|
Korean Job Discussion Forums
"The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Teachers from Around the World!"
|
| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
Teufelswacht
Joined: 06 Sep 2004
Location: Land Of The Not Quite Right
|
 Posted: Fri Feb 10, 2006 9:17 am Post subject: |
 |
|
| The Lemon wrote: |
I was hoping someone would answer my question.
But since you brought it up, what the CNN article didn't tell you was that those 3000 demonstrators (some reports say 10,000) are from the fringe fundamentalist PAS, the Islamic Party of Malaysia. It is a minor party in most of the country, except for two states in the rural northeast, near the Thai border. Electoral support for the PAS has been on the decline in recent years. It's notable that in a city of 4.2 million, they could only scrounge up 10,000 people to demonstrate.
CNN did publish some sensible comments from Malaysia's Prime Minister Badawi, a far more reasonable man than their last PM, Mahathir:
| Quote: |
At a nearby conference, Prime Minister Abdullah Ahmad Badawi spoke of a "huge chasm that has emerged between the West and Islam" and said many Westerners see a Muslim as "a congenital terrorist."
He said Muslims were particularly frustrated at Western policies toward Iraq, Afghanistan and the Palestinians. He did not mention the Mohammed cartoons.
"They think Osama bin Laden speaks for the religion and its followers," AP quoted Abdullah as saying. "The demonization of Islam and the vilification of Muslims, there is no denying, is widespread within mainstream Western society."
Abdullah also urged Muslims to oppose "sweeping denunciation of Christians, Jews and the West" as well as violence and terror perpetrated by fringe groups, AP reported.
Abdullah is a Muslim scholar, and his country heads the 57-member Organization of the Islamic Conference.
|
|
| Quote: |
I was hoping someone would answer my question.
|
My pleasure. The wife is out on a "girls night out" with friends so I was bored.
| Quote: |
| they could only scrounge up 10,000 people to demonstrate |
Maybe the rain was a contributing factor. It makes it hard to burn flags. What percentage of the city's population is ethnic Chinese (non-Muslim) or of Indian extraction (non-Muslim)? What percentage of the population is Christian or otherwise non-muslim but doesn't fit into the ethnic Chinese or Indian demographics? What is your source concerning the demonstration being made up of only PAS "loyalists" (for lack of a better term)? IMHO 10K is still a pretty good size.
| Quote: |
| a far more reasonable man than their last PM, Mahathir: |
Agreed. |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
bucheon bum
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
|
| Posted: Fri Feb 10, 2006 9:18 am Post subject: |
|
|
| 3,000 people. wow. impressive. less than .1% of the city's population. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
bucheon bum
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
|
| Posted: Fri Feb 10, 2006 9:22 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Teufelswacht wrote: |
Maybe the rain was a contributing factor. It makes it hard to burn flags. What percentage of the city's population is ethnic Chinese (non-Muslim) or of Indian extraction (non-Muslim)? What percentage of the population is Christian or otherwise non-muslim but doesn't fit into the ethnic Chinese or Indian demographics? What is your source concerning the demonstration being made up of only PAS "loyalists" (for lack of a better term)? IMHO 10K is still a pretty good size.
|
So 10K demonstrated and were angry about the cartoons. They burned flags. Big whoop.
Death to Israel is so 80s. Apparently these days some muslim brothas and sistas are nostaglic, especially Iran's President, whose attempt to be another Khomeini is rather pathetic. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
On the other hand
Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Location: I walk along the avenue
|
| Posted: Fri Feb 10, 2006 10:07 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: |
Death to Israel is so 80s. Apparently these days some muslim brothas and sistas are nostaglic, especially Iran's President, whose attempt to be another Khomeini is rather pathetic.
|
Yeah, I remember when Khomeini returned to Iran from Paris. I walked into my elementary school boot room next morning and said "yay Iran got their Shah back!"(at that time, a lot of people in my hometown seemed to think that "Shah" was Khomeini's title). It has to be said, there WAS a certain excitement and electricity surrounding the man. Even when public opinion swung against him, with the hostage crisis and whatnot, he still had a real "man you love to hate" quality about him. And he definitely knew what he was doing with the fatwa against Rushdie, nothing like tweaking the jet-set intelligentsia to make yourself look relevant again.
I agree, this new guy they got bites the hairy banana big time. He looks like a standup comic trying to do a "bumbling foreigner hits the big city" routine. Remember that Russian guy from the 80s, Yakov Shmirnov or whatever his name was? Vat a country!! |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
bucheon bum
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
|
| Posted: Fri Feb 10, 2006 11:34 am Post subject: |
|
|
| He still does shows in Branson, Missouri. At least according to a Simpson's episode. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Teufelswacht
Joined: 06 Sep 2004
Location: Land Of The Not Quite Right
|
| Posted: Fri Feb 10, 2006 6:32 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| bucheon bum wrote: |
So 10K demonstrated and were angry about the cartoons. They burned flags. Big whoop.
|
At the risk of getting down "in the weeds" on this issue, I would just like to know what, in your opinion, would be a respectable number. At what point does Malaysia "make it big" in the world of muslim protests? Just wondering. It seems Halifax made it with only 100 protestors so I wonder what is the magic number, or is it a magic percentage of the population?
