Korean Job Discussion Forums

[Gorgias]

The world is becoming more and more similar to Grandma's china cabinet. It's very hard to argue against those who want a cleaner, safer world, for it sounds very good-- until the world is the sterile inside of a hospital.

Hegel felt that Napoleon would bring the end of history: total uniformity: everyone would use the metric system, drive on the right side of the road and even capital punishment would be clean, efficient and rational. Well history went on, and Francis Fukuyama proposed that American suburbia would be the end of history. Non-homogeneity still exists, so the pasteurization of humanity is not yet complete.

But watch for it. When you leave an airport, and every sign is in English, and everywhere you look are malls selling the same Levis, and row housing, and the people are eating pizza-- and you aren't sure if you even left America.... That's 'democratization.'

Democracy isn't really about freedom and voting. What made Athenian democracy so successful wasn't the fact that some of them could vote, it was about a uniform military. Early shield factories made it possible for each hoplite to wear the same armor and carry identical arms. Working in unison, shields inter-locked, arranged in an orderly phalanx, the Athenian host was unbeatable to its hodge-podge, undisciplined enemies. So too, modern democracy relies on that same ancient spirit of standardization.

Let's take South Korea as an example of a country which is both less democratized and rated lower as a desirable place to live by the U.N., than are the English speaking, democratic countries. By comparison, Canada has been in the top three for years, the U.S. is number eight, and Britain is number twelve; South Korea is number 27.
Korea has only been free of its dictatorship since the mid-80's and will therefore serve as a perfect example to view the erosion of "freedom to" in the West.

-Koreans less often obey traffic laws. In other words, go through a red-light if it looks safe to you.
-Koreans do not always wear helmets when riding motorcycles. This was a big issue in the West a few years ago, after all, if I want to risk dashing my own skull, it's my freedom to do that.
-Motorcycles drive on the sidewalks, so do bicycles, watch yourself if you are a pedestrian.
-There is no sin tax in Korea: if I want to drink or smoke myself to death I can do that very cheaply.
-There is no capital-gains tax in Korea, everyone is free to get richer if they have the money to invest.
-Drunk-driving is a lesser offence, the president even grants amnesty to tjose who have lost their licenses every six months. Drunk-drivers, like pedophiles, are some of the most hysterically demonized criminals in Western society. If you are on, or near, the road, it is your responsibility to keep yourself safe.
-Koreans can buy alcohol in any corner store, this is also true of America, in Canada: the government has blocked the freedom of both the merchant and the consumer to sell and buy alcohol as they see fit.
-Needless to say, there are no rules against over-serving in bars. You are free to drink as you deem appropriate.
-Koreans may drink on the street. The government does not fear riot and rebellion if people have a drink on the beach or in a park.
-Korea has forty-two red-light districts. There are an uncountable number of hostess bars and massage parlors. People are free to engage in the trade of services as they think appropriate.
-The police are neither feared nor respected. Koreans laugh at cops who try to ticket them or interfere in their business. It's the people who say: "Move along" to the police.
-Food safety laws are rather lax. This means you get food poisoning from time to time, but it prevents cases like this: the Trappist monks of central Canada have been prohibited from selling the cheese they have produced in the exact same manner for hundreds of years, because it does not meet present-day pasteurization standards. If I want to eat the monk's cheese, I should be free to take that risk. This goes the same for authentic Caesar dressing, which is currently banned from being served in restaurants in many Canadian provinces.
-In Korea, families are responsible for the bodies of their deceased relatives. The body is not confiscated by a coroner's office, and Koreans may bury the corpse generally on any mountain side they like.

The list goes on, and granted, Koreans do suffer under many authoritarian-style laws, and most of all: they suffer under the dictums of their own Confucian culture; however, as you can see, in the proto-democracy which is South Korea, the people still enjoy many "freedoms to" which have been withered away by the standardizing, protectionistic "freedom from" ideologies of Western democracies.

How is the health care system?

The WHO ranks Korea's health-care system number 58. America is 37, Canada is 30 and the UK is 18. Korean health-care is structured similarly to the American system: insurance is private, low income earners are entitled to limited no-cost service. Clearly, Korea's health-care system is behind those of the English speaking democracies. However, Korea has improved super-massively from the total devastation it suffered just fifty years ago.

No helmets?

Surprisingly, there is no relation between motorcycle helmet wearing and medical premiums. Delaware and Philadelphia in America do not require riders to wear helmets. Texas and Kentucky sell "exemption stickers." In Kentucky, motorcycle fatalities increased fifty percent and injuries thirty percent in the period: 1996 to 2002; during that time, helmet wearing rates fell by fifty percent. However, in America, regarding insurance premiums: "sometimes it goes up and sometimes it goes down." In Canada, while motorcycle helmet wearing rates now near one-hundred percent, the medicare budget increases annually: doubling between 1987 and 1997.

The question is: whether or not "freedom from" creates a better society?

