASHINGTON (Reuters) - U.S. forces in Iraq, in two instances described in military documents, took custody of the wives of men believed to be insurgents in an apparent attempt to pressure the suspects into giving themselves up.
Both incidents occurred in 2004. In one, members of a shadowy military task force seized a mother who had three young children, still nursing the youngest, "in order to leverage" her husband's surrender, according to an account by a civilian Defense Intelligence Agency intelligence officer.
In the other, an e-mail exchange includes a U.S. military officer asking "have you tacked a note on the door and challenged him to come get his wife?"
The documents were among thousands obtained by the American Civil Liberties Union from the government under court order through the Freedom of Information Act.
"This is not an acceptable tactic," ACLU lawyer Amrit Singh said on Friday, referring to seizing a wife to try to catch a husband, "nor are any of the other abusive techniques acceptable. We know that abusive techniques were employed in a systemic manner across Iraq, Afghanistan and Guantanamo Bay."
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A June 10, 2004, memo written by the DIA employee, labeled as "secret," referred to "violations of the Geneva Convention" relating to detainee abuse and illegal detention of noncombatants.
It described the actions of Task Force 6-26, which has been mentioned in other documents in connection with allegations of detainee abuse, and stated that on May 9, 2004, task force personnel detained the wife of "a suspected terrorist" in Tarmiya, Iraq.
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"During the pre-operational brief, it was recommended by TF (task force) personnel that if the wife were present, she be detained and held in order to leverage the primary target's surrender," the memo stated. Its author said that "I objected to the detainment of the young mother to the raid team leader" and "I believed it was a dead issue."
The memo stated that "I determined that the wife could provide no actionable intelligence leading to the arrest of her husband."
"Despite my protest, (the) raid team leader detained her anyway," stated the memo, whose author officially reported the incident within the chain of command. The memo said the wife was released two days later to the custody of a tribal sheik.
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igotthisguitar
Joined: 08 Apr 2003
Location: South Korea (Permanent Vacation)
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| Posted: Sun Jan 29, 2006 12:31 am Post subject: Re: US kidnapping insurgents wives |
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| On the other hand wrote: |
... took custody of the wives of men believed to be insurgents in an apparent attempt to pressure the suspects into giving themselves up.
Both incidents occurred in 2004. In one, members of a shadowy military task force seized a mother who had three young children, still nursing the youngest, "in order to leverage" her husband's surrender, according to an account by a civilian Defense Intelligence Agency intelligence officer.
"This is not an acceptable tactic," ACLU lawyer Amrit Singh said on Friday, referring to seizing a wife to try to catch a husband, "nor are any of the other abusive techniques acceptable. We know that abusive techniques were employed in a systemic manner across Iraq, Afghanistan and Guantanamo Bay." |
War is hardly a love-fest.
While these sort of underhanded tactics of skullduggery & hypocrisy are clearly quite morally repugnant, Bush & the New World Order neo-cons aren't exactly helping to orchestrate a tea party.
By hook or by crook ...  |
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BigBlackEquus
Joined: 05 Jul 2005
Location: Lotte controls Asia with bad chocolate!
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| Posted: Sun Jan 29, 2006 7:30 am Post subject: |
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It works quite well for Israel.
The terrorists are losing, anyway.
When the security forces are built up to a good enough level, and the US leaves, the "foreign fighters" will be turned in by Iraqis because they don't want outside Syrian/Iranian influence.
And most of them will likely be killed quite quickly. |
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On the other hand
Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Location: I walk along the avenue
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| Posted: Sun Jan 29, 2006 8:25 am Post subject: |
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It works quite well for Israel.
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Yeah, but Israel's goals in the occupied territories are somewhat different from America's in Iraq.
The Israelis aren't trying to increase their own popularity in Palestine. They know they're hated there and are simply concerned about making the area safe for Israelis. But in the case of Iraq, the USA is supposedly there to liberate the Iraqi people and build democracy. Kinda hard to convince people that that's what you're doing when the methodology employed involves kidnapping civilians and holding them hostage. |
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AbbeFaria
Joined: 17 May 2005
Location: Gangnam
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| Posted: Sun Jan 29, 2006 10:01 am Post subject: |
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If it works I think it's a great tactic. I have more sympathy for the spider I see crawling on my wall than I do for terrorists or the people who shelter them, wives included. Fighting a politically correct war only costs more American lives.
��S�� |
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bucheon bum
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Sun Jan 29, 2006 10:12 am Post subject: |
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| AbbeFaria wrote: |
If it works I think it's a great tactic. I have more sympathy for the spider I see crawling on my wall than I do for terrorists or the people who shelter them, wives included. Fighting a politically correct war only costs more American lives.
��S�� |
Keyword: if
I doubt it does, especially in the long-term. |
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bucheon bum
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Sun Jan 29, 2006 10:12 am Post subject: |
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| bucheon bum wrote: |
| AbbeFaria wrote: |
If it works I think it's a great tactic. I have more sympathy for the spider I see crawling on my wall than I do for terrorists or the people who shelter them, wives included. Fighting a politically correct war only costs more American lives.
��S�� |
Keyword: if
I doubt it does, especially in the long-term. |
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Yeah, but Israel's goals in the occupied territories are somewhat different from America's in Iraq.
The Israelis aren't trying to increase their own popularity in Palestine. They know they're hated there and are simply concerned about making the area safe for Israelis. But in the case of Iraq, the USA is supposedly there to liberate the Iraqi people and build democracy. Kinda hard to convince people that that's what you're doing when the methodology employed involves kidnapping civilians and holding them hostage. |
Exactly. Much different circumstances. |
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On the other hand
Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Location: I walk along the avenue
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| Posted: Mon Jan 30, 2006 1:10 am Post subject: |
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Brig. Gen. Janis Karpinski, the former military police commander at the Abu Ghraib Prison where American troops were accused of torturing prisoners, said detaining wives of suspected terrorists has been a part of the war in Iraq.
"The incidents I would be familiar with occurred in 2003, and there were at least a dozen — perhaps 15 or 20," she said. "I wouldn't say it was a common practice, but it was a practice for the higher value detainees"
Karpinski said she knew of only one incident where the tactic worked and analysts warn the tactic has potential pitfalls.
"If this doesn't end up actually being something that give you a key terrorist, the risk is you're going to alienate a lot of Iraqis," said ABC News analyst Tony Cordesman.
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http://www.abcnews.go.com/GMA/story?id=1553869 |
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igotthisguitar
Joined: 08 Apr 2003
Location: South Korea (Permanent Vacation)
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| Posted: Tue Jan 31, 2006 2:55 am Post subject: |
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| On the other hand wrote: |
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Brig. Gen. Janis Karpinski, the former military police commander at the Abu Ghraib Prison where American troops were accused of torturing prisoners, said detaining wives of suspected terrorists has been a part of the war in Iraq.
"The incidents I would be familiar with occurred in 2003, and there were at least a dozen — perhaps 15 or 20," she said. "I wouldn't say it was a common practice, but it was a practice for the higher value detainees"
Karpinski said she knew of only one incident where the tactic worked and analysts warn the tactic has potential pitfalls.
"If this doesn't end up actually being something that give you a key terrorist, the risk is you're going to alienate a lot of Iraqis," said ABC News analyst Tony Cordesman. |
http://www.abcnews.go.com/GMA/story?id=1553869 |
Gen. Karpinski has been making the rounds on internet radio talk-show circuit as of late.
Seems to be someone well worth listening to  |
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