Since KL is a relatively multi-ethnic city by muslim standards I was asking what part of the approximately 1.5 million citizens are NOT muslim. Then of the number of remaining citizens who are muslims, what percentage is 10K of the muslim population. Again, this was probably too far down in the weeds. It's really not worth pursuing - I'm getting bored with it myself. Its much more fun making sweeping generalizations and off-handed remarks, don't you think? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
The Lemon
Joined: 11 Jan 2003
|
| Posted: Fri Feb 10, 2006 10:29 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Teufelswacht wrote: |
| Since KL is a relatively multi-ethnic city by muslim standards I was asking what part of the approximately 1.5 million citizens are NOT muslim. |
4.2 million in metropolitan KL. And what does all of this matter, anyway? I thought we encouraged non-violent expression, and from all accounts, yesterday's event in KL was peaceful, even if their words weren't. And these are the country's "fringe", in the prime minister's words. Pretty tame, I'd say.
| Quote: |
| What is your source concerning the demonstration being made up of only PAS "loyalists" (for lack of a better term)? |
That it was primarily a PAS event was well-reported by Bernama and others, though not CNN. I don't think that's in dispute. But CNN's overlooking that fact in its report made it seem as though these were everyday ordinary Muslim Malaysians, which I think is why you brought it up in the context of my hypothetical guy in Ipoh.
Anyway, you actually didn't answer my question at all. No one did. I hope you'll agree that there's absolutely nothing in the reports about yesterday's event that has any bearing on my question at all, so let me re-state it.
I hope the anti-Islamists on the board who blame moderate Muslims for "allowing" the jihadists to destroy and kill will take it up:
--------
Say you live in Ipoh, Malaysia. You're Muslim. You're against violence of any kind and consider what the jihadists are doing to be a perversion of your religion. Shoot - you don't even consider them Muslim.
You're a peaceful person - maybe a teacher - and have lots of Chinese, Indian, and Western friends. You are in agreement with all your Muslim and non-Muslim friends, who all view the extremists to be a mortal threat to your religion, your nation, and the world. And you're not shy in saying so.
What do you expect Mr. Teacher in Ipoh, Malaysia, to do "in a heartbeat" so he won't have to shoulder the blame being placed on him by some guy on a Korean english teaching message board, just because he happens to be Muslim? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Teufelswacht
Joined: 06 Sep 2004
Location: Land Of The Not Quite Right
|
| Posted: Sat Feb 11, 2006 1:34 am Post subject: |
|
|
| The Lemon wrote: |
| Teufelswacht wrote: |
| Since KL is a relatively multi-ethnic city by muslim standards I was asking what part of the approximately 1.5 million citizens are NOT muslim. |
4.2 million in metropolitan KL. And what does all of this matter, anyway? I thought we encouraged non-violent expression, and from all accounts, yesterday's event in KL was peaceful, even if their words weren't. And these are the country's "fringe", in the prime minister's words. Pretty tame, I'd say.
| Quote: |
| What is your source concerning the demonstration being made up of only PAS "loyalists" (for lack of a better term)? |
That it was primarily a PAS event was well-reported by Bernama and others, though not CNN. I don't think that's in dispute. But CNN's overlooking that fact in its report made it seem as though these were everyday ordinary Muslim Malaysians, which I think is why you brought it up in the context of my hypothetical guy in Ipoh.
Anyway, you actually didn't answer my question at all. No one did. I hope you'll agree that there's absolutely nothing in the reports about yesterday's event that has any bearing on my question at all, so let me re-state it.
I hope the anti-Islamists on the board who blame moderate Muslims for "allowing" the jihadists to destroy and kill will take it up:
--------
|
Well, it seems we are talking past each other. Look again at my original comment. It was directed exclusively at your use of locations - remember? I thought it funny that on the day you posted the comment there was a sizeable demonstration in the very country you use as an example.
I did not answer your question about "in a heartbeat" because it was not asked in response to a comment I made. Your question was in response to a statement made by someone else - who, I thought, would probably answer it. I was trying to be polite. After all, your question is not all that thought provoking and, to be honest, I actually thought it was rhetorical when I first read it.
Oh yes, you clarify the 4.2 million metropolitan which includes the combined population of the state of Selangor. The figure I used was the population of KL - the city identified in the news report - which is approximately 1.5 million. But you are right, it doesn't really matter.
Thanks for the link about the PAS participation. One of my interests is how news is massaged depending on the target audience.
Take care.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kuala_Lumpur |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
|
|
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