Take one example: corporal punishment in schools. Korean teachers are free to administer corporal punishment to students, where as: students in Western countries are free from the same. Korean students top the OECD ranking in every category: math, reading, science and problem solving and have the lowest failure and drop out rate. Korea, Japan, Finland and Canada juggle for the top places in each category; America is well down the list. Canada and Finland have banned corporal punishment; Japan has too, however it is widely practiced there, while in Korea it is a standard classroom management tool. When funding is factored in, Korea does enormously well. The average Korean earns between one third to one half of what those do in the other just mentioned countries. The total Canadian federal government's budget is 350 billion dollars, Korea's is 135 billion. What, if anything, do children gain by being free from corporal punishment?

As for the low status of police in less democratized countries: Canada had 307,800 violent crimes in 2003, Korea: 305,500; Canada has a population of about 32 million, Korea almost 50 million. Obviously Canada has a significantly higher violent crime rate. Needless to mention America.

Perhaps you have heard stories of certain societies where if someone has, say, had a pig stolen from him, it is he, and not the thief who is punished. Why? Because the unlucky fellow who had his pig stolen is to blame for not having watched his property more carefully. Today, we enjoy laws which aim at making us free from, for example, theft; however, often these laws do little but needlessly limit our freedoms. Watch for these laws which seemingly protect us "from" some evil, while at the same time make us un-free "to" do the things that people in less lawful countries take for granted.

[Satori]

[billybrobby]

[Troll_Bait]

[Swiss James]

[Satori]

[Swiss James]

Er OK, here are a couple of things that make a pimp worse than a drunk driver-

Oh forget it.

No you're quite right, both of those types of people are far worse than mass murderers.

[Satori]

[Swiss James]

Here's a tip- if you're going to start acting like a total cock in a post where you call me "Mr Sarcastic" then don't write that entire post in a sarcastic manner.

Now then here's what I'm saying.

I think that a significant number (not all, not even necessarily a majority) of women who have a pimp are forced into prostitution by those men. Often through either physical or mental abuse.

Even assuming a woman who is being "turned out" started of her own free will, if she's making a good profit for her ponce I think she is unlikely to be free to stop doing what she's doing.
I think if she tries to stop being a prostitute, that man will probably at least threaten her, and- again this is my supposition- likely beat her.

Quite frankly, I think that pimps are scum who abuse women for money, and yet virtually any reference you are likely to see about them is positive- "Pimp My Ride", "P.I.M.P", Pimpjuice, Pimp cups the list google tosses up is huge.

On the other hand, I think it's fair to say that most people who get into a car after drinking don't plough into a bus stop full of nuns. I would guess that most people who drive after drinking get home safely.

Of course drink-driving is terrible, it's irresponsible, people die because of it (as they do when people make cell phone calls whilst driving- but that's another issue) but if I was to put it on a morality ladder along with pimping- I'd have the two pretty close together and not where society currently places them.

What percentage of drink driving incidents result in someone being harmed?
Is it a lesser number than the percentage of pimps who force their women into prostitution?
Would being forced to have sex for money count as 'harm'?

Neither drunk-driving nor paedophilia are good things. But societies hate for them is, when you compare it to some other things, disproportionate.

[krats1976]

OK, admittedly I got bored after the first couple of paragraphs, but this sounds to me like the anarchy rant that was so trendy back in high school.

[Satori]

[igotthisguitar]

http://www.theedgefiles.com/interviews/Clarified_The_Edge_Alan_Watt_First_Hour.mp3

http://www.theedgefiles.com/interviews/Clarified_The_Edge_Alan_Watt_Second_Hour.mp3

http://www.cuttingthroughthematrix.com/

[Ya-ta Boy]

I read the first two sentences and thought, "Hmmmm...this is odd." Then I saw Hegel and Napoleon and thought, "This is a pile of crap."

Kudos to those who got farther than I did. You are either more patient or have your BS detector set at a higher level than I do.

[Gorgias]

THE "END" OF FREEDOM?



Simply put, laws are sometimes enacted to protect society. Sometimes this is a good thing. But other times these laws restrict the normal and healthy freedoms of people. Laws exist that make us free from all sorts of misfortunes.

Imagine if a law were enacted that prevented people from going out on the streets at night: to protect us, and make us free from getting mugged.

That sounds a little crazy.

Why?

Because we try to be responsible and mind ourselves: avoid dark back-streets, don't carry too much cash around, maybe take a self-defense course. Most people are capable of being responsible. It's hard believe, but other people can act in a mature manner.

This issue effects the strong, who have their freedoms to curtailed, but much more importantly, it straight-jackets persons percieved as being weak. Returning to the example: many young people are perfectly capable of looking after themselves in a city after dusk. And yet curfews have been imposed on them in many Western cities. Believe it or not, many young people are able to fend for themselves. They don't need or want protection, particularly when it severely limits their autonomy.

This is a matter both of Trust, and of Responsibility. The strength to Trust that others will make prudent choices, and the Responsibility to make prudent choices ourselves.

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[Barking Mad Lord Snapcase]